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Old 27.05.2011, 16:30
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Old 27.05.2011, 16:31
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Re: Kids in blackface

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(Sorry I deleted my post before realizing you had quoted it, and then I re-posted).

But, yes -- I do believe that evolution works primarily according to "environmental necessity", and I suspect that Darwin would agree.
But what is the "environmental necessity" of having less melanin? Skin colour didn't become lighter because the melanin wasn't needed. At some stage there was a genetic change leading to reduced melanin production. For whatever reason, in colder climates this conferred a selective advantage and over the millenia has been selected for in more temperate regions.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:32
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Re: Kids in blackface

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So many things fundamentally wrong with this statement...

Please look it up... you don't just magically change to suit your environment, it's a very long process involving many many many generations.

Edit: WTF!!!! how!!!
Yes, of course it is "a very long process involving many many many generations." I don't believe I wrote anything to contradict that.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:34
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Yes, of course it is "a very long process involving many many many generations." I don't believe I wrote anything to contradict that.
ok, so go over your statement again...

how many generations have races been actively moving and living all over the place?

now how many years did it take them living in the same place to start looking different?


compare and see the problem.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:35
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Re: Kids in blackface

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But what is the "environmental necessity" of having less melanin?
Meaning that there is a less of a necessity for high concentrations of melanin if you do not live in extremely sunny climates.
  #126  
Old 27.05.2011, 16:38
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Meaning that there is a less of a necessity for high concentrations of melanin if you do not live in extremely sunny climates.
But it doesn't confer any selective advantage as far as I know. We might as well all have just remained dark-skinned, unless there is a specific selective disadvantage of having darker skin in a less-sunny climate.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:39
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Re: Kids in blackface

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ok, so go over your statement again...

how many generations have races been actively moving and living all over the place?

now how many years did it take them living in the same place to start looking different?


compare and see the problem.
Africans (or what are known to be the first inhabitants of earth) have been migrating away from Africa for thousands of years.

So my answer is... thousands of years (which yes is quite a short period of time in an evolutionary context, but man itself is really not *that* old either, when compared to the rest of the Universe).
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:41
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Re: Kids in blackface

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And that's what makes it ignorant and pathetic.

I know that I certainly didn't drop all the expectations and anticipations I'd developed "back home" as soon as I applied for my first permit, I'm sure no one else did either.

So, to groan at her for her "knee jerk" reaction just proves that "you" still have preconceived notions about what people should expect and anticipate from others as well. You're the same... groan yourself.
I tried to groan at myself, it doesn't work.

I hardly ever groan at all, but you repeatedly call people with a different opinion or attitude pathetic and ignorant... well, that's pathetic and ignorant.
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  #129  
Old 27.05.2011, 16:43
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Yes, of course it is "a very long process involving many many many generations." I don't believe I wrote anything to contradict that.
Now you tell me. I was standing outside my apartment and thought I'd fly up to my balcony on the third floor. I waited 5 minutes for some wings but gave up.
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  #130  
Old 27.05.2011, 16:46
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Re: Kids in blackface

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We might as well all have just remained dark-skinned, unless there is a specific selective disadvantage of having darker skin in a less-sunny climate.
Okay, I see your point with that. Maybe there is an advantage, but I do not know.

But this leads me to wonder if maybe someday men might lose their nipples.

Sadly, though, I doubt mankind will survive itself long enough to find out.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:47
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Africans (or what are known to be the first inhabitants of earth) have been migrating away from Africa for thousands of years.

So my answer is... thousands of years (which yes is quite a short period of time in an evolutionary context, but man itself is really not *that* old either, when compared to the rest of the Universe).
Right, so about 30 000 years is is the current concensus, as far as I can remember.

30 000 years, vs... what, 2-3 thousand max that we've really been able to move somewhere. Add medical care and the fact that we don't adapt, we force the world around us to adapt to us...

I'm sorry, no. There isn't an ice cubes chance in hell that anybody's "evolving" without considering intermixing of races.

edit: based on a quick search, it's actually 70 000 - 120 000 years apparently.

