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  #41  
Old 13.01.2007, 02:28
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Quote:
Sorry you did screw up it must include your surname - They will tell you this when you try to register it...
Thanks richard for answering.



SH*T

So that means the only way I can keep everything same is if I go for GMBH or AG?
How could I screw up so big?????

GMBH or AG for one man person is waste of money? More headache?
I guess I will have to use the search function here and speak to someone again if it is worth going GMBH etc way!!!!!

* Ok I registered another website with my new name. So if it was MICKEY SHOES before now I have made it MICKEY MOUSE SHOES

*Assuming MICKEY is my first name and
MOUSE my surname.
No I am not in shoe business


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  #42  
Old 13.01.2007, 18:52
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

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Its much easier than that. If your primary residence and that is defined as the central point from which your life is lived, is in CH you are liable for global income to be taxed under the Swiss system. If you are also liable under another jurisdiction you can apply for relief but that is it and if the two countries have no tax accord then you pay in both... Merry Christmas
Thankfully the UK and Switzerland have an accord but I do not see your claim or desire to pay UK personal tax.
Yes, primary residence means that you are both resident and domociled in CH and pay all taxes here. However in the case being discussed the person was suggesting doing tax returns in both CH and UK on what is often referred to case I or case II income and a filing would give an opening for an IOT to get nasty if he took it in his head to do so.
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  #43  
Old 13.01.2007, 20:39
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Richard how do you know so much about so many Swiss things? :-)
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  #44  
Old 14.01.2007, 03:41
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Richard (or any smart person) if you are still with us then could you throw some more light on the following example? I will call the govt office next week anyway to confirm but could do with your input.

Again for discussion sake

First Name- Mickey
Surname- *Mouse
Field of business- Shoes

Register the company name as- Mickey *Mouse Shoes

Example1-
Note- no surname
www.Mickeyshoes.com
mail@Mickeyshoes.com

Example2-
Note- surname there but shoes is missing
www.MickeyMouse.com
mail@MickeyMouse.com


So my question is does my web and mail address have to match my company name exactly word for word or the flexibility in the above two examples is allowed?

I basically don't want to use something long like-

www.MickeyMouseshoes.com
mail@MickeyMouseshoes.com

I hope that makes sense as I am definitely confused
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  #45  
Old 14.01.2007, 07:49
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Your domain name doesn't have to be anything like your trading name.

What if your name were John Smith and every variation of the name was already taken?
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  #46  
Old 14.01.2007, 14:30
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

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Your domain name doesn't have to be anything like your trading name.
Thanks for the reply.

Quote:
What if your name were John Smith and every variation of the name was already taken?
http://www.JohnSmith245598373b090909...32afgfkkjr.com as well?
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  #47  
Old 14.01.2007, 15:50
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Very informative thread and I have read it few times already. Moving on to insurance

Unlike GMBH with Self-employed people client disputes involving courts can result in private assets being dipped into? Meaning courts can order seizure of your private money? So is there some kind of insurance that can cover these situations? In my field the chances of client suing for anything are very low but it would be nice to know what the options are available...if any.

As a self-employed person is there truly a need to open a separate business bank account? What if the company name is exactly same as your real name? How the hell would that work anyway?


Tip- Btw as my business is home based I also informed my home insurer Zurich that I am running a business from home. This I did so that they don't hold it against me if I ever need to make any claims
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  #48  
Old 14.01.2007, 16:17
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Quote:
Unlike GMBH with Self-employed people client disputes involving courts can result in private assets being dipped into? Meaning courts can order seizure of your private money? So is there some kind of insurance that can cover these situations? In my field the chances of client suing for anything are very low but it would be nice to know what the options are available...if any.
How would the circumstances occur that would make you liable for debts that could be recovered from through the courts? If this is a possibility, for example you buy stock (inventory) and do pay for it so your supplier sues, then you need to be a GMBH (limited liability company).
I doubt insurance companies would cover for not paying debts. But if you are craftsman, builder etc you should have some sort of liability cover.

