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  #21  
Old 10.03.2011, 14:55
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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Sorry but this isn't true... From my own experiences...
maybe in some third world countries - which are oftentimes third world countries exactly because of a lack of rule of law.
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  #22  
Old 10.03.2011, 14:56
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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In most other countries the legal aspect would be the same, signing on the dotted line would be a sealed contract. What may be different in other countries is that the shop may be willing to cancel the contract out of good will but they do not have to.
This may be somewhat true in business-to-business transactions, but not for consumer-to-business transactions. Some countries have consumer protection laws favoring the consumer.

That's why Americans tend to fight these situations here tooth and nail. They make it so inconvenient enough for the store to finally relent. I've had companies say, "You Americans think you can go anywhere and do anything you want!". Hahaha. Sorry, but we're just accustomed to good service and consumer protection laws.
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  #23  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:00
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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Personally, I think its still possible to negotiate. I am sure if a fluent german speaker goes in with his fiancee, more doors will open than someone trying to address the situation in bad German or English. Why not see if a fellow EFer fluent in Swiss German is happy to go in the shop with your fiancee to negotiate?
I agree, try to talk calmly but emotionally with them. Take the parents in to let them see that it's making the whole family unhappy.
I don't think anyone working in a wedding dress shop would feel comfortable in front of a family who are all discontent. Obviously speak to the manager and ask them if in reality they want unhappy customers and risk spoiling the big day.
You could also mention before coming in to talk about it, that you seeing the dress in question would be bad luck as well???

If it was a loaf of bread or a computer I could understand but a one off purchase of this nature for a special once in a life time event is completely different.

Act quickly because initially they said that the cancellation + a credit note was okay.
Try to start from that point. I guess that the surplus 2600CHF could be used to buy you a wedding suit for you and/or some other stuff.

You could also ask them at a push if you could select a dress from the same manufacturer that's not quite so expensive.
I'm sure your wife to be will look great on the day no matter what the outcome.
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  #24  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:01
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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I guess they don`t care too much about return customers
How many people buy more than one wedding dress?

Tom
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Old 10.03.2011, 15:05
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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maybe in some third world countries - which are oftentimes third world countries exactly because of a lack of rule of law.
Look here:

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This may be somewhat true in business-to-business transactions, but not for consumer-to-business transactions. Some countries have consumer protection laws favoring the consumer.

That's why Americans tend to fight these situations here tooth and nail. They make it so inconvenient enough for the store to finally relent. I've had companies say, "You Americans think you can go anywhere and do anything you want!". Hahaha. Sorry, but we're just accustomed to good service and consumer protection laws.
And Canada....

Not what we call third world countries....
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Old 10.03.2011, 15:07
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

The ridiculous thing is that they should have a return policy. Check your contract and see if you signed it away. You may not even be able to sign away a standard return policy.

With that, you can buy the clothes, walk back in an hour later and tell them you want to return it. Standard practice for young women and most retail stores. If they are treating you differently than anyone else, then they would have a problem in a Betreibungsamt.
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Old 10.03.2011, 15:08
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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How many people buy more than one wedding dress?

Tom
Obviously - that's why Grumpygit wrote that
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  #28  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:09
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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Look here:



And Canada....

Not what we call third world countries....
Not yet ;-)
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  #29  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:10
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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The ridiculous thing is that they should have a return policy.
Why should they? It's not a mail-order company.
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  #30  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:12
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

Fight this! Fight this tooth and nail! You should be able to rescind a contract if the piece hasn't been ordered (i.e. they haven't started the delivery of the product so they haven't fulfulled their part of the contract yet)!

Otherwise, what I would do is never show up again there and name and shame them all over the internet and the 20 minutes.

Don't pay the rest of the charges and dispute this. Find legal help wherever you can find it.

Just because you're getting married is no reason for people to take advantage of you.

I just got married last month and the number of unscrupulous people in the wedding business is staggering. There's enough stress to wedding planning besides having to deal with unscrupulous vendors.

I wish you and bride to be the best of luck, but I'd find a lawyer or some sort of legal advisor if I were you. 2000CHF is a lot of money...
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Old 10.03.2011, 15:14
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

That does not work with wedding dresses. They are normally & especially for the price quoted made to measure. It is not the same as buying a pair of jeans & changing your mind.

