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  #21  
Old 27.02.2008, 07:57
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

As someone who spent 15 years skiing, switched to boarding for 8, and am now a telemark skier there are a lot of things to tackle here...
  1. Overall snowboard boots are more comfortable. Not always and not for all people, but in general this seems true. That said:
    1. Ski boots shouldn't hurt. If they do, try other ones. Sooner or later you will find goodness. I have wide feet and my Garmont tele boots work great.
    2. Snowboard boots vary greatly in stiffness and change depending on which bindings you use. I *hated* getting in and out of bindings so I used K2 Clickers. I also like a very stiff, carving ride so I wound up with boots that were very stiff also. (side note: I never see click-in bindings and never understood why more boarders didn't adopt them)
  2. Skiing and boarding prefer different terrain. A looooong cat-track is no big deal for skier, you lean into your boots and chill out. For a snowboarder this is a great chance to catch an edge, crash, and walk. On the other hand when the snow is thick and soft I much prefer my snowboard; some days you just feel like surfing Neither is better or worse, just different and expect to spend some time finding the terrain to suit the gear.
  3. Skiing and snowboarding also use different geometry. Hard to describe but one of the reasons for the perennial "snowboarders are jerks" meme is snowboarders turn in different arcs and tend to need to sit and rest from time to time. This leads to the "why do snowboards stop and sit in the middle of the run" gripe (which is legit, I wish snowboarders would stop on the edge of the run).
Definitely wear a helmet; catching that back edge is part of the learning process. If you decide not to wear wrist-guards then make sure to keep your hands in a fist, it will really help those first few days to keep the fingers from bending backwards on the inevitable frontside crashes.

And overall just have fun. Skiing is great, boarding is great too.
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  #22  
Old 27.02.2008, 08:07
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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I never see click-in bindings and never understood why more boarders didn't adopt them
Most good snowboarders I know who have tried them say that they are rubbish.
  1. You have to buy specific boots that match the binding, whether they fit right or not.
  2. However stiff the boot is, there is always more movement and less control than with strap on bindings.
  3. The smallest amount of snow or ice on the bottom of your boot or in the binding and they won't click in. Significantly worse than ski bindings in that respect.
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  #23  
Old 27.02.2008, 08:55
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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Most good snowboarders I know who have tried them say that they are rubbish.
  1. You have to buy specific boots that match the binding, whether they fit right or not.
  2. However stiff the boot is, there is always more movement and less control than with strap on bindings.
  3. The smallest amount of snow or ice on the bottom of your boot or in the binding and they won't click in. Significantly worse than ski bindings in that respect.
I was lucky, the K2 boots were the best fit. The standard bindings also wound up *killing* my feet since I had to ratchet them down to get the right control. Of course everyone is different. I tried the type with the pins in the middle of the boot (Rossignol?) and those were terrible, you could rock 2-3 cm back and forth without engaging the edges.

I'd heard about the snow/ice thing but where I snowboarded (US, Pac NW) the snow is so wet and slushy it never stuck.

In any event.... for those who have not tried them, the K2 Clicker system was great for me. If the boot fits, give them a chance. I really liked being able to click on the lift and take off immediately.
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  #24  
Old 27.02.2008, 10:55
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

Don't even think about click in bindings for a snow board if you ever have any aspirations of going off piste... The first time you have to take your board off and dig yourself out you will have serious problems getting back into the bindings as the powder snow compresses and freezes into the binding.
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  #25  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:00
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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Don't even think about click in bindings for a snow board if you ever have any aspirations of going off piste... The first time you have to take your board off and dig yourself out you will have serious problems getting back into the bindings as the powder snow compresses and freezes into the binding.
Agreed + the click in bindings require you to have all the support on the boot, which makes the boot more painful and like a ski boot. + I never felt as secure using them.
I have used Flow bindings now for a few years and love them, easy to get in and out and just as good as strap bindings, except I don't have to sit down to put them on.
People tell me they are not as responsive as strap bindings, having used both I consider that tosh...maybe if I was a world class boarder I would notice the difference, and for that 10% of boarders then straps are probably better, for everyone else I would recommend flows.
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  #26  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:28
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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(side note: I never see click-in bindings and never understood why more boarders didn't adopt them)
I concur. I have some Burton SI boots and bindings and they're awesome. Unfortunately Burton doesn't make them any more .
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  #27  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:29
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

I was a skier, not good, but fast - the theory being that nobody would be able to critique my technique if I were just a blur

I switched to boarding 2 years ago after I met my husband, he looks so elegant on a board, not all skater-mo-fo. As mentioned in above posts, I spent the best part of my first 2 days on my arse, absolutely livid. (Very vain, like to be good at stuff.) But even whilst swearing hard enough to vaporize the snow around me and pointing furiously at passing skiers "I can do THAT!" I liked boarding instantly and I'll never go back to skis.

I have a reconstructed knee and wear a brace, it's much better for me to have both feet strapped to one slippery thing. I also have some calcification on the top of my (long ago broken) foot which makes ski boots very uncomfortable, but boarding boots are great. Mine are Vans, I LOVE them. I wear modified motocross armor, which looks a little robo-cop, but I can't afford to break any more bones and the armor enables me to cartwheel alarmingly down the slopes without incurring major bruising.