Quote:
As a self-employed person is there truly a need to open a separate business bank account? What if the company name is exactly same as your real name? How the hell would that work anyway?
It depends how large your enterprise is. As a self-employed person with, say half a dozen invoices a month which would go to you anyway, then one account is fine. If you are buying stock and paying for it and sending out multiple invoices then a separate account will keep matters tidy.

1) Herr Micky Mouse (Private account) 2) Micky Mouse Shoe Service (Business account)
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  #49  
Old 14.01.2007, 19:51
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

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But if you are craftsman, builder etc you should have some sort of liability cover.
Who gives this liability cover? Do I ask someone like Zurich insurance?


Quote:
It depends how large your enterprise is. As a self-employed person with, say half a dozen invoices a month which would go to you anyway, then one account is fine. If you are buying stock and paying for it and sending out multiple invoices then a separate account will keep matters tidy.

1) Herr Micky Mouse (Private account) 2) Micky Mouse Shoe Service (Business account)
I just bill the client and normally I send under 8-10 invoices a month. No stock type of complicates stuff.

AbFab I meant that if my name was Mickey Mouse :-) and then I set up the trade name as MIckey Mouse as well then would a bank allow me to have two separate accounts with the same name? Mr Mickey Mouse (Private account) and Mickey Mouse (business acoount)?

Thanks for all the help everyone.
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  #50  
Old 14.01.2007, 21:35
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

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Who gives this liability cover? Do I ask someone like Zurich insurance?
Yes, most of the large insurance companies offer such insurance. However you need to read the small print very carefully and make sure you are fully covered. Last time I look into this I reached the conclusion that it of no use as it was so restricted that I was hard pressed to see a situation where it would actually pay up. In the end I used limited liability company to cover the situation.
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  #51  
Old 16.01.2007, 08:34
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

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Hi JR

How did the setting up business go? I am thinking about settiing up as an einzelfirma but am really struggling to get my head around it all, just read through this thread, but I used to struggle with this stuff in the UK let alone here, is my best bet to go to the Kreis buro (town hall) and ask for their advice?
Nicky
Sorry I have been busy. I postponed it due to some private stuff but still on my way there. You can call this number for more info:
SVA Zurich 044 448 50 00
Depending on your luck you will either get a nice person or a rude MOFO. I think you already have got lot of good advice on this thread. I better read it as well. I am kind of in a similar situation as you.

Anyone know which phone number I can call to get my firm in the phone books/yellow pages? What does it involve? $?

Last edited by jamaicanRUM; 16.01.2007 at 09:02.
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  #52  
Old 16.01.2007, 09:01
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

I have good news for Mozilla person and Nicky. I wanted to use my first name as well and was shocked to catch the bad news contained in some of the posts here regarding family name.
So I called them and the good news is that you CAN use your first name as company name. Straight from the horses mouth ehhh ewwww. The lady was EXTREMELY nice and explained that family name will be used in the registration process but the actual company name is basically a "fantasy" name and you could even call yourself SWISSGOD.

Registration paper work under your family name but the actual company you can call Donald Duck if you want. I hope that makes sense. Pretty pleased with the Swiss!
I hope you did not throw your business literature already LOL

Last edited by jamaicanRUM; 16.01.2007 at 09:23.
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  #53  
Old 17.01.2007, 22:56
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Quote:
Thanks richard for answering.



SH*T

So that means the only way I can keep everything same is if I go for GMBH or AG?
How could I screw up so big?????

GMBH or AG for one man person is waste of money? More headache?
I guess I will have to use the search function here and speak to someone again if it is worth going GMBH etc way!!!!!

* Ok I registered another website with my new name. So if it was MICKEY SHOES before now I have made it MICKEY MOUSE SHOES

*Assuming MICKEY is my first name and
MOUSE my surname.
No I am not in shoe business


Oh Heck how did I leave this thread this long and miss so much... Lets clarify this name business.

There are certain things you need to be aware of in order to answer your question precisely.