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The ridiculous thing is that they should have a return policy. Check your contract and see if you signed it away. You may not even be able to sign away a standard return policy.

With that, you can buy the clothes, walk back in an hour later and tell them you want to return it. Standard practice for young women and most retail stores. If they are treating you differently than anyone else, then they would have a problem in a Betreibungsamt.
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  #32  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:18
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

Of course it is true for consumer-to-business transactions including in the USA. Consumer protection laws are there to protect the consumer from fraudulent selling practises and the delivery of defective goods. The law is not there to help consumers who change their mind. What you deiscribe below has nothing to do with the law, Americans fighting such situations to make the store relent is down to pressurising the store to break the contract. It is not the same.


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This may be somewhat true in business-to-business transactions, but not for consumer-to-business transactions. Some countries have consumer protection laws favoring the consumer.

That's why Americans tend to fight these situations here tooth and nail. They make it so inconvenient enough for the store to finally relent. I've had companies say, "You Americans think you can go anywhere and do anything you want!". Hahaha. Sorry, but we're just accustomed to good service and consumer protection laws.
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  #33  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:19
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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That does not work with wedding dresses. They are normally & especially for the price quoted made to measure. It is not the same as buying a pair of jeans & changing your mind.
If specially made (haute Couture) to order, sure. But those wedding dresses are typically made to be adjustable. The OP said they initially agreed to cancel the order. Sounds like someone simply wanted to make their sales quota rather than provide customer service.

If it is the Wedding dress store behind Globus near Bahnhofstrasse, I do have a friend who ordered one, took it home, went back and returned it because she changed her mind.
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  #34  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:25
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

A CHF4,000 dress will probably be being made to order. I have no doubt that someone is just trying to make a sales quota & I am not defending the behaviour or customer service given but the shop is still not doing anything illegal.

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If specially made (haute Couture) to order, sure. But those wedding dresses are typically made to be adjustable. The OP said they initially agreed to cancel the order. Sounds like someone simply wanted to make their sales quota rather than provide customer service.

If it is the Wedding dress store behind Globus near Bahnhofstrasse, I do have a friend who ordered one, took it home, went back and returned it because she changed her mind.
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  #35  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:27
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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Of course it is true for consumer-to-business transactions including in the USA. Consumer protection laws are there to protect the consumer from fraudulent selling practises and the delivery of defective goods. The law is not there to help consumers who change their mind. What you deiscribe below has nothing to do with the law, Americans fighting such situations to make the store relent is down to pressurising the store to break the contract. It is not the same.
Most contract laws (Switzerland could be different) state that if a party has not fulfilled its part of the contract, it can be rescinded.

The wedding shop doesn't fulfill its part of the contract until the dress is ordered. Given how quickly the bride reacted and called, it is unlikely the dress was ordered. Thus, the wedding shop had not fulfilled its part of the contract yet and therefore the contract can be rescinded by the consumer. Additionally, the customer had not paid full price and therefore had not fulfilled its part of the contract, either. So...no binding contract, therefore it can be rescinded.

In Switzerland it could be different. But given the hard sale, the fact that bride was alone, and the well-known tactics of certain Swiss vendors to hold onto money like hungry hiennas, I think the bride has reason to look into recovering her money.

Maybe there's something like a small claims court system in Switzerland? I'd file a claim there.

What is unclear to me is why the bride returned to the shop after the phone call. If it were me, I'd no longer set foot in the place and communicate with the shop only via official legal correspondence.

Unless, of course, you can send someone to negotiate with them in your favor. Maybe your lawyer. Either way, don't even THINK of giving them a single penny anymore! If you pay the remaining balance then you fulfill your side of the contract you've signed and they can order the dress and you have no recourse then. Do not succumb to their promise of "pay the full price and we will return you 2000 as gift certificate". My opinion only, of course. I could be wrong so insert standard disclaimers here. It is just what I would do in your shoes.

Good luck!
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  #36  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:28
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

Well, maybe so. In any event, OP does have an option to civilly contest it if he wishes. I would.

Call Judge Judy
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  #37  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:32
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

It has been a few years since I studies consumer law but everything you have written is not correct or else contacts would be being broken left right & centre just beacuse people changed their mind. The shop is not doing anything illegal. The contract is binding. Their customer service is shocking but that is not against the law.

