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  #1401  
Old 17.12.2014, 12:42
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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My point is that money laundering alone does not account for Switzerland's prosperity and success. There! I said it.
Neither does the Isle of Man. Tourism is a big factor in the Manx economy. The Isle of Man has cleverly managed to hide all the ugly banking stuff from sight (it's much less visible than in Switzerland) and maintain its old-world flair with its Georgian architecture, beautiful green hills, narrow winding roads and country tea houses and bed and breakfasts.

Of course motor sport is also an important contributor.
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  #1402  
Old 17.12.2014, 21:44
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Neither does the Isle of Man. Tourism is a big factor in the Manx economy. The Isle of Man has cleverly managed to hide all the ugly banking stuff from sight (it's much less visible than in Switzerland) and maintain its old-world flair with its Georgian architecture, beautiful green hills, narrow winding roads and country tea houses and bed and breakfasts.

Of course motor sport is also an important contributor.

Inbound Tourism together with Export Industry and Transport is a mainstay of the Swiss economy, while Banking is not
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  #1403  
Old 17.12.2014, 22:26
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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yes, you can set up holding companies in several places, but Switzerland's size permits it to approach the structures differently. each of the other countries you listed is more or less the same as Luxembourg, they are far more reliant on a pure holding company approach because they lack the geographical scope and population size to make an intercompany sale approach doable. Switzerland offers a holding company conduit, as well, but the manner in which it is implemented is different because Switzerland is large enough to accommodate more than just a simple holding company and dividend approach.

P.S. all of this information, and much, much more regarding offshore and tax-efficient capital structures, is publicly-available through some reasonably simple Google searches. you could also probably browse the yellow pages in Zug, Zuerich or Geneva and find literally dozens of firms who will be more than happy to sit down and discuss how these structures work and where the risks / rewards lie. there really is nothing more I can share on the EF that will convince you, to the extent you are not already convinced or inclined to be convinced. and, just to repeat, I am not saying that there is anything at all "wrong", "unethical" or anything else with Switzerland's model, only trying to highlight some of the realities around the country's model and how that model compels reliance on foreign investment and access to foreign trade markets.
Sort of relevant, look here!
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  #1404  
Old 17.12.2014, 23:17
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Sort of relevant, look here!
the first time I heard the term "Dutch Sandwich" I was sitting in an office in Amsterdam. imagine my disappointment when I learned what it actually meant.
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  #1405  
Old 18.12.2014, 00:00
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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the first time I heard the term "Dutch Sandwich" I was sitting in an office in Amsterdam. imagine my disappointment when I learned what it actually meant.
And when it is cut diagonally....

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I know about these structures, Dutch triangles and such, or whatever they may be called now.
You get two Dutch club sandwiches.

Just kidding, I misspoke. I meant Dutch Sandwich.
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  #1406  
Old 24.12.2014, 18:40
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

Some of the foreigners in this forum, excited at the idea of limiting immigration (they'd probably vote to deport themselves if they could), talk about "skilled immigrants"...well, what is a "skilled immigrant"? A plumber? A middle-class University graduate? A CEO?
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  #1407  
Old 24.12.2014, 22:32
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Some of the foreigners in this forum, excited at the idea of limiting immigration (they'd probably vote to deport themselves if they could), talk about "skilled immigrants"...well, what is a "skilled immigrant"? A plumber? A middle-class University graduate? A CEO?
Plumber.
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  #1408  
Old 25.12.2014, 01:35
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Plumber.

Indeed, what the country needs are plumbers, train-drivers, mechanics (car-mechanics, bycicle-mechanics, etc) . bakers, restaurant waiters, retail-shop-assistants, masons, carpenters, truck-drivers, taxi-drivers, construction-workers
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  #1409  
Old 30.04.2015, 14:14
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

Next EU step is the Internal Market and Consumer Protection Committee of the EU will hold a public hearing with experts on obstacles with regard to the full implementation of the internal market in the context of EEA-Switzerland, see here.

The debates, which will also focus on the transposition of the internal market acquis in the EEA EFTA States and Switzerland, will feed into a non-legislative report that is being prepared by the Committee.
The hearing will be held in Brussels on 07 May at 11.00

The objective is to formulate a report that will be used to prepare a resolution on relations with Switzerland to be voted on by the EU Parliament.
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  #1410  
Old 19.08.2015, 23:33
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

The people who are against the result of this vote have collected enough signatures to force a new referendum here.

As the Chinese curse; may you live in interesting times

Last edited by marton; 20.08.2015 at 01:16.
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  #1411  
Old 20.08.2015, 00:15
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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The people who are against the result of this vote have collected enough signatures to force a new referendum here.
Expect an even larger margin this time, in the same direction as the last.

The Swiss do NOT like being told what to do by the a..holes of the EU.

And your link doesn't work. (nor will the referendum)

Tom
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  #1412  
Old 20.08.2015, 01:17
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Expect an even larger margin this time, in the same direction as the last.

The Swiss do NOT like being told what to do by the a..holes of the EU.

And your link doesn't work. (nor will the referendum)

Tom
Oooppss, fixed the link.

At least this time people will know they are voting against the EU bilaterals, last time they were told "no problem"
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  #1413  
Old 20.08.2015, 08:18
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Expect an even larger margin this time, in the same direction as the last.

The Swiss do NOT like being told what to do by the a..holes of the EU.

And your link doesn't work. (nor will the referendum)

Tom

People in Zürich, Luzern, Bern, Basel, Lausanne, Geneva, etc do not like being told where to go by those people from the rural areas
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  #1414  
Old 20.08.2015, 08:59
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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People in Zürich, Luzern, Bern, Basel, Lausanne, Geneva, etc do not like being told where to go by those people from the rural areas
As they comprise most of the population, and NOT the rural areas, how are the rural areas telling them anything?

