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  #21  
Old 26.02.2010, 10:11
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

From 20min who got it from AP:

Es ist gegen die ungläubige und abtrünnige Schweiz, die die Häuser Allahs zerstört, gegen die der Dschihad mit allen Mitteln ausgerufen werden muss», sagte Gaddafi in der Küstenstadt Bengasi im Osten des Landes vor Tausenden von Zuhörern. Sie feierten dort die Geburt des Propheten Mohammed, wie die Nachrichtenagentur AFP meldet.

Für den libyschen Staatsführer ist «der Dschihad gegen die Schweiz, gegen den Zionismus, gegen die ausländische Aggression [...] kein Terrorismus», heisst es weiter.


Seems to me that he's calling from terrorist acts only for him it's not terrorism....depends which sources you want to believe I guess
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  #22  
Old 26.02.2010, 10:15
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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, "to all harbours and prevent any Swiss ships docking,”
"
Does this mean I won't be able to get up to Rigi at the weekend?

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I wonder how the western world feels about Gadafi. The man responsible for planes getting bombed, police officers getting shot dead from within it's embassys and who also was very generous towards the IRA is once again calling for terrorist acts
However, he's got oil, so it's all ok.

Last edited by vwild1; 26.02.2010 at 15:34. Reason: No need for multiple posts in succession when one single post will suffice
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  #23  
Old 26.02.2010, 10:19
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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Seems to me that he's calling from terrorist acts only for him it's not terrorism....depends which sources you want to believe I guess
You know, I think that media likes to simplify things for us sometimes

I coincidentally watched a CNN program last year stating that Lybia "developed new ethics for Jihad" - i was quite intrigued as I just though that holy war did not have too many rules in the past... the Lybians argued that holy war needs to be carried out in a more ethical way than other conflicts as it was for God. They even admitted that in their past, they did it wrong!

and here we go:

Source

"The code's most direct challenge to al Qaeda is this: "Jihad has ethics and morals because it is for God. That means it is forbidden to kill women, children, elderly people, priests, messengers, traders and the like. Betrayal is prohibited and it is vital to keep promises and treat prisoners of war in a good way. Standing by those ethics is what distinguishes Muslims' jihad from the wars of other nations."

If they really follow this rule-book, any terrorist bombing would be illegal. Arresting a "trader" and throwing him into prison actually as well, but maybe a manager is not a merchant according to their views...
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  #24  
Old 26.02.2010, 10:20
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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Some might "rise up" but I hardly think they'll make it to Switzerland
The sad thing is that Gaddaffi has in the past (and likely wouldn't hesitate to do so again) provided training facilities, as well as material and financial backing to a number of terrorist organisations.

Now, a smart Jihadist might just take advantage of this, and go there to receive all the training, cash and Semtex he can carry, claiming that he will use it to target the great Helvetic evil, and then just use it to target whoever he was originally pissed off with.
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  #25  
Old 26.02.2010, 10:25
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

I hink I saw that programm as well. It had an interview with one of his sons right? At least on the show he seemed like a decent guy.

In his quote he said. It's vital promises are kept. It's obvious they haven't kept their ones so they don't stick to their rules. AT least senior doesn't.

According to all the german sources I've checked he's called for jihad through all means. We all know which is the most common mean to wage jihad. If this isn't a call for terrorism fair enough. For me it is
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  #26  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:01
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

I find it interesting that in cases where a lunatic (and let's keep the word 'lunatic' in mind here) like Gadaffi does something outrageous, nearly everyone is lured into a debate about the exact teachings of that person's religion and how he or she has contradicted or dishonoured it.

I am proud to say that I am an Atheist who is happy to live peacefully alongside any person with any religion as long as it does not bring me, my family or those around me any harm. What I have realised is that the religion is almost never to blame. It's the LUNATIC that decides he or she will carry our acts of violence/oppression in the name of that religion.

I say we forget about analysing the religions and focus on the mentally ill people that carry out terrible things in the name of their god. (We all remember Mr Bush doing stuff in the name of God!) We need to find a consensus between all nations that people cause wars, not religions.

Now I’ll climb down from my soapbox..
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  #27  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:39
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

As a Muslim, I'm disappointed to see the usual tired, casual racism that I have to face in Switzerland on a daily basis.

Whilst Gaddafi certainly isn't helping our cause with silly pronouncements of jihad, I'm worried by postings that immediately link all Muslims with kebab vendors.

To clarify, jihad is a noun for struggle. It does not mean a war. In fact it should really refer to one's 'sturggle' to improve oneself.
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  #28  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:42
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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It is absolutely nothing to do with minarets and everything to do with Basel Fasnacht - the timing is just too close to be a coincidence. The number of Gaddafi floats/themes was clearly an insult to the great man's name and such a slur cannot be allowed to go unanswered...
Not only in Basel

I saw this at my local village parade last week .
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  #29  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:46
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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To clarify, jihad is a noun for struggle. It does not mean a war. In fact it should really refer to one's 'sturggle' to improve oneself.
I'm sorry Yusuf, but I've watched 'Team America, World Police' and it's obvious from that film what a Jihad really stands for.

