Pretty obvious to you, as it causes you inconvenenience, but not to smokers as by law, they are allowed to smoke in open spaces, therefore many of them will not think it an inconvenience, just another place where they can smoke. (and drink DB's shit bean coffee )

No, in Zürich, smokers do not get preference INSIDE buildings. OUTSIDE buildings, it is open area and smoking is permitted

Asked at Bacher Langnau yesterday. If the do NOT throw cig-butts onto the ground smoking is permitted in non covered areas BUT in reality seldom done. Employees however take care that nobody blocks the passages

I will be at Jumbo Zch Hard later today, an area with far more smoking than Langnau aA


When you enter the openair section of Jumbo Zürich Hard you see the Smoking an sign on the wall plus the text in German and French and italian. Smoking is clearly prohibted in all parts of that shop

It's exactly this attitude amongst the Swiss that is a pretty unattractive trait.

Yes, we all know smokers is permitted outside so stop harping on about it on every other post.

The point people are trying to make is that yes, smokers can smoke outside, and they know that but they all seem to smoke right next to, or in front of any open door, in their masses with so much smoke that they may as well be smoking inside.

They haven't got the courteously to move a few metres away to avoid this because, as you keep writing, they are allowed to smoke outside.

Should the middle aged woman who blew smoke continuously in the face of my six year old son whilst he was eating in a covered outside area of a restaurant be commended for not breaking the law?
Or, should she be seen as a selfish woman with scant regard for the well-being of children?

The problem in this country is the majority of people (including you, obviously) see the former and not latter as the correct social protocol.

That's not the case in other countries where people have better manners.

ftfy

It's the complaints thread. It's a complaints thread about passive smoking in Switzerland.

You ought to start a thread in another section on how wonderful it is to be Swiss because your manners are impeccable.


My wife was in an outside covered seating area here the other day and all the Swiss at the table thought it was perfectly okay to light up, at the table not only between courses but during them too.

In contrast, in Italy recently, at an outside but covered area in a restaurant which was full, anyone who smoked got up and walked away from the seating area to smoke and then came back to the table when they had finished.

But they must be wrong as the Swiss have impeccable manners and not the Italians.

Just wondering .....

If it is right to assume that most of the groans on this thread are probably from smokers

I don't think Tom 1234 smokes.........................

It is YOU who harps around the matter all the time. Always attacking the fact that smoking is allowed OUTSIDE. AND we had to make compromises to get the votes of the smokers in the Canton of Zürich to get the Smoking Ban through, which is one of the best in the whole Union




NO NO NO they are NOT to be allowed to smoke inside again, never ever


The correct social protocol is to accept the federal constitution of 1848/1874 and direct Democracy


And why did you not search for a better table for your son and yourself in order to avoid that ars..... ?

Absolute B0ll0cks.

The correct social protocol is to smoke where it does not affect anyone else.

Smokers are, on the whole, both arrogant and ignorant, and refuse to accept that their disgusting addiction inconveniences everyone within nose range.

The law is one thing, good manners are another.

It's a complaints thread in the complaints section.



As I have written before - public health is one area where direct democracy fails.

Getting smokers to vote on whether they want their smoking rights restricted? That's going to work, isn't it?

You're absolutely right. That is the way it is done here.

As I wrote before, good manners don't come into it.


We had moved once already.

Perhaps if the lady had put out her cigarette, moved a little or even apologised and carried on regardless, that would have been fine by me.

But, no, she spouted on about her rights and carried on blowing smoke into my six year old's face.
But as you pointed out, she followed "The correct social protocol".

Please do not make things up


The first part of your post is wishful thinking
The second part is my idea as well
The third aspect, good manners is a difference again

NO NO NO she did NOT --- not at all but behaved in a very lousy way, But you now make it clear that you had a heavy row with her. Had I been around I would have told her my protocol and she would have left in a fury, She took advantage of a gap in the law and the lack of German on your side. Which to me makes her a perfect arse.......

I didn't say anything to her - I just smiled politely. My son, who is native-Swiss-German speaking didn't say anything either but he may have scowled at her once or twice.

And if she is an arse then she's not alone with that attitude here.

Famous words:

George Bernard Shaw: - Do you mind if I smoke?
Sarah Bernhardt: - I wouldn't mind even if you were burning.

Complaints are always subject to counter-claims -- To simply prohibit counter-arguments cannot be accepted




Direct Democracy is relevant to ALL aspects of life and ALL aspects of politics. Freely admitting that I often detest it, for example in regard to smoking





YES it does. The Canton Zürich smoking ban would not have been possible without many smokers supporting it. And the ban here, a product of direct Democracy, is miles better than the lame toothless federal law which is a product of parliamentary Democracy. Thanks to some legal twists, Cantonal Law is overruling in this case





















































Good manners and laws are different things




NO NO NO, she did NOT do so but insisted on the laws. She was NOT follow any correct social protocol.


But you both quite obviously were în a heated emotional argument and dispute

Did you not read anything I wrote. I said, and did nothing to the woman.

As I keep saying - it's a question of manners and not laws.

(rather like middle-aged men pushing kids out of the way in ski lift queues - no law is broken but I wouldn't call it good manners although people on this forum tell me it's the norm here).

I completely agree, if the smokers want to kill themselves slowly, go right ahead but don't impose your nasty habit on others. I'm don't know one smoker who has not tried to quit at some point, that says a lot.
And it is a matter of manners. Most smokers I see in CH just don't care about others around them, either that or they just have no common sense. Smoking & courtesy don't go together I guess.