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Old 20.08.2006, 13:12
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Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Aren't fight dogs supposed to be muzzled by law? I go biking in the fields and I see dogs in general and fight dogs in particular blocking my path when the signs clearly says that dogs should be on a leash.
Last week I almost fell in the canal as a guy with three HUGE dogs completely blocked my path even though I was ringing my bell from far away. Idiot decided not to control his dogs. Can't people stay on their side of the path?

Another time I was coming downhill and there was a lady with two pit bulls unleashed + baby in pram blocking my path. I am scared of pit bulls! I had to turn around and climb the steep path again In this specific case there were big signs in orange saying that all dogs should be on leash to protect wildlife. I wanted to confront her but one look at those dogs and...

Who do I complaint to about this? It's really spoiling my fun!
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Old 20.08.2006, 13:16
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

I have always found the Swiss to be some of the most competent dog owners I have ever come across. Dogs here seems to be well adjusted, treated well and very obedient.

Relax.
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Old 20.08.2006, 13:24
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

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I have always found the Swiss to be some of the most competent dog owners I have ever come across. Dogs here seems to be well adjusted, treated well and very obedient.

Relax.
Maybe they were aüslander then?
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Old 20.08.2006, 14:28
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Dogs like pitbulls are banned in some cantons, but not all. There was a huge public debate about it recently, and I recall that the Federal Government was preparing something.

Generally in a public place dogs must be on a leash. If you are being attacked, harrassed or otherwise being made to feel uncomfortable by dogs running around without a leash - unless specifically in an area where it is allowed, you need to contact the police straight away.
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Old 20.08.2006, 15:45
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

in Zurich, dogs from 13 breeds should be muzzled; Wallis has a ban on certain breeds.....the rest largely run to their own rules.

Zurich has this week talked about certain legislations for dog owners and dog breeds - some things good perhaps and some things bad.

Any breed can bite you; also consider - someone walking with a pram and "pit bulls" off the leash - how many people do you think those dogs have killed? Go on, I'll let you guess.

Do you know what a "fight dog" is? You honestly have no idea, I'll tell you. And those breeds developed by man for fighting do not turn on man - in a ring, the dogs combat each other but will respect and respond to the handler.

A so-called fight dog will not typically attack something weaker because there is no challenge - the combat, not the winning, is what they enjoy.

And the dogs you've seen are house pets; the fault lies with the OWNER who should have full control on the dog especially in public and should show others consideration.

You should educate yourself before spouting rubbish because you have a fear of dogs. You're more likely to be run over than bitten (statistically, it is the owner who is most likely to receive a bite from "Fido"
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Old 20.08.2006, 15:58
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Quote:
You should educate yourself before spouting rubbish because you have a fear of dogs.
Lob I was not attacking the dog in particular. It's the owners I am pissed off with asit's their duty to control their pet. Plus what exactly do I need to educate myself about? My fear is irrelevant if the owner is blocking my path with dangerous/not dangerous UNLEASHED dogs in areas that are clearely marked with big orange signs
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Old 20.08.2006, 16:01
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

to be honest, an owner alone with three dogs on the leash can in fact block your way more effectively than one with them off the leash. The dogs tend to be doing their own thing - sniffing pee-patches, licking their bums, etc

It's clear that you're scared of dogs and you're reacting very much in a way that a person scared of dogs would.

Cunningly one of the better rulings Zurich is making is education for kids and people as to how to behave around dogs and how to treat them (ie. what to not do).

This is a good idea.
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Old 25.08.2006, 01:29
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

It's no myth that dogs can detect fear. If one is righteous, one can stare the dog in the eye and tell him to chill out. They even smile back. Even non-Jedis can do this.
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Old 25.08.2006, 02:19
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Quote:
It's no myth that dogs can detect fear. If one is righteous, one can stare the dog in the eye and tell him to chill out. They even smile back. Even non-Jedis can do this.
Ermm.. I would air on the side of caution with this advice. In doggy body language, staring him/her in the eye is a threat and a direct challenge to their doggy macho pride... Thus anyone doing it, even to Auntie Maud's pet poodle is going to get right up their nose and as such will be asking for a nip or three...