I highly recommend padding, boarding ceases to be fun when all you are doing is trying not to fall down and hurt yourself again. Falling is inevitable until you get the hang of the edge thing - primarily not catching the wrong one. Lessons are a REALLY good idea. I learned from my (then) boyfriend, he was amazingly patient, but I wasn't sure our relationship would survive the ordeal. Being able to ski did not help me in the least when learning to board. Like, if you can shoot pool you don't assume you'll be ace at darts just because you play both games in a pub...

My advice: Plan on two or three days of pain and frustration, and a very sore backside. If you have good core muscles, quads and triceps that will really help you get started. When you get tired don't push it - go for a Schümli Pflümli and a rest. Know that it will get better, and when it does you'll wonder why you didn't switch years ago!

Good Luck!
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  #28  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:30
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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Don't even think about click in bindings for a snow board if you ever have any aspirations of going off piste... The first time you have to take your board off and dig yourself out you will have serious problems getting back into the bindings as the powder snow compresses and freezes into the binding.
It's not so much that the snow fouls the click-in bindings (although some designs are more prone to this than others), more than it's hard to get enough down-pressure in powder to "click in".
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  #29  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:31
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

One more thing... Hubbie uses "Flow" bindings and loves them, he used to have clickers, but likes these better. I would recommend standard bindings as a beginner though, unless your balance and coordination is far superior to mine. Which, come to think of it, is very probably the case!
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  #30  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:35
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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It's not so much that the snow fouls the click-in bindings (although some designs are more prone to this than others), more than it's hard to get enough down-pressure in powder to "click in".
Oh believe me I have seen powder freeze these puppies solid and lead to a very unsatisfied chap swearing and blinding at his bad choice! (not sure if that was the choice of bindings or the choice to go off piste!!!)
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  #31  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:43
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

ah shite.

I'm an avid skiier who has been fascinated by snowboarding for years and this damn post has now pushed me over the edge.

Crap, now I have to rent another set of gear and go spend some time on my a$$ and try this out.
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  #32  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:49
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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this damn post has now pushed me over the edge.

D
Welcome to the dark side
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  #33  
Old 27.02.2008, 11:57
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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Agreed + the click in bindings require you to have all the support on the boot, which makes the boot more painful and like a ski boot. + I never felt as secure using them.
This is not completely accurate. Some systems have the highback integrated into the boot, but there are systems where the highback is part of the binding. This makes the click-in boots really no different to regular boots.

The Flow bindings you mentioned are probably the best of the current systems, if for no other reason than they don't require special boots. Since Burton no longer make the SI system that I have (and like), I suspect my next set of boots and bindings will be built around them.

However, I heartily recommend click-in bindings to anyone who doesn't go off-piste much. The extremely tangible convenience benefits more than outweigh hand-waving about "control".
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  #34  
Old 27.02.2008, 12:26
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

Agree completely with AbFab regarding getting properly fitting ski boots. Get yourself to a real bootfitter (not some kid that works at Ochsner or some other mall sporting good shop). I can recommend one in the Luzern area if interested. If the salesman doesn't check the fit of your foot inside the boot shell (no liner) first, then find another shop. I also recommend custom footbeds.

Expect to go back to the bootfitter for fine tuning a few times as well. Don't make the mistake of getting something that is loose just to make it comfortable. The liners will pack out and you'll be swimming in your boots after a few days. Always err on the too-tight side as the bootfitter can punch or grind the shells to make them fit but can't make them smaller.

This season, I went with the following boots:

http://www.strolz.at/

Custom foam-injected liners with a custom footbed. Perfect fit leaving the shop. A bit more expensive (900 CHF) but worth it for me.

Regarding transitioning to snowboarding; go for it if it suits your style. The transition won't be that difficult. For me, I prefer skiing as I like to ski off-piste in places with potentially long traverses or flat runouts that make snowboarding more work.
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  #35  
Old 27.02.2008, 19:31
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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You have to buy specific boots that match the binding, whether they fit right or not.
There always wide range of boots for each binding, however. It's not like there's a single boot model to go with that one binding.

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However stiff the boot is, there is always more movement and less control than with strap on bindings.
This is probably the most disingenuous of all the arguments against them. It's like saying you'll get less control when locked into your ski bindings than you would if you strapped yourself on with some cords.

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The smallest amount of snow or ice on the bottom of your boot or in the binding and they won't click in. Significantly worse than ski bindings in that respect.
This depends a lot on the mechanism. I've never had any problems worth talking about with my click-ins.

Now, there *are* disadvantages to click-in bindings, especially if you want to venture off-piste into powder (but realistically most people don't do this). IMHO opinion, however, the vastly greater convenience of "clicking in" over "strapping in" more than outweighs them, especially if you'll be spending time with people who are skiing.
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  #36  
Old 27.02.2008, 20:58
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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if you want to venture off-piste into powder (but realistically most people don't do this).
You might be surprised at how many people venture off piste these days. Even if it is just a run beside the piste, but many people are doing it.
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  #37  
Old 27.02.2008, 21:43
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Re: Skier to Snowboarder, the transition...

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You might be surprised at how many people venture off piste these days. Even if it is just a run beside the piste, but many people are doing it.
Well if it's just a bit off the side of the piste, the problems don't really apply, since you can just make your way over to the piste anyway (which the average punter will likely need to do, since standing back up in powder ranges from hard to impossible).
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