Okay guys enough debate I'm setting up a poll I think the restraunt one was unbalanced so I'd do my best to keep a neutral footing.

I've left this run for 100 days so buy then someone has a right to open another discussion, but to be honest I'm getting pretty bored of them currently.

Tough question.

This is naturally another very emotive and volatile debate and it's almost impossible for a rational discussion on the topic, I hope it can stay on track and not degenerate...hmm

Anyway, my thinking is this.

I used to smoke but I quit when I was 19. Since then I've had the odd one here and there, and every now and then I still get the "craving", so I consider myself a smoker who hasn't had a cigarette since December 13th.

I have no problem at all with other people smoking in my presence, in my house, in my car, or at my table while I'm eating. It's never bothered me, ever, and still doesn't now.

Do I appreciate the courtesy of "Do you mind if I smoke?" Yes, I do. Do I think it's a bit rude if someone just sparks up a cigarette when I'm eating without asking? Yes, I do. But at the same time I know that it's tough to quit, and even when you have quit, it's tough to stay quit, so I have a farily wide level of tolerance here.

Now, as for smoking bans - I'm undecided.

Selfish viewpoint - I like being in restaurants where people aren't smoking near me. I like not having to worry about my clothes stinking of smoke when I get home from a night out. I like not having smoke in my eyes when someone is stood a yard away and it drifts into my face.

Realist viewpoint - a lot of people smoke. If you start making public places smoke free, you have to make allowance for that section of society to still have access to these public amenities. You also have to consider that in some areas of business you are immediately alienating a percentage of their customers by imposing a ban like this. For example in the UK my local pub in Yorkshire had to close due to a downturn in trade following the smoking ban (5 pubs in the village, 4 could afford to build fancy heated outdoor smoking terraces, one couldn't, simple result.)

On the whole, I think I'm for "smoking" and "non-smoking" areas. I don't really see a need to physically enclose the smoking area, I think that's a bit extreme and easily leads to a mini "them-and-us" mentality. I certainly think there's more to a complete ban than meets the eye.

As an interesting parrallel, did anyone see the huge fuss kicked up in the UK recently over children in pubs? Wetherspoons (one of the UK's largest pub chains, there's one in pretty much every town these days) have stated that if children under 14 are in their pub they must be escorted by adults, they are ONLY allowed in if they are eating, the adult is ONLY allowed 2 drinks (one with the meal, one after) and then they have to leave.

Their argument is that from feedback, some customers are annoyed by children being in pubs - I guess the figures show that your average 10 pint a day regular spends more cash than your average holidaying family of four, so therefore they got rid of the element that annoys the ones spending the cash.

It struck me as a similar complaint is all

"From our feedback, we discovered that [smoking / children] in our pubs was annoying a lot of our regular customers, so we have [banned smoking / restricted access for children] in response to the feedback"

I just wonder how many of the people up in arms over the decision on children, are in whole-hearted agreement over the ban on smoking - God loves a hypocrite

Well I will throw in my pennies worth,

I am 100% against smoking, let me say that at the start,
not for the reasons you might think, i know it increases the risk of bad heath and things, the long term effects are bad its well known,

But even the short term issues i have a problem with and i list them in no order what so ever,

1, It makes you smell,
I often have to go to meetings with people who are smokers, and they always have one just before the meeting, all i can smell for the first 10 minutes is them and its not nice, they are not smoking in the meeting, but still the stink, This is also the same problem on Trains and worse on busy busses,

2, It costs lots of cash,
If a person smokes one pack a day and i believe its around 6.40 a pack right now, and the cost increases around 2.5% it will end up costing them 150,000 chfs, if something is going to cost me that much cash i want a hell of a lot more for it, rather than just relief from a false addiction,

3, Breaks at work,
I work in an office where there are no exact rules for taking breaks, I'm sure it’s not the same elsewhere but these are my issues J. In an office where the smokers can go outside for 10 minutes 5 times a day, stand outside my window which I then have to close or it smells in my office.

4, Smokers when I'm eating,
This is annoying beyond all others, not only am I eating and wanting to taste my food but I am breathing through my nose at this point 100% and that means all I can smell is smoke, its also just as bad if a smoker goes outside and then comes back in, see problem 1 J

5, Smoking in Pubs and Clubs,
Ok so when I'm drunk I care about things less, but I still care, and having to shout in a night club to be heard makes the effect of smoking in the room much worse, by the end of the night my throat is sore, my tongue is sort of fuzzy, and I still stink of smoke


So those are my top five and all the other little things that annoy me can fit into one of those 5

So if you ask me how I would fix it. I would do this,

Ban it in public places, even in streets if I could then I would raise the age of smoking every year by one year, no one wants to see the children of today smoking, so why let them. People who are smokers now can continue in their own homes, and all others can start to Taste their food and ride the bus without being nasally assaulted by smoke and its effects

Sam

I voted "Ban of tobacco use on all public areas"

I'd vote for the third option "Provide ventilated fumoirs", but as an optional and funded alternative and with no mandatory minimal percentage, that is:

The establishments that would like to offer a ventilated, isolated area for smokers, would receive an aid for building such a facility, funded by an special direct tax added to the tobacco comsumption ( 1 CHF per package for example )

Just a question. Why do we have to provide a ventilated area for smokers?
Arent they the people who like the smoke in the first place,

or maybe smokers can see that the smokle is not exactly the desired thing in the first place
if they cant put up with the smoke in the room then why should non smokers.

