Counting teeth is certainly a sure-fire method. However, you may be able to make it easier for yourself by finding them printed somewhere on the gears. However, the markings on older equipment is often not there, or rubbed off, or too covered in dirt. Anyway, for the chainrings (the gears at the front), it is normally marked on the inside of each ring (the side closest to the frame), but sometimes on the outside. For the cogs (the gears at the rear) they are written on the outside (facing away from the wheel). You may find several numbers, look for one with a 'T' following it; for example, "42T" would mean a 42 tooth chainring.

Looking for some road bike advice.

Back in the UK I used to ride a lot, mostly timetrials and riding for fun, and also some track racing (different subject altogether!) but haven't ridden for ages.

Now I'm over here and looking at the hills and the scenery I have this yearning to get back on the bike and get fit again.

I'm therefore looking to buy a cheap racing style bike (no cross or city types) to get me back out on 25-75km rides. I don't really want to spend much money though, 200CHF max, as I have bikes back in the UK which I would use when I go back there (and have no intention of shipping them over - can't be bothered with the hassle).

I've heard about the used bike sales in Helvetia Platz in Zurich, but are there any other good places to find cheap road bikes in Zurich? Anyone have any recommendations?

Well I also have a query about buying a bike..I picked up the hobby of biking in the last two years..During the last season I biked significantly across the National bike tracks on my sturdy Trekking bike which must be a good 17-20 kg I reckon.

Now for this season I want to switch to a lighter/faster road bike so I can add more climbing in my sessions, but i don't think I am yet comfortable using a bike with dropped handle bars, where firstly one has to bend his back a lot secondly the brakes are too far away from ones hand which I don't like.

I guess a bike with a larger frame and a high straight handle bar should suit me better. But I still want it to have slick tires and be light.

I will be happy if I get opinions from the experienced amongst you about such a choice and also from where I can get such a similar bike.

To be honest 200CHF for a bike that you want to do 75km on... ...you get what you pay for and at 200CHF you are not going to get anything very efficient! You might be lucky at the bike sales you mentioned. I have heard of people getting some amazing deals at them but you need to be lucky. Another option is a mountain bike I regularly do 75km and more on a full suspension bike, and it allows to get into even more scenic places then a road bike does.

Rahul, if you are coming from a 17 to 20kg bike a 10 to 12 kg bike will seem incredibly light. Based on what you are saying about handlebars etc I would recommend you to get a fairly reasonable mountain bike. You could get a 12kg hardtail secondhand for a fairly reasonable price. This will have easier handling characteristics, better braking, more comfortable riding position, will have lower ratio gears so make climbing less stressful... infact it covers all of the bases you mentioned in your post. You can put 1.5 inch slick tires on it and pump them up to near road bike pressure if you feel you really need to and on the areas of the national bike routes where there are some unpaved sections it will be a lot more comfortable.

It definitely sounds like a used bike is the way to go for you. Check out the links and info that I put in the "Buying a Used Bike" section of my "Cycling in Switzerland" thread. Enjoy the riding!

It sounds to me like you need one of what is quickly becoming a popular style of bike - the 'straight-bar road bike'. You are not the only person out there that wants the light-ness and efficiency of a road bike but doesn't like the riding position too much, and so over the past few years companies have started to produce models that fit these needs. Here is an example from Trek, they are basically a road bike made with a few more comfort-oriented components and straight handlebars. You'd probably be looking at a weight of 8-12 kg for this style of bike, depending on how much cash you wanted to spend, and how road- vs trail- worthy you want it.

I would recommend this over a hardtail mountain bike fitted with slick tyres for several reasons. First, the front suspension fork on the mountain bike will add a considerable amount of weight, and will give minimal advantages if you're mainly riding on the roads. Second, the gearing on mountain bikes is not appropriate for road-riding. That is, the front chainrings are too small to get any decent high gears, and the rear cogs are spaced too far apart to keep a consistent cadence (rate of turning the pedals). Although you may not want/need full road gearing (biggest front chainring 50-52 teeth), I would at least recommend a 'trekking' crankset (biggest chainring 46-48 teeth), like on the Trek bike that I linked to; mountain bike chainrings have a biggest ring of 42-44 teeth, which you'll quickly find to be too small on the roads. Third, a straight-bar road bike should probably have tyres that are between 28mm and 35mm wide (1 1/8 to 1 3/8 inches), which are plenty good enough for gravel tracks, and would be able to do all of the off-road sections of the national bike routes that I've seen.

One general comment on straight-bar road bikes. I've heard that they are quite successful at getting people into road biking that have previously been put off by the riding position of a true road machine. In fact, almost too successful for the bike's own good, because many people who buy them decide that they like it so much they want a real road bike, with drop bars, even skinnier tyres, etc. They then buy a second bike, and the straight-bar bike doesn't get used very much. With some of these bikes, it is possible to convert them later to put drop-bars on them, but sometimes the frame geometry is not appropriate to make the conversion. You may therefore also want to consider a type of bike that is intermediate between these two, a cyclo-cross bike.

