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Old 30.07.2015, 14:51
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Swissport sold to Chinese

The aircraft handler Swissport, previously owned by the French investment company PAI Partners, is sold to China.
Swissport is the former ground handling company of Swissair, deal must be approved by the Swiss authorities.

I remember when I was young there was a lot of talk of the "yellow peril" that China would take the world by force; instead they seem to be buying it
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Old 30.07.2015, 15:15
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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The aircraft handler Swissport, previously owned by the French investment company PAI Partners, is sold to China.
Swissport is the former ground handling company of Swissair, deal must be approved by the Swiss authorities.

I remember when I was young there was a lot of talk of the "yellow peril" that China would take the world by force; instead they seem to be buying it

Just as they are buying and leasing vast swathes of Africa mainly for agricultural purposes. The western world is just waking up to what is happening. It'll also mean an end to Africa's poverty.
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Old 30.07.2015, 15:24
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

Yet everywhere you read, China's economy is on the brink of collapse. This doesn't mean anything, unless you work at Swissport. China's economy is almost exclusively reliant on manufacturing and exporting to the West. Which means their economy is subject to the fortunes for the West.
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Old 30.07.2015, 16:06
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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Yet everywhere you read, China's economy is on the brink of collapse. This doesn't mean anything, unless you work at Swissport. China's economy is almost exclusively reliant on manufacturing and exporting to the West. Which means their economy is subject to the fortunes for the West.
About "China's economy is almost exclusively reliant on manufacturing and exporting to the West. "

This is why they are diversifying and buying companies like Swissport, docks in Greece, developing agriculture in Africa as mentioned- they even bought the US company Smithfield Foods which means 1 in every 4 pigs in the USA is owned by China.

The Chinese economy is not really on the brink of collapse; certainly their stock market has dropped like crazy and likely a lot of investors will lose their shirts. Probably they are in for some rough times, their real estate business is overextended.
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Old 30.07.2015, 16:19
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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....... their real estate business is overextended.
A disease they caught from the West!

Incubation time of 7 years then
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Old 30.07.2015, 17:33
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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The Chinese economy is not really on the brink of collapse; certainly their stock market has dropped like crazy and likely a lot of investors will lose their shirts. Probably they are in for some rough times, their real estate business is overextended.
The Chinese market is frankly not as free and transparent as any European one. There is an awful lot of any form of financial crimes from insider trading to inflated or faked balance statements going on. Investors don't have access to many financial products we are used to, so a lot buy stocks or real estate without really knowing what they are doing... At times a bubble bursts, but that's not an as fair and clear indication for the economy as it should be...

The thing I find a bit annoying in the press and public discussion: Nobody would ever say "America buys Swissport" if it was an US investor. If it is a Chinese company it is always "China" or "the Chinese"...
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Old 31.07.2015, 14:42
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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The aircraft handler Swissport, previously owned by the French investment company PAI Partners, is sold to China.
Swissport is the former ground handling company of Swissair, deal must be approved by the Swiss authorities.

I remember when I was young there was a lot of talk of the "yellow peril" that China would take the world by force; instead they seem to be buying it

When I grew up, the Bookshelf of Grandmum was dominated by the books of SVEN HEDIN titled ASIEN MARSCHIERT
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Old 31.07.2015, 16:20
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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The thing I find a bit annoying in the press and public discussion: Nobody would ever say "America buys Swissport" if it was an US investor. If it is a Chinese company it is always "China" or "the Chinese"...
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the concept of private property in China more something that is tolerated than an anchored right? So really the government owns everything that its citizens own, and so indirectly this statement is correct.

Furthermore, you can't be a company beyond a certain size in China if you don't have a certain number of board members who are also members of the Party and thus take their marching orders from the big boss (being a member of the Communist part is not the same as being a member of the SVP or FDP, as the line between party and state in China is very fuzzy and they have strong dogmatic and disciplinary ways of brining mavericks back into line - or into work camps). So to some extent Chinese corporations are a fiction to dress over extended state control.
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Old 31.07.2015, 17:46
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't the concept of private property in China more something that is tolerated than an anchored right? So really the government owns everything that its citizens own, and so indirectly this statement is correct.