Im a smoker but i respect those around me who are none smokers e.g if im in a restaurant and people are eating at the next table i would never light a ciggie. I never smoke in the house i always go outside to the garden and also at other peoples houses even if they say its ok i can smoke inside i always go outside. I dont smoke in the car or other peoples cars.

I think the people who smoke should have somewhere to smoke seperate from the non smokers so we dont bother them.

I used to smoke and gave up 17 years ago, never wanted to smoke again, really never had a craving since. I now cannot stand the smell, hate the mess everywhere in the streets, and like Samcole says, in the office or in a meeting when a smoker comes in and sits next to you - the smell - nearly knocks you off your chair.

Same reason I hate clubs, discos etc - haven't been to them for years, smoke, noise and feel like crap the next day - for what? No, I voted a total ban. By that I mean no advertising, no pushing to youngsters, no smoking in public or on transportation. You want to smoke, smoke in your own home.

Disgusting and frankly stupid addiction. I am ashamed to say I was a smoker, don't ask me what on earth happened to make me do such a stupid thing. Of course, I know why - it was peer pressure at boarding school and then coming home in the half-term, and running errants on my bike to the newsagents, for fags for my Mum - didn't help.

Because smoke travels and to keep the non-smoking bunnies happy the air needs to be extracted from the smoking section.

Otherwise it spills into neighbouring areas.

Many smokers are quite happy to leave the situation as it is so everyone gets the smoke. I personally try to respect others wishes where possible and given a choice

A friend once said to me having a smoking section in a resturant is like having peeing section in a pool,

Hence no TerryHall option in the poll, which was seperate areas with no segregation or filtration. I see this as no change to the current situation

This is another of many pro/anti smoking threads, which are drawing (sic) the same viewpoints and even the same posts (SamCole) as all the others.

Is is really making a difference ?

dave

And if you check what I voted for, then you will find me agreeing with you...

Sorry DaveA SamC is not me its another Sam, and i guess there are only a few view points possible

The point was we all post a lot on this subject, so give us you're votes.

i.e put your money where you're mouth is. The restruant one was biased as high percentage want smoking banned in food areas like myself, however all environments are a different matter and likely to mirror Swiss voting.

View points on the poll/discussions on why people voted which way come later after the results. I'm learning a bit by just watching it and I have a couple of things to say but it can wait.

So be patient people it's got 99 days to go and if people can refrain from the other threads which have been done to death we may get something out of this!!

I kinda wonder why we keep having these heated smoking debates. The reality is that public smoking (and smoking itself to an extent) is going the way of the dodo in the western world. Switzerland is just a little behind the times, but catching up quickly. Smokers feeling persecuted, yep, you are a minority and nobody is going to fight for your self harm rights

Would be nice to see a ban on advertising, promotions and an increase in taxes to make cigarettes less attractive to kids. But hey if you want to smoke, go for it. Just not in my face please.

PS Was the "Ban on Tobacco use within all public areas" meant to be enclosed public areas? I not for banning smoking in open air.

First off, I don't smoke.

When I was really young (<5), my dad used to smoke a lot and I couldn't stand it. These days I generally don't have a problem with it, but there are only two situations where I cannot stand smoking:

1. When eating out. Why pay good money for food that tastes like smoke? The worst is an Eiscafe full of smokers - Marlboro ripple, anyone? Smoking restrictions back home are a lot stricter than here and so I am used to being able to eat out in most places without smoke.

2. In spring. I tend to get bad hayfever at that time of year, and if I go to the pub and it's full of smoke, that can have some very unpleasant effects. To be half blind without actually drinking anything is No Fun.

At work it's never an issue - it's too hazardous to smoke in my workplace so it simply isn't allowed.

On thing I find really incredible, is the fact that there are some bars or discos, with no ventilation, but full of smoke. The air is so heavily smoked that my eyes are on tears and I can barely breath.

BUT you see people lighting up new cigarettes.... Why ? isn't the air so plenty of smoke that you need another ?

Interesting thought... Probably goes back to the SHS issue, basically what the smoker draws on must be x10,000 times (god knows the real number) as concentrated as the localised smoky area. Hence the need for a cigarette.

Smoky environments just do not produce a big enough hit of nicotine due to the concentration levels or dose.

Also gets quite interesting about particulate size aswell for the physics/chemistry bods amongst us. SHS contains usually smaller particulates and these spread further as a consiquence I believe. Could be wrong though.

Guys a subtle hint but I'm trying to keep this poll unbiased and a open vote without too many comments from either side.

We all have an opinion lets save it for a little while until we have some good numbers

Why go to the expense of installing ventilated fumoirs - just make the smokers go outside, where copious ventilation is available for free.

I voted to ban use in public areas. Breathing in Tobacco smoke gives me asthma symptoms. The last music concert I went to, I was ill for about a week afterwards, as the air was so full of smoke. Consequently, I never go to restaurants in Switzerland.