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Old 29.11.2012, 17:50
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Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

I know that there's several bikers on this forum, so you can help by signing this petition.

In the current infrastructure of the Swiss road network, guardrails are unfortunately too often the theater of human drama for drivers of motorized two-wheelers and their passengers, their families and loved ones. We still had a sad demonstration dated Saturday, November 24, 2012, where one of us was involved in a road accident in the town of Cousset (Fribourg) and fatally struck the pole fixing the slide safety.

En l'état actuel des infrastructures du réseau routier suisse, les glissières de sécurité ne sont malheureusement que trop souvent le théâtre de drames humains pour les conducteurs de deux-roues motorisés, leurs passagers, leurs familles et leurs proches. Nous en avons encore eu la triste démonstration en date du samedi 24 novembre 2012, où l'un des nôtres fut victime d'un accident de la route dans la commune de Cousset (Fribourg) et heurta mortellement le poteau de fixation de la glissière de sécurité.

I post this because I'm a biker, my brother is a biker and friends are bikers too.

It's written in French.

http://www.change.org/fr/p%C3%A9titi...outier-suisse#

Thank you.
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Old 29.11.2012, 18:10
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

Guardrail known as armco to the Brits.
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Old 29.11.2012, 19:29
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

I remember another biker being killed as they slid into the barrier earlier this year. I think it was discussed on EF somewhere.
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Old 29.11.2012, 20:00
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

i ride a lot and am aware of the dangers, but the petition can be the largest in the world, they are not going to change them to a wall type or remove them.
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Old 29.11.2012, 20:06
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

Frankly, it's not barriers that kill bikers, it is bikers using barriers to stop. Or any other road furniture.....should signs and lights be banned too?

I am a biker. I've slid along tarmac (my fault) and been hit by another vehicle (not).

And I'm sure more bikers are killed in SMIDSY situations.
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Old 29.11.2012, 20:38
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

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i ride a lot and am aware of the dangers, but the petition can be the largest in the world, they are not going to change them to a wall type or remove them.
In France a lot of Armco is being replaced by those concrete safety walls with bikers in mind I do believe. So it's a bit defeatist to say nothing will ever happen.
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Old 29.11.2012, 21:56
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

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In France a lot of Armco is being replaced by those concrete safety walls with bikers in mind I do believe. So it's a bit defeatist to say nothing will ever happen.
Plus I see more and more of these (or similar) popping up in Switzerland.
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Old 30.11.2012, 09:01
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

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Plus I see more and more of these (or similar) popping up in Switzerland.


I had an unplanned personal interface with one of those some years back (in France). As it happened the lower bit didn't help, 'cos I was flying through the air backwards and upside-down at the time, and hit (and broke) my back on the main bit of Armco. Pretty sure the lower bit didn't do anything to reduce any possible head injury, as there was no sign of impact on the helmet, but I suppose it's possible that it may have.

EDIT: Actually, on closer examination it wasn't quite like that. The flat bit below the armco was flush with it, rather than forward of it as in the picture, and of quite a flimsy material, desinged only to stop things slipping under it rather than to manage impact as such. In my case the design pictured may very well have made things worse by causing massive head impact instead.

In any case, the question's been addressed - the problem is not the armco, it's the fact of the bike and/or not being in the right place, i.e. firmly on the road, that causes the problem. I might argue that without the armco I'd be living a pain-free existence now, but who knows? It's entirely possible that if I'd continued my trajectory into the field instead I might have impaled myself on a fence post or something.

But one thing is clear - it was me who lost control of the bike, it was me who was riding it at about three times the legal limit, it was me who'd boasted only a few days earlier about treating all public roads as "my own personal racetrack". I can't blame the armco any more than I could blame the designers at Suzuki for making a bike that would easily do that speed.
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Old 30.11.2012, 09:20
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

It's clear you want to avoid these things. Going over can't be fun.



Lots more of this type of "event" here: http://www.youtube.com/user/rnickeymouse
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Old 30.11.2012, 09:26
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

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In France a lot of Armco is being replaced by those concrete safety walls with bikers in mind I do believe. So it's a bit defeatist to say nothing will ever happen.
Ok I'm not a biker so help me out. How is a concrete barrier less painful or awful than the Armco?
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Old 30.11.2012, 09:28
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

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In France a lot of Armco is being replaced by those concrete safety walls with bikers in mind I do believe. So it's a bit defeatist to say nothing will ever happen.
there are quite a few campaigns going on in an attempt to persuade the government to replace the barriers with a "biker friendly" version.

as im a cynical old t**t (edited for the easily offended on here) i ask myself if they are being replaced with bikes in mind why all the ongoing petitons/campaigns if something is being done ?

It has nothing to do of course that a concrete barrier is quicker and cheaper to install and requires less maintenance and is replaced easier , if needed at all, in the event of an crash.

Downside of concrete barriers for cars is the scoop at the bottom which tends to flip the car.... from what i have seen.

maybe i am defeatist but i say that because motorcyclists are an extreme minority, and its all down to cost per life risk assesments.... sadly

defeatist, yes probably right
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Old 30.11.2012, 09:32
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us


This shows a low-speed person-gap incident. That's about 15mph once he's surfed the tarmac for a little bit....
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Old 30.11.2012, 09:34
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

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Ok I'm not a biker so help me out. How is a concrete barrier less painful or awful than the Armco?

armco has all the support posts or the newer version is made of wires... if someone comes off they mostly slide along the road, if you hit a post then everything breaks or your arm or legs are left hanging by bits of skin due to the "cheesewire" effect of new barriers. if its a solid wall you are deflected off it rather than wrapping around it.

watch this and it will explain most things...

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Old 30.11.2012, 21:53
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Re: Petition for the bikers - guardrails are killing us

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I know that there's several bikers on this forum, so you can help by signing this petition.

In the current infrastructure of the Swiss road network, guardrails are unfortunately too often the theater of human drama for drivers of motorized two-wheelers and their passengers, their families and loved ones. We still had a sad demonstration dated Saturday, November 24, 2012, where one of us was involved in a road accident in the town of Cousset (Fribourg) and fatally struck the pole fixing the slide safety.

En l'état actuel des infrastructures du réseau routier suisse, les glissières de sécurité ne sont malheureusement que trop souvent le théâtre de drames humains pour les conducteurs de deux-roues motorisés, leurs passagers, leurs familles et leurs proches. Nous en avons encore eu la triste démonstration en date du samedi 24 novembre 2012, où l'un des nôtres fut victime d'un accident de la route dans la commune de Cousset (Fribourg) et heurta mortellement le poteau de fixation de la glissière de sécurité.

I post this because I'm a biker, my brother is a biker and friends are bikers too.

It's written in French.

http://www.change.org/fr/p%C3%A9titi...outier-suisse#

Thank you.
Is, what is mean, actually THIS


Details... nr. 1 --
Leitplanken mit Profil A und Handlauf
Details... -- nr. 2 --
Absturzsicherung zu Bahngeleise
Details...
Leitplanken mit Handlauf und Schutzrohren
Details...
Absenkung bei einer Überfahrt


thing here ?



Sure, nrs 2 and 3 and 4 are so close to the motor-traffic that the space for bicycles is extremely narrow.

************************************************** ******************************

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Plus I see more and more of these (or similar) popping up in Switzerland.
and the example you present is good as
-

--
there is a bit of a distance between the paved road and that barrier. And yes, the two massive planks are better than the examples I have shown above
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