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Old 19.06.2017, 10:57
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What is the scam here?

Selling our property in CH. Got a call from Monaco. A self described investor who wants to buy the property sight unseen. But he doesnt have an email we can respond to him on, only a phone. Just wondering if this is a scam of some kind. And what the sting would be. I have heard there are a number of sophisticated real estate scams out there. Does anyone have any insights as to how serious this offer might be? What's the best way to proceed?
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Old 19.06.2017, 10:58
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Re: What is the scam here?

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What's the best way to proceed?
Ignore it.
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Old 19.06.2017, 11:00
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Re: What is the scam here?

Yes of course is a scam. Most likely some sort of 419 variation, possibly just phishing, certainly not genuine. Ignore it, block the number, move on.
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Old 19.06.2017, 11:01
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Re: What is the scam here?

ask him for cash
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Old 19.06.2017, 11:27
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Re: What is the scam here?

One of a few things:
- money will be transferred, you exchange documents, and then the money gets reversed (possible in some international transfers where the original source was illicit)
- you will get a check, same as above. Maybe they will pay "extra" and ask you to sent them the change
- they will ask for some money up front, for processing or some other excuse
- money laundering


I'm sure there's more...
m.
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Old 19.06.2017, 11:38
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Re: What is the scam here?

Could be an eccentric investor (no e-mail?) simply being inquisitive, then again it could also be a money launderer...could even be a famous sport star!
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Old 19.06.2017, 12:02
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Re: What is the scam here?

Use a Notar.
I thought that this was mandatory anyway.
When I sold my house, the transaction was only completed once the Notar had received the money from the buyer.
I had to wait a couple of weeks for the money to be transfered from the Notar to myself due a problem with returning money to my wife's pension.
I would have thought that using a legal middleman would protect you. Could be wrong.
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Old 19.06.2017, 12:35
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Re: What is the scam here?

Yes, that's true. So next time he or someone else trying the same thing calls, say "Great! When can you meet up with me and my notary to exchange contracts and payment." That should sort the scammers out.
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Old 19.06.2017, 14:24
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Re: What is the scam here?

He does propose part cash and then 6 weeks for the rest of the money. Similar to a deal that a local developer has already offered-but closer to our asking price. He wants to meet-soon. We've already had several that sounded like money laundering. This one was different, but still didn't quite smell right. My main thought was that there would be an attempt to get our bank information and it would be identify theft. I know in London there have been several cases of buyers sending deposits into phishing accounts that looked exactly like their banks. But I'm stuck on how it could work from the seller direction. We are having a friend in Monaco check out his name and see if he has any presence there.

Thanks.
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Old 19.06.2017, 14:33
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Re: What is the scam here?

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He does propose part cash and then 6 weeks for the rest of the money. Similar to a deal that a local developer has already offered-but closer to our asking price. He wants to meet-soon. We've already had several that sounded like money laundering. This one was different, but still didn't quite smell right. My main thought was that there would be an attempt to get our bank information and it would be identify theft. I know in London there have been several cases of buyers sending deposits into phishing accounts that looked exactly like their banks. But I'm stuck on how it could work from the seller direction. We are having a friend in Monaco check out his name and see if he has any presence there.

Thanks.
Definitely proceed with caution, though. Might be worth spending money on getting a lawyer to weigh up the risks and draw up any necessary paperwork to protect you. Spending a couple of thousand on legal fees is probably more palatable than losing 10s of thousands on some rat-bag conman.
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Old 19.06.2017, 14:42
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Re: What is the scam here?

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We are having a friend in Monaco check out his name and see if he has any presence there.

Thanks.
Really?

Can you seriously imagine a genuine buyer acting like this? He's doing everything he can to make you think he's genuine, like proposing meetings (that will never actually happen), but in what scenario would a genuine buyer be unable to be contacted in any way apart from a phone? Quite apart from buying somewhere without actually seeing the property, which just would not happen, and then the dodgy financial arrangement on top.

No, he's just playing you now, getting you to believe he's real, so that when he's suddenly unable to produce the cash but has a cheque, or whatever other sting he's trying, you'll have already convinced yourself that the deal is going to happen, and possibly fall for it.