Furthermore, you can't be a company beyond a certain size in China if you don't have a certain number of board members who are also members of the Party and thus take their marching orders from the big boss (being a member of the Communist part is not the same as being a member of the SVP or FDP, as the line between party and state in China is very fuzzy and they have strong dogmatic and disciplinary ways of brining mavericks back into line - or into work camps). So to some extent Chinese corporations are a fiction to dress over extended state control.
Have you actually ever been to China or do you get your knowledge from a Mao era textbook? Your idea of some 1984 state could not be further from the truth... the central government has a hard time keeping their own provincial governments under control and really have other challenges on their plate than to tell every private business owner what to do. Companies form lobby groups and any provincial government that wants to not be replaced by the central one will always do what the industry leaders tell them to keep the jobs in their province... for example turning a blind eye on pollution or labor laws. The problem in China is really not excessive government control but much more often the lack of it.
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Old 31.07.2015, 18:01
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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Have you actually ever been to China or do you get your knowledge from a Mao era textbook? Your idea of some 1984 state could not be further from the truth... the central government has a hard time keeping their own provincial governments under control and really have other challenges on their plate than to tell every private business owner what to do. Companies form lobby groups and any provincial government that wants to not be replaced by the central one will always do what the industry leaders tell them to keep the jobs in their province... for example turning a blind eye on pollution or labor laws. The problem in China is really not excessive government control but much more often the lack of it.
My main source of knowledge is a company we have worked with a bit over the last couple of years.

They are a major paper producer in China and have bought equipment from us. Although I wasn't directly involved in the project, the whole Chinese hospitality thing meant that I got to be invited to attend dinners and social events laid on to entertain our customers. Most of these guys are very open when talking about Chinese politics and they tell me in no uncertain terms "our CEO is in the Party and many of his buddies are in the Party and if in China you aren't in the Party or at least friendly with the Party you are a nobody".

This is not 1984 China but 2015 China.

You can of course interpret this both way. It could be the party is telling CEOs what to do, and it could be in contrast that the CEOs are telling the government what to do. But I also asked them, was he in the Party before he became CEO, or was he invited into the aprty because he was CEO, and they tell me he's been in the Party since his student days.

I don't think the lack of pollution control proves very much. Soviet Russia and the DDR were pretty polluted if i remember correctly. But that wasn't really evidence of private enterprise I don't think.
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Old 01.08.2015, 18:36
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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The Chinese market is frankly not as free and transparent as any European one. There is an awful lot of any form of financial crimes from insider trading to inflated or faked balance statements going on. Investors don't have access to many financial products we are used to, so a lot buy stocks or real estate without really knowing what they are doing... At times a bubble bursts, but that's not an as fair and clear indication for the economy as it should be...

The thing I find a bit annoying in the press and public discussion: Nobody would ever say "America buys Swissport" if it was an US investor. If it is a Chinese company it is always "China" or "the Chinese"...
About "Nobody would ever say "America buys Swissport" if it was an US investor. "

From today's FT "US activist builds stake in Rolls-Royce"; does not look so different?
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Old 02.08.2015, 02:36
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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The aircraft handler Swissport, previously owned by the French investment company PAI Partners, is sold to China.
Swissport is the former ground handling company of Swissair, deal must be approved by the Swiss authorities.

I remember when I was young there was a lot of talk of the "yellow peril" that China would take the world by force; instead they seem to be buying it

Here

http://www.hnagroup.com/en/corporati...-us/index.html


a Profile of the HNA GROUP. Hainan Airlines for a while served Zürich from Beijing but dropped the route
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Old 02.08.2015, 10:37
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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Have you actually ever been to China or do you get your knowledge from a Mao era textbook? Your idea of some 1984 state could not be further from the truth... the central government has a hard time keeping their own provincial governments under control and really have other challenges on their plate than to tell every private business owner what to do. Companies form lobby groups and any provincial government that wants to not be replaced by the central one will always do what the industry leaders tell them to keep the jobs in their province... for example turning a blind eye on pollution or labor laws. The problem in China is really not excessive government control but much more often the lack of it.
All true, but the idea that it's impossible to have a successful company without the blessing of the local government(and giving them their share) is still very much a reality. It has come a long way since the 80's but guanxi is still king.
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Old 02.08.2015, 11:51
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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All true, but the idea that it's impossible to have a successful company without the blessing of the local government(and giving them their share) is still very much a reality. It has come a long way since the 80's but guanxi is still king.