Here is a popular example of a cyclocross bike from Kona bikes. It fits your criteria because it still has strong brakes ("cantilever" style) and reasonable tyres that can be taken on gravel paths and light trails when necessary (its actually made for an odd form of racing done in the autumn/fall over very mixed terrain and surfaces, see photos here, here, and here). These bikes normally come with "bar top" levels - in addition to the normal road brake levers, small brakes levers are attached to the top of the handlebars to be used when riding in the upright position. The Kona bike that I linked to has them, but they're not very easy to see in that photo, so see this close-up (they are also known as top mount brake levers, inline brake levers, and cross-top brake levers). I have a pair of these on my drop-bar touring bike, and I like them a lot. One thing about the gearing on cyclocross bikes, the rear cassette is normally a regular road-oriented cassette which you would want, but the front chainrings are sometimes a double that has an odd combination of sizes, used only for this style of racing (a 38-46 combination, or something similar). If you get a bike like this, make sure that it comes with a road triple (like the Kona bike that I lnked to) or a trekking triple crankset, not the cyclocross double.

Time to revive this thread, now that I'm seriously considering getting a racer (around 2000-3000CHF).

Cyclo-cross:
So far it seems to me that I should get a cyclo-cross. My reasons are (as someone said above) that I won't do racing and I want to be able to go through gravel roads when I feel like it.
How well does a cyclo-cross handle off road?
Do you get a lot of drag from the knobbly tires compared to pure road bikes?

Gears:
After reading a *lot* of opinions on this, I think I'll get a triple.
It seems that Shimano triples tend to be problematic and that I should prefer Campagnolo triples. Any opinions on this?
Cassette range? (10 speeds)

Crank:
170 or 175?

Or maybe I should do more cycling than thinking?

Since that is what they are partly designed for, you shouldn't have a problem unless you try to hit some serious singletrack or technical downhilling. It won't be quite as comfy as a mountain/trail bike but it will be faster.

That would depend on the exact tyre, and there is a lot of variation in cyclocross tyres from those that are only a tiny bit wider and more grippy than true racing tyres to those that aren't very different from a mountain bike tyre. I would choose your tyres independently of the bike, and for that price of bike, the dealer should be prepared to let you switch the stock tyres for whatever else you want before buying it and only pay the difference in the value (if there is any). If you're only planning to ride on the occasional rough trail, you want pretty good puncture resistance, and a tyre that will last a long time, then I recommend the Contact tyre from Continental. I've run the 32mm wide version of those on a commuter/hybrid and on a touring bike for a couple of years and have been very pleased (and before that I used several tyres of the previous model, the "Top Touring 2000"). Although they're officially 32mm, I've seen them listed as being effectively 28mm wide. They don't add much rolling resistance, but they do add a bit of weight compared to something built for racing.

I'm not certain what you mean here, what are the disadvantages of Shimano compared to Campy that you've heard? I do prefer the Campy shifter for the triple because I'm told that there is more possibility to adjust the front derailleur to overcome chain rub. I run Shimano triples, but my solution to this problem is on two bikes with drop handlebars I use an old-school down-tube shifter for the front derailleur instead of the integrated brake/shifter (just like Lance Armstrong used to on mountainous stages because it also saves weight) and on bars with straight handlebars I use a SRAM grip-shift, each of which have a continuous range of position adjustment (non-indexed). However, with drop handlebars, the down-tube shifter isn't a solution for everyone (in fact, it seems to be just Lance and I), most people prefer not to move their hands from the bars to shift, and many modern frames don't have the right mount for a down-tube shifter. Therefore, if you want an integrated shifter/brake and good control of the front derailleur then Campy may be a better option than Shimano. The big disadvantage I find with Campy is that parts are not as widely available and they are not so compatible with parts from other manufacturers.

10 speeds on the back are certainly the standard now for this kind of bike. As far as range, see my comments above regarding my favorite combination, the SRAM 12-26. The crank length and frame size normally go together, and so the standard crank length for your chosen frame size should be appropriate for you. I would only change it if you have a really strong preference for a certain length and you have a good reason to think differently than the manufacturer.

Best of luck finding the right bike!

Thank you so much for your thorough response. I read this really huge thread: http://forums.roadbikereview.com/showthread.php?t=61840
on compacts vs triples, and it seemed to me that Shimano triples tend to be flaky (chain comes off or shifting is not reliable) and that I should prefer Campagnolo (even then, it was a controversial opinion).

I will read the thread again, and your post, and let you guys know

Stop this triple nonsense. Unless you're 150 kilos get a compact or indeed just a normal chainset with a small little ring and a 27 tooth on the back, your bike will look nicer and it'll be all the gears you need.

