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  #361  
Old 26.10.2014, 16:31
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

Absolutely on the last sentence especially- but then you have to accept the consequences and not moan that life's not fair. I learnt that when I was just a kid- growing in a small mountain village Stand your ground, do your stuff- but then don't expect approval.
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  #362  
Old 26.10.2014, 16:45
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

I think I forgot my ego godknowswhere..I think I'd worry more about those attached to me having different view of traditions or community belonging, tbh.

Life is full of interesting twists, non academic world vs academia is an ancient battle. I wonder what will happen, there's a lot of undercover discrete local nonconformism that I appreciate. It makes more sense than the loud type.
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  #363  
Old 26.10.2014, 18:57
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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That's called playing the game of small community's life. You advocate exactl what I described as small-community-social-theater-performance-talent.
Nope, I don't say current procedure is the right way to do it, let alone the only way.

What I do say, actually, is that every test has its own procedures and rules, and one would be well advised to prepare and act accordingly, that's just how it is. An ex-professor, whose duties presumably included testing students during the exams, should be most aware of that.

Passing any fairly broad knowledge test should literally be a non-issue for somebody as intelligent (and able to memorize) as an ex-professor, even at age 75. Especially after spending almost 40 years in the country. Provided he put up a little effort.

tagesanzeiger.ch (german article) quotes Dunn saying he had been tired, and that he didn't know this was an actual test - in other words, he was completely unprepared, couldn't even be bothered to read the instructions and information sent by the Gemeinde.

If that's how one prepared for a job interview what would be the most likely result?
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  #364  
Old 26.10.2014, 19:10
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Nope, I don't say current procedure is the right way to do it, let alone the only way.
We agree, wonderful. As for the rest, I am not talking about practicalities (we all know how to take a test and I am a teacher) but about the implications of those practices. This is a far less comfortable discussion for Einsiedeln. If you want to defend them, feel free, but I am not attacking anybody, I am challenging a thought process that is not what it claims to be. It's not the first time that my messages don't get understood. But I am not ignorant.
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  #365  
Old 28.10.2014, 05:04
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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We agree, wonderful. As for the rest, I am not talking about practicalities (we all know how to take a test and I am a teacher) but about the implications of those practices. This is a far less comfortable discussion for Einsiedeln. If you want to defend them, feel free, but I am not attacking anybody, I am challenging a thought process that is not what it claims to be. It's not the first time that my messages don't get understood. But I am not ignorant.

The Professor simply did not take the matter seriously. THIS is the aspect I can understand those in Einsiedeln. They however clearly over-reacted. HE however should make his mind UP. His choice are the State of Zürich and the State of California. The Canton of Zürich and the City of Zürich will find ways to make him a citizen of Zürich within three years or less.
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  #366  
Old 28.10.2014, 09:59
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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The Professor simply did not take the matter seriously. THIS is the aspect I can understand those in Einsiedeln. They however clearly over-reacted. HE however should make his mind UP. His choice are the State of Zürich and the State of California. The Canton of Zürich and the City of Zürich will find ways to make him a citizen of Zürich within three years or less.
Oh c'mon Wolli, the man is 75 years old! You know, male life expectancy at birth is a little above 78 in CH and a bit over 75 y in USA...and you talk about poor man having to make up his mind and redeem himself in the eyes of community again, and maybe in a 3 years time he'll be given citizenship.
Phui...
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  #367  
Old 30.10.2014, 23:19
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

Mr Dunn is free to appyl a second time in Einsiedeln anytime he so pleases.

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We agree, wonderful.
Probably not, actually. While I do think a test is useful, and applicants can be required to fulfill some set of criteria (including being able to communicate in the local language) I don't know the test well enough to make a case either for or against it.

So, as you may now realize, me not defending it doesn't mean I think it went overboard.
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  #368  
Old 30.10.2014, 23:46
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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(About "agreeing")
Probably not, actually.
If you don't know what rhetoric is, you won't understand any message ever in this forum.
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  #369  
Old 04.11.2014, 20:58
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

If Prof. Dunn re-applies for Swiss citizenship, he might wish to review this helpful video "10 Dinge, die Sie nicht tun sollten, wenn Sie den Schweizerpass möchten". I only wish I had seen it before the interviews with the Einbürgerungskommission:

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  #370  
Old 04.11.2014, 22:14
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Oh c'mon Wolli, the man is 75 years old! You know, male life expectancy at birth is a little above 78 in CH and a bit over 75 y in USA...and you talk about poor man having to make up his mind and redeem himself in the eyes of community again, and maybe in a 3 years time he'll be given citizenship.
Phui...