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Most contract laws (Switzerland could be different) state that if a party has not fulfilled its part of the contract, it can be rescinded.

The wedding shop doesn't fulfill its part of the contract until the dress is ordered. Given how quickly the bride reacted and called, it is unlikely the dress was ordered. Thus, the wedding shop had not fulfilled its part of the contract yet and therefore the contract can be rescinded by the consumer. Additionally, the customer had not paid full price and therefore had not fulfilled its part of the contract, either. So...no binding contract, therefore it can be rescinded.

In Switzerland it could be different. But given the hard sale, the fact that bride was alone, and the well-known tactics of certain Swiss vendors to hold onto money like hungry hiennas, I think the bride has reason to look into recovering her money.

Maybe there's something like a small claims court system in Switzerland? I'd file a claim there.

What is unclear to me is why the bride returned to the shop after the phone call. If it were me, I'd no longer set foot in the place and communicate with the shop only via official legal correspondence.

Unless, of course, you can send someone to negotiate with them in your favor. Maybe your lawyer. Either way, don't even THINK of giving them a single penny anymore! If you pay the remaining balance then you fulfill your side of the contract you've signed and they can order the dress and you have no recourse then. Do not succumb to their promise of "pay the full price and we will return you 2000 as gift certificate". My opinion only, of course. I could be wrong so insert standard disclaimers here. It is just what I would do in your shoes.

Good luck!
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  #38  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:33
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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Most contract laws (Switzerland could be different) state that if a party has not fulfilled its part of the contract, it can be rescinded.
Sure. But this is only the case if the other party is not willing or able to fulfil the contract, and only if the other party was given enough time to fulfil the contract. This case is obviously different.

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The wedding shop doesn't fulfill its part of the contract until the dress is ordered. Given how quickly the bride reacted and called, it is unlikely the dress was ordered. Thus, the wedding shop had not fulfilled its part of the contract yet and therefore the contract can be rescinded by the consumer. Additionally, the customer had not paid full price and therefore had not fulfilled its part of the contract, either. So...no binding contract, therefore it can be rescinded.
Sorry, but that's just legal nonsense. In any country.
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  #39  
Old 10.03.2011, 15:34
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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Most contract laws (Switzerland could be different) state that if a party has not fulfilled its part of the contract, it can be rescinded.

The wedding shop doesn't fulfill its part of the contract until the dress is ordered. Given how quickly the bride reacted and called, it is unlikely the dress was ordered. Thus, the wedding shop had not fulfilled its part of the contract yet and therefore the contract can be rescinded by the consumer. Additionally, the customer had not paid full price and therefore had not fulfilled its part of the contract, either. So...no binding contract, therefore it can be rescinded.

In Switzerland it could be different. But given the hard sale, the fact that bride was alone, and the well-known tactics of certain Swiss vendors to hold onto money like hungry hiennas, I think the bride has reason to look into recovering her money.

Maybe there's something like a small claims court system in Switzerland? I'd file a claim there.

What is unclear to me is why the bride returned to the shop after the phone call. If it were me, I'd no longer set foot in the place and communicate with the shop only via official legal correspondence.

Unless, of course, you can send someone to negotiate with them in your favor. Maybe your lawyer. Either way, don't even THINK of giving them a single penny anymore! If you pay the remaining balance then you fulfill your side of the contract you've signed and they can order the dress and you have no recourse then. Do not succumb to their promise of "pay the full price and we will return you 2000 as gift certificate". My opinion only, of course. I could be wrong so insert standard disclaimers here. It is just what I would do in your shoes.

Good luck!

LOL if that where the case then a contract wouldn't be worth the paper it was written on LOL
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Old 10.03.2011, 15:41
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Re: Problem with a wedding dress store Zurich

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Legally you probably don't have a leg to stand on.
Sorry to hear about your mess. I agree with Longbyt.

As far as I know, you only have a right to return when it was a door-to-door-sale or a hire-purchase-transaction (hope this is the correct word for it?).

Source (only in German, sorry): http://www.ktipp.ch/themen/beitrag/1013095/Einkauf_in_einem_Geschaeft_-_Habe_ich_immer_ein_Rueckgaberecht
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