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Old 17.12.2009, 03:21
hoppy
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Israel - Palestine - Part 2

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Firstly, hoppy, the groan was for continuing to use Wikipedia as a source of information and still not bothering to quote your source. I've asked before but really, a little knowledge is a dangerous thing...



Absolute nonsense. You really don't know what you're reciting from Wikipedia. Your talk of "empty threat" is an afront to the those murdered by terrorist attacks on Israeli citizens. How dare you?

Do you have any first hand knowledge of the region or read beyond Wikipedia? Ever been there? Knew any of the Victims?

If you have, you'll know 'empty threat' is the very last attitude Israelis believe when the rockets, suicide bombers and snipers vent their rage on innocents.

Ever been in a conflict zone? Ever felt the fear, even as an observer?

Do you know what the IDF's purpose is? To protect Israel and it's citizens. It's not a matter for discussion. End. Of. Story.

Let me tell you what I know: The regular Israeli soldier is so tired of the whole political stagnation, he or she just wants to do their job and go home to Mamma. In the meantime, they take their role with 100% seriousness and competency. The threat is very, very real and it's a kiss away. Don't patronise us with talk of 'empty threats': the reality is so very different.

Next point: fighting the Muslims? Are you serious? Fighting a terrorist enemy is one thing - no matter how asymetrical you may find it - but nobody is fighting Muslims. Your arguments are ridiculous.

"There are no rules in a knife fight"
Hmm! seem I touched a nerve. So sorry that I forgot to add that the quote was from Wikipedia, but it was pretty obvious especially as you say, considering my Hopipedia record.

I was referring to it being an empty threat that Hamas is calling for the destruction of Israel- they can't destroy Israel, they do not have the same nuclear capability, or, as I said before, anything that can really threaten the existence of Israel.

Yes I have been in a conflict zone and had to run being shot at, seen people shot and killed. I have relatives in Iran, they lived through the terror of the Iraqi bombing and I hope will live through the threatened bombing by Israel. I might have to go myself que seraa seraa- whatever will be will be.....

My father served in Palestine and Lebanon before and after the war and went AWOL there- not sure why, but he told me a lot about it. My family has beautiful pictures that he took of snow on cedars in the Lebanon etc. He loved the Lebanon and Palestine and the people. He was stationed on Malta during the war Malta was the most heavily bombed place on earth.

A friend of mine served as a counsellor for the Israeli forces. I have a lot of respect for her. I have listened to many of her accounts


I did not realize that I was capable of patronizing anyone, least of all you especially as you said before that you don't understand what I am talking about half the time.

I believe that the Israeli soldiers are a cross-section, the same as with any of the services. It sounds like you have close contact with Israeli soldiers, do you know any Hamas or Palestinians?

I guess that as Palestine is not recognized as a state they cannot have an legitimate army so that anyone that fights for Palestine against Israeli acts of aggression is considered a terrorist. Terrorism was a tactic that the Israelis themselves used at one time against the British. You can read about it on page 951 /952 of the Penguin History of the world by Roberts, which is a book highly respected by most experts. (Observer, Telegraph, Economist)
This is one of the books that is in my collection. yes contrary to you allegation you write

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Do you have any first hand knowledge of the region or read beyond Wikipedia?
I do read, and if you look back through my quotes you will see that over the last few pages I have quoted from a range of sources. In fact I referenced one of the books that I have read by Trita Parsi within the last couple of pages suggesting that Pashosh might find it interesting. Perhaps you didn't moderate that section and so missed it. I know that you are allowed to take your moderator cap off when you feel like it, but I think that is quite a rudeand rather ignorant remark, which I take as a personally insult. Yes I read and refernce books and other sources, I may not have the intelligence of some on this forum, I make the effort to learn from a variety of sources and people. Also I do try to keep an open mind.


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Do you know what the IDF's purpose is? To protect Israel and it's citizens. It's not a matter for discussion. End. Of. Story.
I guess that Hamas will say the same. They are trying to protect themselves the only way they know.

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Let me tell you what I know: The regular Israeli soldier is so tired of the whole political stagnation, he or she just wants to do their job and go home to Mamma. In the meantime, they take their role with 100% seriousness and competency. The threat is very, very real and it's a kiss away. Don't patronise us with talk of 'empty threats': the reality is so very different.
At the end of their service the Israeli soldier usually gets to go home to his Mama and a comparatively safe home, the same can't be said for a Palestinian.

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Next point: fighting the Muslims? Are you serious? Fighting a terrorist enemy is one thing - no matter how asymetrical you may find it - but nobody is fighting Muslims. Your arguments are ridiculous.
So who are they fighting if not Muslims? I suppose they do fight Christians occasionally. They have bombed hospitals and schools established by the UN. White phosphorus doesn't just target 'terrorists'. White phosphorus would terrify me, it continues to burn slowly into your body after the initial contact, it is a weapon of terror, which makes those that use it against against masses of innocent people terrorists.



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"There are no rules in a knife fight"
I am not really sure what you mean by this. Israel don't have to use knives they have plenty of other arms at their disposal and a highly trained army.

But, yes, I will try to remember to reference my quote in future- my apologies. But truthfully the fire brigade had turned up at my house. The house has hypersensitive-sensitive alarms and I had to attend to them.

Last edited by hoppy; 17.12.2009 at 06:34.
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