I recall that dogs actually greet each other by sniffing the others butt... though I don't recommend this either as a get to know your dog technique!
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Old 25.08.2006, 02:31
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

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staring him/her in the eye is a threat and a direct challenge to their doggy macho pride...
It must be the dog in me.


bow wow wow, yippee yo yippe yay.
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Old 25.08.2006, 02:59
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Hi, Humanist
I do not know who you could turn to, as whoever it would be would arrive long after the dog owners and their dog would have left the scene. Have you tried just saying that you are afraid of dogs and asking whether the people could take their dogs on a leach? In this case, it does not matter whether you are afraid of dogs, I just suggest that you say it. And you will never see those people, again.

Our family dog is blind and therefore afraid of other dogs, so I constantly have such discussions with other dog owners. Eventually, I have come to avoid certain places. As regards biking, I take the national biking routes, and have never met a dog without leach - it would be too dangerous for them.

I second the comment about looking a dog in the eye. It is considered a challenge.

Enjoy your bike rides.
Idgie
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Old 25.08.2006, 11:00
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Quote:
It's no myth that dogs can detect fear. If one is righteous, one can stare the dog in the eye and tell him to chill out. They even smile back. Even non-Jedis can do this.
That's right! Dr Lecter does it in the movie Hannibal. Can't wait to try it for myself
=DM=
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Old 25.08.2006, 11:09
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

In today's news:

Quote:
Milliet also believes owning a pit bull grants membership of a group and of a class war. "It's an external sign of aggression – like driving 4x4s."

Milliet declined to create a detailed profile of a pit bull owner as she hasn't studied this specific phenomenon, but she thinks that this external sign of power could be a symbolic counter to the well-off social classes that go around flaunting their 4x4s.
(from http://www.swissinfo.org/eng/front/d...05&sid=7003754)

Now look at the two quoted paragraphs; firstly, this dimwit makes a sweeping statement and then she admits she hasn't studied anything. Excellent. What does that say about the article?
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Old 25.08.2006, 13:28
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

another link, I knew I'd find it again after reading it a couple of months ago:
http://www.newyorker.com/fact/conten.../060206fa_fact

Quote:
A Georgia-based group called the American Temperament Test Society has put twenty-five thousand dogs through a ten-part standardized drill designed to assess a dog’s stability, shyness, aggressiveness, and friendliness in the company of people.

A handler takes a dog on a six-foot lead and judges its reaction to stimuli such as gunshots, an umbrella opening, and a weirdly dressed stranger approaching in a threatening way.

Eighty-four per cent of the pit bulls that have been given the test have passed, which ranks pit bulls ahead of beagles, Airedales, bearded collies, and all but one variety of dachshund.

“We have tested somewhere around a thousand pit-bull-type dogs,” Carl Herkstroeter, the president of the A.T.T.S., says. “I’ve tested half of them. And of the number I’ve tested I have disqualified one pit bull because of aggressive tendencies. They have done extremely well. They have a good temperament. They are very good with children.”

It can even be argued that the same traits that make the pit bull so aggressive toward other dogs are what make it so nice to humans.

“There are a lot of pit bulls these days who are licensed therapy dogs,” the writer Vicki Hearne points out. “Their stability and resoluteness make them excellent for work with people who might not like a more bouncy, flibbertigibbet sort of dog. When pit bulls set out to provide comfort, they are as resolute as they are when they fight, but what they are resolute about is being gentle. And, because they are fearless, they can be gentle with anybody.”

Then which are the pit bulls that get into trouble?

“The ones that the legislation is geared toward have aggressive tendencies that are either bred in by the breeder, trained in by the trainer, or reinforced in by the owner,” Herkstroeter says.

A mean pit bull is a dog that has been turned mean, by selective breeding, by being cross-bred with a bigger, human-aggressive breed like German shepherds or Rottweilers, or by being conditioned in such a way that it begins to express hostility to human beings. A pit bull is dangerous to people, then, not to the extent that it expresses its essential pit bullness but to the extent that it deviates from it. A pit-bull ban is a generalization about a generalization about a trait that is not, in fact, general. That’s a category problem.
So it seems kittens can be saved from the Devil Dogs
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Old 25.08.2006, 13:56
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Interesting read, I think dogs like pitbulls get such a bad reputation which I feel is a shame, its just a stigma attached to them. Dalmations for example, people think they are lovely dogs, after the film many people went out and bought them yet they are renowned for being aggressive dogs, few people seem to reaslise this - infact the only two times my dog has been set about by another dog in a park has been a dalmation on both occasions, I'm not saying all dalmations are like this but I wish people would stop and think and realise that ANY dog can turn, and unfortunately some of the idiots that buy pitbulls buy them for the kudos it gives them having a so called "fight dog" Its the owners not the dogs that are the problem - which I am sure most people know. There should be tighter regulations on breeding and on people who buy 'more aggressive' breeds.