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  #132  
Old 27.05.2011, 16:48
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Re: Kids in blackface

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I tried to groan at myself, it doesn't work.

I hardly ever groan at all, but you repeatedly call people with a different opinion or attitude pathetic and ignorant... well, that's pathetic and ignorant.



Perhaps it is a cultural difference between you and I that you are not understanding what I'm saying / I'm not saying it in a way you understand.

I'm not calling you pathetic and ignorant, the groan on the other hand as it shows "you" to be doing pretty much the same thing you're groaning at her for doing!

You are expecting her to look at things the same way you do / take into consideration that things are different here while NOT accounting that she (and I, and Carrie F and others) see things differently. We are accustomed to having to consider what may offend and shy away from it and are amazed / shocked to be reminded that it's not necessary here.

That's all.

Good grief, obviously I'm not the only one pms'ing today!
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  #133  
Old 27.05.2011, 16:51
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Yup. This thread was resolved on the first page. It's the intention behind the act that counts.
We can still let all the late comers have a good time though right?
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:52
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Re: Kids in blackface

If skin color is apparently so important to humans, it surely has to be a factor on reproduction - which I believe is typically the golden grail of evolution. If females prefer mating partners of their own color, wouldn't it be logical for us males to develop the ability to change color? I'd love to have chameleon skin...
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:53
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Now you tell me. I was standing outside my apartment and thought I'd fly up to my balcony on the third floor. I waited 5 minutes for some wings but gave up.
Well, I certainly never meant to imply that nature was flawless.

We obviously have different ideas of what I mean when I use the term "environmental necessity." And perhaps I should have phrased it differently. But what I meant to imply is that we evolve in accordance with our environment. This is why, for example, we may not be upright bipeds if the amount of gravity on earth was even slightly different from what it is.

And who knows... perhaps in another million years or so, we will have wings (that would be nice).
  #136  
Old 27.05.2011, 16:56
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Re: Kids in blackface

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And who knows... perhaps in another million years or so, we will have wings (that would be nice).
Oh, I have Red Bull for that.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:56
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Re: Kids in blackface

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And who knows... perhaps in another million years or so, we will have wings (that would be nice).
Bloody hell. I can't wait that long; I'll take the lift.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:57
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Re: Kids in blackface

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Bloody hell. I can't wait that long; I'll take the lift.
Well, at least we'll grow wings before being noticed by a Swiss waiter
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  #139  
Old 27.05.2011, 16:58
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Re: Kids in blackface

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I'm not calling you pathetic and ignorant, the groan on the other hand as it shows "you" to be doing pretty much the same thing you're groaning at her for doing!

You are expecting her to look at things the same way you do / take into consideration that things are different here while NOT accounting that she (and I, and Carrie F and others) see things differently. We are accustomed to having to consider what may offend and shy away from it and are amazed / shocked to be reminded that it's not necessary here.

That's all.

Good grief, obviously I'm not the only one pms'ing today!
i don't see anyone expecting her to see things differently.
But when someone makes ridiculous claims as:

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if these girls were allowed to leave their homes and go to school dressed in such an offensive manner.

.... you'd think schools would be educating kids, not encouraging such a disgusting level of willful ignorance....... Minus 1 million points for the Swiss school system
Overt generalizing, and making it sound like the swiss has got it against a different skin tone, on a public forum; then expect a public slap in a form of a groan/lolcat/red blobbie.

You need to think that something that Offends you or you regard as offending someone, does not equate as an overall being offensive.

shock on how different things are is no excuse to say such blatantly silly generalizations. I don't criticize her PCness. She could have phrased that differently.
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Old 27.05.2011, 16:58
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Re: Kids in blackface

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If skin color is apparently so important to humans, it surely has to be a factor on reproduction - which I believe is typically the golden grail of evolution. If females prefer mating partners of their own color, wouldn't it be logical for us males to develop the ability to change color? I'd love to have chameleon skin...
But that wouldn't be fair... for only the men to change.
Not that nature really acts fairly.
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