1. In order to work as a person doing business you need a Trading As name.
2. In Switzerland this MUST contain your surname - Art 945 OR. So for example if your name just happens to be Mouse your company name must have mouse in it.
3. You can front this name, but you must then be extremely careful. In the UK they have the concept of Peter Smith trading as Mickey Mouse. Here they do not. The best you can do is call yourself Smith mice and have a shop front or something else as Mickey Mouse.
4. So you can have your internet shop called Mickey Mouse as in this example.
5. When you are communicating with anyone you must clearly communicate your business name ie Smith Mice.
6. When you have a bank account then it will only be in your business name and not your fronted name. Therefore if there is no relationship between the two you can have some issues getting bills paid...

If any nice person at the Gemeinde tells you anything other than that then they do not know the law or maybe it has changed and I better go and check - back in a while - I checked here it is for yourself: http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/220/a945.html

Lets go onto the next point

Last edited by Richard; 17.01.2007 at 23:25.
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  #54  
Old 17.01.2007, 23:08
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Quote:
Very informative thread and I have read it few times already. Moving on to insurance

Unlike GMBH with Self-employed people client disputes involving courts can result in private assets being dipped into? Meaning courts can order seizure of your private money? So is there some kind of insurance that can cover these situations? In my field the chances of client suing for anything are very low but it would be nice to know what the options are available...if any.

As a self-employed person is there truly a need to open a separate business bank account? What if the company name is exactly same as your real name? How the hell would that work anyway?


Tip- Btw as my business is home based I also informed my home insurer Zurich that I am running a business from home. This I did so that they don't hold it against me if I ever need to make any claims
Do not believe that a GmbH or AG for that matter protects your private assets from being "acquired" it just introduces limits and rules for it. Furthermore it is not just your private money the courts can seize it is you and all your assets and potentially future earnings...

Yes there are company insurance policies but it depends what for. They generally cover services that are badly given. ie you paint a wall and as a consequence of the wrong type of paint used the surface of the ming vase becomes milky...

There are no problems with using your own bank account it just becomes appreciatively more difficult to do things on the tax front. I mean that is one of the primary advantages of being self employed and if you cannot separate your business dealings from your life then you are going to run into problems in the short term!

And your tip is the first reason you should have a business account. I do take it that you will rent out a room of your house to your company and inform the town hall (gemeinde) that you are doing this. That way you are properly covered...
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  #55  
Old 17.01.2007, 23:13
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Quote:

AbFab I meant that if my name was Mickey Mouse :-) and then I set up the trade name as MIckey Mouse as well then would a bank allow me to have two separate accounts with the same name? Mr Mickey Mouse (Private account) and Mickey Mouse (business acoount)?
we are after all in the land of the gnomes. By this I mean you can have ten accounts with the same name as long as it is you. After all you do not have a unique right to your name and your bank account is after all just a number attached to your name or is that just a number
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  #56  
Old 18.01.2007, 00:02
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Richard you seem to be very knowledgeable and I have no reason to doubt your information but the lady in charge at the self-employment place told me that I could do the following for my particular form (see the attached form image).
In the form and the accompanying booklet I don't see any mention that the name has to have my surname.

I could open a bank account called BOB DESIGN or simply use my current BOB MARLEY private account. All I have to do is tell the client to make cheques payable to BOB MARLEY or BOB design. In all cases I will be providing that info to the client anyway...pink slip, IBAN etc info.
Someone is wrong here and I don't know who but you definitely have me worried AGAIN!!!!! :-)

Can someone else phone SVA and get the info? I already phoned twice and got the same info.




EDIT- JUST saw your link. So the lady is WRONG!!!!!!!!???? WTF!!!!
Now I am 100% confused.

Last edited by jamaicanRUM; 18.01.2007 at 00:14.
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  #57  
Old 18.01.2007, 00:26
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Richard I am reading your link and my German is super crap but could there be a difference between "Private firm" and "self employed" firm? On your link I don't see any mention of "Selbständigerwebende".