Walk away now - you probably won't get sucked in, but he doesn't care. Just one success out of hundreds of speculative contacts will be enough pay-off, and even if you don't get caught in the end you'll have wasted a lot of time and emotional commitment on this, whereas he's lost nothing.
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Old 19.06.2017, 15:28
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Re: What is the scam here?

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He does propose part cash and then 6 weeks for the rest of the money. Similar to a deal that a local developer has already offered-but closer to our asking price. He wants to meet-soon. We've already had several that sounded like money laundering. This one was different, but still didn't quite smell right. My main thought was that there would be an attempt to get our bank information and it would be identify theft. I know in London there have been several cases of buyers sending deposits into phishing accounts that looked exactly like their banks. But I'm stuck on how it could work from the seller direction. We are having a friend in Monaco check out his name and see if he has any presence there.

Thanks.
At no point in the transaction is there ever a need for them to know your bank details. If you go ahead, the money needs to go into an escrow account that belongs to neither you nor them, money will be liberated only at time of closing.
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Old 19.06.2017, 15:40
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Re: What is the scam here?

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Selling our property in CH. Got a call from Monaco. A self described investor who wants to buy the property sight unseen. But he doesnt have an email we can respond to him on, only a phone. Just wondering if this is a scam of some kind. And what the sting would be. I have heard there are a number of sophisticated real estate scams out there. Does anyone have any insights as to how serious this offer might be? What's the best way to proceed?
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He does propose part cash and then 6 weeks for the rest of the money. Similar to a deal that a local developer has already offered-but closer to our asking price. He wants to meet-soon. We've already had several that sounded like money laundering. This one was different, but still didn't quite smell right. My main thought was that there would be an attempt to get our bank information and it would be identify theft. I know in London there have been several cases of buyers sending deposits into phishing accounts that looked exactly like their banks. But I'm stuck on how it could work from the seller direction. We are having a friend in Monaco check out his name and see if he has any presence there.

Thanks.
1) Lives outside of CH and wants to buy a property unseen
2) Has no email address, only a mobile

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What more do you want, a person with a big neon sign on their head saying "I am a scammer" turning up on your doorstep?
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Old 20.06.2017, 08:19
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Re: What is the scam here?

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He does propose part cash and then 6 weeks for the rest of the money.
As long as registry transfer doesn't happen until after you've received the full amount I think there's no risk WRT to the deal itself. But more may be involved, who knows.

And of course that may precisely be where he wants to catch you, to change registry after the first part. Guess how long you'll have to wait for the full amount in such a case ...
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Old 20.06.2017, 08:48
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Re: What is the scam here?

You cannot seriously believe this guy is in any way legit? Who has no email in 2017? Heck my then-89-year old grandfather had an email address, 12 years ago... And would you buy a property in Monaco you've never once seen? Hardly.

Move on, it's a scam
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Old 20.06.2017, 10:02
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Re: What is the scam here?

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You cannot seriously believe this guy is in any way legit? Who has no email in 2017? Heck my then-89-year old grandfather had an email address, 12 years ago... And would you buy a property in Monaco you've never once seen? Hardly.

Move on, it's a scam
Most scams rely on people hoping that they can make money from someone else...
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Old 20.06.2017, 10:16
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Re: What is the scam here?

Tell the scammer that if he pays you double your asking price then you'll transfer the excess plus 200% interest to his deceased uncle's attorney for his trouble.
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Old 20.06.2017, 10:23
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Re: What is the scam here?

It is worth remembering that the OP wanted to rent the house out for 8k a month last year and was also trying to sell it.

Desperation does strange things to people.
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Old 20.06.2017, 10:38
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Re: What is the scam here?

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Most scams rely on people hoping that they can make money from someone else...
Indeed. They also carefully word their initial approaches to seem naive and/or a little bit stupid, which will appeal to those potential victims whose greed is greater than their common sense.
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Old 20.06.2017, 12:32
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Re: What is the scam here?

Sometimes I wish I was clever enough and ruthless enough to scam people. Just to look at somebody and think "you are my bitch" and take them for a ride must be a skill somewhere along the line.
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