What ever happened to love thy neighbour?
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  #30  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:48
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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As a Muslim, I'm disappointed to see the usual tired, casual racism that I have to face in Switzerland on a daily basis.

Whilst Gaddafi certainly isn't helping our cause with silly pronouncements of jihad, I'm worried by postings that immediately link all Muslims with kebab vendors.

To clarify, jihad is a noun for struggle. It does not mean a war. In fact it should really refer to one's 'sturggle' to improve oneself.

Ah? I always heard it means holy war, and this was coming from Arabic friends who speak Arabic so i m a bit confused now
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  #31  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:49
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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As a Muslim, I'm disappointed to see the usual tired, casual racism that I have to face in Switzerland on a daily basis.

Whilst Gaddafi certainly isn't helping our cause with silly pronouncements of jihad, I'm worried by postings that immediately link all Muslims with kebab vendors.

To clarify, jihad is a noun for struggle. It does not mean a war. In fact it should really refer to one's 'sturggle' to improve oneself.
our cat was having a bit of a jihad this morning then when i held it upside down.
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  #32  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:52
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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It's a billion people we're talking about, so "most" isn't very reassuring. It only takes a few.

Is there any precedent for this? Has the leader of a major Muslim country ever made declarations like this? If yes, what was the result?

The dear great democratic Iraninan president calls for war and violence against the sionists and all westerns decadent countries every week...and..well Iranians can t even go out of their own country and the ones who are in foreign countries are because they escaped from the crazy guy
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  #33  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:53
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

Oh how I long for the days when Jihad was something the lone ranger shouted.
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  #34  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:53
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

Back when I used to live in America, our neighbors across the street were a Muslim man and an American woman. They had a son whose name was Jihad. I kid you not. I think the mother just never bothered to find out what it meant (*cough*blonde*cough*). I left in 2000, I don't want to know what happened to the kid in school a year after, when most Americans became familiar with the term.
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  #35  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:55
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

That would fall under the thread of "unfortunate names" here on the EF
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Old 26.02.2010, 11:56
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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It does not mean a war. In fact it should really refer to one's 'sturggle' to improve oneself.
I think "sturggle" is an absofookinglutely brilliant word. Thanks Yusuf.
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Old 26.02.2010, 11:58
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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Back when I used to live in America, our neighbors across the street were a Muslim man and an American woman. They had a son whose name was Jihad. I kid you not. I think the mother just never bothered to find out what it meant (*cough*blonde*cough*). I left in 2000, I don't want to know what happened to the kid in school a year after, when most Americans became familiar with the term.
Maybe they had a girl since and wanted to be more positive so called her shoah
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  #38  
Old 26.02.2010, 11:58
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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Ah? I always heard it means holy war, and this was coming from Arabic friends who speak Arabic so i m a bit confused now
That's my 'jihad' with understanding Islam rationally, everything seems to be very meticulously documented as everyday guidelines for a morally upright lifestyle.

I've talked to people who tell me that these are the words of 'Allah' not to be interpreted in any other way than as written. I also have very close friends who inform me that these guidelines need to be understood in the context of the time they were written, and must be interpreted differently in this day and age, this leaves a lot of room to defend irrational ideologies and I think and can have both good (Moderate Practice) and bad results (Wahabi Islam influenced violence).

Being Areligious, I tend to understand religion on the basis of way people practice it. In that light 'Jihad' seems to have somewhat negative conotations.

Last edited by Aquanexus; 26.02.2010 at 12:01. Reason: changed 'God' to 'Allah' following recent Malaysian tensions on the subject
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Old 26.02.2010, 11:58
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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To clarify, jihad is a noun for struggle. It does not mean a war. In fact it should really refer to one's 'sturggle' to improve oneself.
A bit like 'Mein Kampf' then, by that other endearing dictator?
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  #40  
Old 26.02.2010, 12:02
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Re: Libya's Gaddafi urges 'holy war' against Switzerland

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Ah? I always heard it means holy war, and this was coming from Arabic friends who speak Arabic so i m a bit confused now
Like any translation there is a fair bit of flexibility. I'm sure we're all aware with our language lessons that often things don't quite work directly.

With jihad, it is normally referred to as Lesser and Greater. With the Greater Jihad being the internal struggle with faith, and Lesser Jihad referring to physical fighting to be declared against those who have ‘let themselves down’.

The judgement of who deserves a Lesser Jihad is obviously personal. In Gaddafi's case he has applied a broad brush stroke to a whole country he feels has offended him. This is not a 'normal' judgement to make. Most of the time Lesser Jihad will refer to criminals like thieves, rapists etc.
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