Sorry
>> an uncle of me at age 100 declared that he now had started to feel the age and stopped hacking Wood
>>> he at age 99 invited me to his favourite Bistro (in Hyères.-Toulon) to talk about politics, travel, food and more, and of course his interesting life
>> Mum at age 87 declared NOT to move to a home for elderly people as she did not see what she should talk with the old people there
>> another uncle, at age 98 after the meal, got out to meet his good friends at a nearby pub, and on return urged us to do something
>> Famous Peter Scholl-Latour recently died aged 90
>> an aunt some years ago at 90 declared she had no time to die, but her end came nevertheless
>> Helmut Schmidt recently became 95. His birthday was celebrated in a big event and he talked with everybody --- well, he has slowed down a bit, no doubt


So that youngish 75 is no obstacle
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  #371  
Old 04.11.2014, 22:36
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Sorry
>> an uncle of me at age 100 declared that he now had started to feel the age and stopped hacking Wood
>>> he at age 99 invited me to his favourite Bistro (in Hyères.-Toulon) to talk about politics, travel, food and more, and of course his interesting life
>> Mum at age 87 declared NOT to move to a home for elderly people as she did not see what she should talk with the old people there
>> another uncle, at age 98 after the meal, got out to meet his good friends at a nearby pub, and on return urged us to do something
>> Famous Peter Scholl-Latour recently died aged 90
>> an aunt some years ago at 90 declared she had no time to die, but her end came nevertheless
>> Helmut Schmidt recently became 95. His birthday was celebrated in a big event and he talked with everybody --- well, he has slowed down a bit, no doubt


So that youngish 75 is no obstacle
Gosh, Wolli. You are so literal it's painful
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  #372  
Old 04.11.2014, 23:05
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Gosh, Wolli. You are so literal it's painful
No, he's sweet...

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So that youngish 75 is no obstacle
Yes Wolli, 75 it is not an obstacle. But for God's sake, sometimes we deserve more than patiently waiting for our "turn". I mean, that patiently.
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  #373  
Old 05.11.2014, 02:43
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

I'm glad that Wolli has so many relatives who live to a ripe old age. He's very lucky to have such good genes running in his family.

But since my father died last year one week after his 76th birthday, I'm going to look at the plight of this man who was denied Swiss citizenship much differently than he does.
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Old 13.11.2014, 10:27
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

Looking at writing an article on applying for Swiss citizenship and wondering if anyone has experiences - good or bad - they would be prepared to share. Also, has the case of this ETH prof. put anyone off applying for citizenship? Thanks for your responses. E
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  #375  
Old 13.11.2014, 10:39
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Looking at writing an article on applying for Swiss citizenship and wondering if anyone has experiences - good or bad - they would be prepared to share. Also, has the case of this ETH prof. put anyone off applying for citizenship? Thanks for your responses. E
Start by watching the film: https://www.google.ch/?gws_rd=ssl#q=...zermacher+film
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  #376  
Old 13.11.2014, 10:44
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Looking at writing an article on applying for Swiss citizenship and wondering if anyone has experiences - good or bad - they would be prepared to share. Also, has the case of this ETH prof. put anyone off applying for citizenship? Thanks for your responses. E
Our naturalisation went very smoothly indeed. But then again, we are bloody fantastic people .
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  #377  
Old 04.01.2015, 11:33
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

Tages-Anzeiger reports that Prof. Dunn, the former ETH chemical engineering professor, will not proceed with a second Swiss citizenship application. The naturalization fees were reduced minimally from CHF 3'600 to 3'100 for the second application which showed that Einsiedeln was not willing to compromise in his opinion. Prof. Dunn believes that a local politician simply does not want him as a citizen of Einsiedeln:

http://www.tagesanzeiger.ch/schweiz/...story/10914945
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  #378  
Old 04.01.2015, 11:41
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Prof. Dunn believes that some local politicians simply [do] not want him as a citizen of Einsiedeln:
Corrected. The difference between 'Swiss citizen' and 'Bürger von Einsiedeln' is enormously important here; if we're really going to rehash the whole thing let's at least get the quote right.
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  #379  
Old 04.01.2015, 12:23
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

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Corrected. The difference between 'Swiss citizen' and 'Bürger von Einsiedeln' is enormously important here; if we're really going to rehash the whole thing let's at least get the quote right.

He SINNED on two accounts
> he worked in Zürich (for the Einsiedler Sodom on the Gomorra)
> he is NOT Roman Catholic but Protestant


In other words, he might have applied for citizenship in Thayingen/SH or Stein-am-Rhein/SH or Sumiswald/BE, but definitely not in Einsiedeln


************************************************** *******************


and he anyway would have become a citizen of the village/town/city AND of the Canton -- and a member of the Club (CH) as a result


I know a Turk, who came to Zürich as employee of Turkish Airlines, and worked and lived here for 20 years. He upon retirement cautioulsy kept his apartment in Zürich while returning to Istanbul. After half a year he found out that
- most of his friends had gone to Western Europe
- weather in Istanbul was rather worse than in Zürich
- central heating was bad
- it no longer was his City
He returned to Zürich, goes (went) to München and Stanbul for Holidays
-- If still alive he is 90 now

Last edited by Wollishofener; 04.01.2015 at 12:44.
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  #380  
Old 04.01.2015, 14:07
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Re: American professor denied Swiss citizenship

Dear Professor Dunn,

You have ignored the one deciding factor that led to your present predicament: your own behaviour.

- You have neighbours that have helped you many times and yet you could not name one aquaintance in your initial interview.

- The commission unanimously agreed to not approve your application because you did not fulfill the stated requirements. It was not a decision of one political party only.

- You have said yourself you did not take the naturalization interview seriously and did not prepare yourself adequately.

The media has agreed to make you a "victim" where, in truth, you just couldn't give a damn about the rules and regulations involved in your naturalization.

You should be ashamed of yourself, Professor Dunn, and so should the media for sensationalizing a case and ignoring the shortcomings of the applicant involved.
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