Well, ChrisW made a really good case above on why I should get a triple; I'm afraid three lines of unsupported "nonsense" won't cut it.

Personally I don't see why I should not get a triple; it's just one more disk, and in the worst case I won't use it. My thinking was that I don't really know much about road bikes so I might as well give myself as much versatility as possible.

How exactly would a triple make a bike look ugly?

Go with a triple if that's what you feel suits you best. I just bought a road bike and had the same triple/compact/normal issue. In the end I just bought a good value for money bike, turns out it has a normal 39/53 crankset so I will swap it for a compact at some point. For the moment I'm going to use the heavier gears as a type of contrast training to mountainbiking.

My personal thinking is that if you come from a MTB background or are going to do very long days with lots of climbing then its probably well worth having the triple. You will know your requirements best, take the advice here that is supported with experience, apply it to your own requirements and you won't go wrong.

I'm really happy with my purchase, but my requirements for a road bike was just to get a few extra clicks in on the evenings when I have no-one to go trail riding with, or the trails are too wet to ride.

Hi ChrisW,

The Trek roadbike you recommend has got me dreaming of doing some trips round the lake or up to St.Cergue - any ideas about the cheapest way to get one in Switzerland?

Thanks

Chester

just a note about the mavic wheelsets, I had a spoke come loose pretty quickly and although the bike shop fixed it it came loose again, and again.. and etc.

I'm going to switch back to regular wheels (I think the spoke nipples are soft alloy?), so would go for an open pro wheel set with plain gauge spokes.

I don't rate them at all, stick with campy hubs, dt spokes, mavic rims... my 2c

Sorry, I don't have any great advice for you. If you want a new one then it will be hard to pay less than the recommend price because the dealers don't have much of a profit margin on new bikes, but make sure that you get a discount on any accessories that you buy at the same time (which is quite standard). You cannot buy a new Trek online,. Instead, given the strong Swiss franc currently, maybe you'll find that the standard price in another country that you can visit personally works out cheaper right now than the standard Swiss price. However, if you get the bike from a shop that is a long way away then getting after-sales service will be difficult, and you'll have to try to get it past the Swiss border guards without paying a second lot of tax on it.

The only way to get a serious discount on a new bike from a dealer is to get one at the end of the season, when next years models are starting to arrive and they are trying to shift the old bikes. This is particularly true if the next model is radically different, which is how I got a new bike at almost 25% discount last November. However, this option is only possible if you're looking for a common frame size (I only saw bikes in the range of 54cm to 58cm when I was looking for a road bike on discount last year).

Thank you very much for your reply Chris. I will check out the bike shops in Geneva.

All the best

Chester

my gorgeous shiny new road bike will arrive any day now - not before time, that'll teach me to go for a flashy colour that wasn't in stock!
Went for a canyon with triple, in the end http://www.canyon.com/_en/roadbikes/index.html?b=33

Anyway, it'll have no pedals. Any recommendations? i like my mtb spd's as I can get out easily but don't seem to have as easy a job on the ones on the road bikes I have been riding even though they all seem to be Shimano and have them set as loose as possible. My track stand is pants, so getting out quick is crucial as don't want to scrape the paint work within the first week.

p.s. good luck to all those doing the Lac Leman thingy.

I use the exact same pedals on my road bike as my mountain bike. I mainly use the road bike to train for mountain biking so I see an advantage to keeping the set ups relatively similar. I can also get away with using the same shoes as my MTB shoes are fairly similar to road shoes. I haven't noticed any disadvantages yet with using mountain bike SPD's on the road bike. If you really wanted to Shimano even make a one sided road pedal with the mountain cleat. Its a little lighter then the standard mountain pedals but other then that I can't see any difference.

The pedals I am using on both bikes are the Shimano PD-M770 which are the new XT pedals and I am really happy with them.

You mean you went for puke green?! Just kidding :-) It looks like a nice ride. Getting mine in a week or so, from competitivecyclist.com: http://www.bmc-cycling.com/images/zoom_cx01.jpg
Also with a triple! It's quite ironic how I got a Swiss bike (with an Italian gruppo!) from an American company, as the price was quite lower there...

If you wanna go for a ride let me know!

Congrat's everyone for their new steeds!

I started using Shimano mountain-bike style SPD pedals for the road just so that I only needed one pair of shoes for both disciplines. However, this year I got a new pair of road shoes but decided to again for for the mountain-bike cleat system because then you can get a pair of shoes that you can actually walk in a little when off the bike. As Eire mentioned, Shimano make a road pedal for their MTB cleat system (single-sided), called the A520, which are about 100 CHF RRP, but you can get them from 60 if you look around. That is what I use, and have had no problems with them. They also make an A530 now, which gives you a small flat platform on the non-cleat side of the peddle, but this seems like unnecessary extra weight and bulk to me (and may decreases the clearance of the inside peddle when peddling around corners with the bike leaned over, although I haven't tested this).