There should also be tighter regulations on so called dog rescue centres. Last year my brother-in-law and family went to a local dog rescue place to choose a dog, they chose a german sheppherd, amazingly they paid the rescue place £50 and left with the dog that day, they had been told the dog was 2, apparently he was a lovely dog, very soft and gentle with the kids (6 & 2). Just less than a week of having the dog at home, my neice (6) was playing with her little brother (2) he squeeling and laughing and in an instant the dog leaped up and attacked my neice ripping her face open, then attacked my sister-in-law when she tried to prise the dogs jaw off my neices face. luckily she only had damage to her arm, my neice has been scared for life on her face.

If they had got a dog from the RSPCA then their home would have been vetted they would have judged whether a certian dog would be OK with a young family - I was amazed to find out that such places exist where you can go and pay £50 and take a dog home that day from a 'rescue' home with no proper knowledge of the dogs character.

When the police arrived to take the dog away, the police dog handlers said the dog was at least 7 years old and couldn't believe that this dog was allowed to be taken to a family with young children.

Anyway I am probably drifting away a bit here but to get back to my original point, a dog is only as bad as its owners - some people are just not fit to have dogs or kids for that matter

Nicky
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Old 25.08.2006, 14:13
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Quote:
Anyway I am probably drifting away a bit here but to get back to my original point, a dog is only as bad as its owners - some people are just not fit to have dogs or kids for that matter Nicky
Well said Nicky! I think the researcher would probably have benefitted from giving the owners of the dogs a 10 point test. As a dog handler and groomer in my past life, the first thing I was told as an apprentice was NEVER put your face close to dogs when grooming them, especially not to Cocker Spaniels, Old English Sheepdogs and English bred St. Bernards, this again was due to human error with poor selective breeding which left these dogs with aggressive natures. Unfortunately, as with many things, the good get tarred with the same brush as the bad and so it is better to be cautious with all...

I think the same logic should be applied to the owners of these macho dogs...let us tar them all with the same brush and assume they are idiots until proven otherwise!

As for researchers who comment on things they have not researched, well this is sloppy, lazy journos, who cannot be bothered to go and find out if anyone has actually done a study, so well done Lob... You managed it, shame the writer of the article did not have youre tenacity.
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Old 25.08.2006, 16:29
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Quote:
one can stare the dog in the eye and tell him to chill out
Humanist, sorry for the bad advise. I wasn't trying to put you in harm's way. Seriously man! I had no idea about this facial to facial dog thing. It's just that when I've had hostile dogs come up to me, I just simply ignore them or bop them on the nose, and they go away. I just wanted to say that it's the fear and panic that'll do you in. Anyway.... take care. Tschuss!
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Old 25.08.2006, 17:34
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

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In doggy body language, staring him/her in the eye is a threat
Exactly. And don't run away either, as many if not all breeds have a chase instinct. Either back away or just walk slowly around them, and try to keep your hands close to your body.

Quote:
Dalmations for example, people think they are lovely dogs, after the film many people went out and bought them yet they are renowned for being aggressive dogs, few people seem to reaslise this - infact the only two times my dog has been set about by another dog in a park has been a dalmation on both occasions
Possibly because so many are deaf. If another dog approaches them from behind the first thing they know is they've got a cold wet nose stuck up their bum. I'd be aggressive if that kept happening to me, too.
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Old 25.08.2006, 17:36
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

Quote:
I just wanted to say that it's the fear and panic that'll do you in.
Absolutely true. They smell it. Don't bother wearing lots of after shave to try and cover it up though, because you can't.
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Old 25.08.2006, 18:05
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Re: Fight dogs!!!!***!!!!!

What everyone needs is a bit of Barbara Woodhouse voice training, so we can all say ssssssiiiiTTTTT! in that threatening dominatrix tone she had... Bring back tweed skirts and sensible shoes... No respectable dog would them come 100 metres near you... Nor would anyone or thing else for that matter.
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