Also in the West, private Business is interlinked with local government. In many cases local government depends on local Business for Support, financial, social and political. While the HNA Group is a private Company, it inevitably is linked up with various political authorities. Many Airlines in China are fully or partially owned by provinces and/or cities


When I read ""taken over by Chinese ......"" I thought "" oh oh holy sh..."" but when I saw that it is HNA I became relieved as HNA is a good company
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Old 02.08.2015, 13:06
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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"our CEO is in the Party and many of his buddies are in the Party and if in China you aren't in the Party or at least friendly with the Party you are a nobody".
Not commenting on the exact situation here, and not denying that business in China is much more opaque than the western world, but a few short comments:

Firstly, the "party" is huge. 1 in 13 people are a member. They join as much of a social and networking thing as power.

I don't take exception to guanxi being a criteria. Swap guanxi for its English meaning: relationships. Western businesses make choices on the same - do they trust the counterparty? What can they do for them? Clearly business practices are less corrupt over here,
so taking a chance on a new provider is more common. It can be deeply frustrating starting a new relationship with a Chinese client, but in the context, it's understandable. You want someone you can trust. You can trust people you've known longer. If you're ambitious, you probably joined the party to network.

Depending on the level of involvement, the comment above could be a much less sinister "our CEO is an influential member of the local community and many of his buddies are involved in the community and if in [insert Gemeinde or even small UK village here] you aren't an active member of the community, you are a nobody"
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Old 02.08.2015, 15:12
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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All true, but the idea that it's impossible to have a successful company without the blessing of the local government(and giving them their share) is still very much a reality. It has come a long way since the 80's but guanxi is still king.
In a general sense the same applies to western companies.

Just consider what's happened around recently: Interest groups demanding from the state (SNB in this case) to protect their interests. A few years ago the same demand was raised by opposite side, aka by business side.

The difference being perhaps that around here it's formalized (anonymized if you will) (more kinda law-based, I hope), so companies pay into public funds, while in more corrupt countries payments flow towards individuals.

But that doesn't make things better per se. Different indeed, but not necessarily better. While I, being economically weak, definitely prefer the western approach, calling a different approach inherently worse or bad seems kind of arrogant to me. Even more so as the very same practices were prevalent in the west not that long ago, and in many cases still are.
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Old 02.08.2015, 18:03
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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Not commenting on the exact situation here, and not denying that business in China is much more opaque than the western world, but a few short comments:

Firstly, the "party" is huge. 1 in 13 people are a member. They join as much of a social and networking thing as power.

I don't take exception to guanxi being a criteria. Swap guanxi for its English meaning: relationships. Western businesses make choices on the same - do they trust the counterparty? What can they do for them? Clearly business practices are less corrupt over here,
so taking a chance on a new provider is more common. It can be deeply frustrating starting a new relationship with a Chinese client, but in the context, it's understandable. You want someone you can trust. You can trust people you've known longer. If you're ambitious, you probably joined the party to network.

Depending on the level of involvement, the comment above could be a much less sinister "our CEO is an influential member of the local community and many of his buddies are involved in the community and if in [insert Gemeinde or even small UK village here] you aren't an active member of the community, you are a nobody"
All true. But the Party is not some sort of benevolent Rotarian Club. Its still dogmatically loaded and I expect the Party meetings are not about playing bingo or cracking locker room jokes or honing golf skills but are about ... towing the Party line.
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Old 05.08.2015, 15:51
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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All true. But the Party is not some sort of benevolent Rotarian Club. Its still dogmatically loaded and I expect the Party meetings are not about playing bingo or cracking locker room jokes or honing golf skills but are about ... towing the Party line.


all correct BUT what I do not know is what HNA wants.. Is it a strategic Investment ? or will the HQ be moved to a place in China ?
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Old 24.08.2015, 17:24
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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The Chinese economy is not really on the brink of collapse
Seen what's happening today?
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Old 24.08.2015, 21:20
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Re: Swissport sold to Chinese

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Seen what's happening today?

Yes, and China is taking the rest of the world down with them
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