Ticino didn't get a 65% YES just from the strength of the rural areas, but because of the cities, which are LEGA strongholds.

Tom
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Old 20.08.2015, 10:28
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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As they comprise most of the population, and NOT the rural areas, how are the rural areas telling them anything?

Ticino didn't get a 65% YES just from the strength of the rural areas, but because of the cities, which are LEGA strongholds.

Tom

A) last time, people expected a clear NO and so simply did not vote, as usual. This most likely is different now
B) There is the Ständemehr, the majority of states
C) I expect a NO for the new referendum in Ticino, and this is not the fault of LEGA but the fault of the Italian Republic
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  #1416  
Old 20.08.2015, 10:33
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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As they comprise most of the population, and NOT the rural areas, how are the rural areas telling them anything?

Ticino didn't get a 65% YES just from the strength of the rural areas, but because of the cities, which are LEGA strongholds.

Tom
Not only in Ticino - this was the case throughout Switzerland - the rural-dwelling citizens largely didn't change their stance towards this issue, but what made the real difference in the vote was the swing in the urban and metropolitan areas. But nevertheless those opposed to ANY measure which secures Swiss borders or brings in ANY measure of control to immigration (above that which the EU dictates as being "right") will continue to perpetuate the fabrication that the rural-dwelling citizens are the ones to blame for the MEI passing the ballot box - and what they really want to say is "Those simpleton hill-billies should stick to their lowly peasant life and leave politics, economics, and heck pretty much voting in general to us know-it-all city-slickers" - and by pressing this fabrication they wish to give the impression that the outcome of the vote was somehow unjust or unfair. - What a load of rubbish!

I happen to think that rural-dwelling citizens are just as intelligent as city folk. I happen to know many of them and it may surprise some people just how well educated they are. I happen to also think that no citizens vote is worth any less than another citizens vote - and that goes for those who voted against the MEI just the same.

I happen to also respect our rural communities who provide great quality food and drink for us "know-it-all" city folk. I respect them for their hard labours but also I respect them for the experience they bring to the nation, for the perspective they bring. I respect them as a counter-balance to this worlds society drunken with the gluttony of all things "new" and "better" - mostly "better" simply because they are "new".

So here's to the farmer, the peasant, the rural-dwelling citizen. Salut! Prost! ... and may your lives be long and your vote ever present!
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Old 20.08.2015, 10:41
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Wollishofener: A) last time, people expected a clear NO and so simply did not vote, as usual. This most likely is different now
The voter participation was over 56% - isn't that higher than usual!? And since it was almost the same number of for and against voters isn't is hard to assume that those voting against just didn't bother voting!? Sounds to me like both sides went full-throttle!
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  #1418  
Old 20.08.2015, 10:59
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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The voter participation was over 56% - isn't that higher than usual!? And since it was almost the same number of for and against voters isn't is hard to assume that those voting against just didn't bother voting!? Sounds to me like both sides went full-throttle!
Indeed, but the question is if either side was able to mobilize their supporters more than the others.

I know quite a few who voted strategically with a YES because they expected a NO, and simply wanted to show their discomfort with the current situation. With hindsight a significant portion of those wish they'd voiced their opinion instead.

Additonally, I think many believed (wanted to believe) Blochers lie (he can't have been unaware of the consequences, he's a lawyer) that the Bilaterals would not need to be canceled.
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  #1419  
Old 20.08.2015, 11:08
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Indeed, but the question is if either side was able to mobilize their supporters more than the others.

I know quite a few who voted strategically with a YES because they expected a NO, and simply wanted to show their discomfort with the current situation. With hindsight a significant portion of those wish they'd voiced their opinion instead.

Additonally, I think many believed (wanted to believe) Blochers lie (he can't have been unaware of the consequences, he's a lawyer) that the Bilaterals would not need to be canceled.
However, several things have changed since them.

One of these is the refugee crisis. OK, the bilaterals are not really about those migrants but people connect the topics. This will help a swing towards the no.

Another point is the handling of the whole affair by the Bundesrat and their seeming inability if not unwillingness to bring their fist down on the table in Brussels saying "our people have spoken so jump to it you unelected morons" but instead say "sorry, we don't really support this but our stupid population had a silly vote and asked us to negotiate this, of course it is so embarrassing and we apologise and let us kiss your feet". This has angered a lot of people and made them willing to punish the Bundesrat even more.

I always felt the right to do would have been to send Blocher and his friends to negotiate. It is the usual thing that when somebody wins a referendum that the initiators are involved in the implementation. If they'd have come home with egg on their face that would have settled the matter once and for all. But the powers that be were too worried he might actually achieve something and get his way and so they failed on purpose.
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  #1420  
Old 20.08.2015, 11:08
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Re: Repercussions of Vote Already Starting...

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Indeed, but the question is if either side was able to mobilize their supporters more than the others.

I know quite a few who voted strategically with a YES because they expected a NO, and simply wanted to show their discomfort with the current situation. With hindsight a significant portion of those wish they'd voiced their opinion instead.

Additonally, I think many believed Blochers lie that the Bilaterals would not need to be cancelled.

In every past referendum where there was a clear question (yes or no to the EU) then there was a clear pro-EU majority vote.


As you wrote "many believed Blochers lie that the Bilaterals would not need to be cancelled" so this time it will be interesting to see whether the pro-EU vote is weaker or stronger than the anti freedom of movement vote.
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