Could you please tell me which address can I physically visit to put this to rest? I am in Zurich currently. The address on the attached form seems different from tha address on your link.
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Old 18.01.2007, 00:26
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

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Richard you seem to be very knowledgable and I have no reason to doubt your information but the lady incharge at the self-employment place told me that I could do the following (see the attached form image).
In the form and the accompanying booklet I don't see any mention that the name has to have my surname.

I could open a bank account called BOB DESIGN or simply use my current BOB MARLEY private account. Just tell the client to make cheques payable to BOB MARLEY or BOB design.

Can someone else phone SVA and get the info? I already phoned twice and got the same info.
I do not doubt that she thinks she is right, but she is not! It would not be the first time...

Anyway the link I provided is a reference to the law on company formation and it states pretty damned clearly the following:

Wer als alleiniger Inhaber ein Geschäft betreibt, muss den wesentlichen Inhalt seiner Firma aus dem Familiennamen mit oder ohne Vornamen bilden.

Who runs a business as a sole owner, MUST create the tenor of his company from the surname with or without the forename.
This is referencing the company's naming.

Furthermore there is a document which I have and could scan which is the Rules and regulations for the registrars of company records from 1998. Here it clearly states on page 17 that it is the surname as written in the passport or ID card that is to be used and it gives examples.

I can assure you I am not wrong
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Old 18.01.2007, 00:37
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Quote:
Richard I am reading your link and my German is super crap but could there be a difference between "Private firm" and "self employed" firm? On your link I don't see any mention of "Selbständigerwebende".

Could you please tell me which address can I physically visit to put this to rest? I am in Zurich currently. The address on the attached form seems different from tha address on your link.
In Switzerland at the most basic form there are two types of company. They are a company which does not live for itself ie in English a single trader and a company which does live for itself ie a limited company. You then start to see the sub-divisions of the company types ie single trader, partnership, GmbH, AG etc. But the law at this point is at the top level. You are either a single trader or a company.

The link I sent is a reference to Swiss law hence it is rather cumbersome to read.

A common mistake which you are not quite making is to think that every canton has its own law and therefore I need to check out what applies in Zurich for example. The law is actually multi-tiered. Land, Canton, Community. If the law is defined in the Land then that is the relevant law. It is not very detailed however as you have seen and therefore the Canton and the Communities get to fill in the holes. In this case though it is clear.
For that reason the link I have sent is different to yours. I am referencing Swiss law and not Zurich law.

I googled and also found the link to the document I have which will really put this to bed. Check out page 17! For that you owe me some reputation!!!!!
http://www.bj.admin.ch/etc/medialib/.../weisung-d.pdf
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Old 18.01.2007, 01:00
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Re: How to freelance in CH?

Richard thanks for all the info MUCHO GRATIS So the lady was definitely talking out of her bum hole. I hope I did not kill Mozilla

Ok so to make sure that I am on the right track and to aid others I will make a checklist-

My name- Bob Marley

Company Name- Bob Marley or Marley design or Bob Marley design

Bank account- Bob Marley (business only account...seperate from my other private Bob Marley account).

If I choose Marley design or Bob Marley design then do you reccomend making a matching business bank account of the same name or a business bank account under the name Bob Marley is good enough as well? Just from your experience.

Inform- My town hall and home insurance firm that I would be running my business from home. How do I inform the town hall?

YellowPages/Phone Book- Get my firm in there

Register- with the Handelsregister

Anything else I need to do?

Richard I see that you run a shoe business. What kind of business is it? theracketstore is that the company name or is that a front?

EDIT- Another question. I have to send invoices from clients to prove that I earn money from various clients. On these old invoices I have called myself Bob design. These invoice obviously have my full name Bob Marley along with my other details. Now if I am registering as Bob Marley would SVA Zurich say that these invoices won't count towards proving that I can earn money via my soon to be officially launched business? I hope you understand what I am asking :-)

Last edited by jamaicanRUM; 18.01.2007 at 06:07.
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