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Old 10.07.2011, 11:52
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

The Fetes de Geneve hasn't started yet, has it?
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Old 10.07.2011, 13:27
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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I realise that my violent reaction will get me flak and that not every woman is six foot in heels with the physique of a night club bouncer to match but they must not get away with it any more. Sexual abuse of any kind is not to be tolerated and there must be consequences. If you think the police won't help you, at least cause the barsteward enough pain to condition him out of the behaviour.
Is this the way you see yourself? I have much kinder and softer words to describe you. We don't see the same girl, you and me....
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Old 10.07.2011, 14:43
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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Is this the way you see yourself? I have much kinder and softer words to describe you. We don't see the same girl, you and me....
My thoughts exactly. From the pictures I've seen, I thought: there's a beautiful tall graceful girl.
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Old 10.07.2011, 14:59
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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The Fetes de Geneve hasn't started yet, has it?

Not till August if memory serves me well. I've often wondered if they weren't held just to entertain the tourists...
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Old 10.07.2011, 15:37
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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Do you Geneva-ites think the city is turning a blind eye because these guys are rich or because it is difficult to enforce (or some other reason)?
It's gone totally out of control. For the time being, the city just take the cash.
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:22
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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It is NOT a "culture" matter but simply the result of them being citizens of a rich country which is a totalitarian theocratic dictatorship. And this means that they, when being outside, want to "play big boy" (in CH-German "d'Sau uuselaa"). And they of course are used that women when seeing a group of men approaching giving way and move to the side. Quite many of them here in Zürich for years had to learn the solid nature of the Shopping Bag of my mother. And her elbow.

Those Saudis also behave similarily in Cairo and Beirut and Amman and therefore are detested by the locals, in spite of the money the carry with them. That most of them tend to be heavily drunk in the evening adds to the mess

"It is NOT a "culture" matter but simply the result of them being citizens of a rich country which is a totalitarian theocratic dictatorship."

this is BS, for many reasons related to common sense and intellect
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:23
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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"It is NOT a "culture" matter but simply the result of them being citizens of a rich country which is a totalitarian theocratic dictatorship."

this is BS, for many reasons related to common sense and intellect
Ok what is your theory then?
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:31
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

my theory is that its a matter of culture and has nothing to do with oppression (theocratic or not). there are many oppressive-authoritarian cultures who wouldnt do this kind of thing, like the asians for example (n. korea and singapore to name a few), and many who are not oppressive who would happily to this kind of thing (italians, turks, etc).

its more related to the "Mediterranean culture" i think
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:46
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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Not till August if memory serves me well. I've often wondered if they weren't held just to entertain the tourists...
No.... when I was a teen it was a lovely event. We'd have a Corso Fleuri along the lake. It was artistic and tasteful. All the boats would park in the middle of the lake to see the musical fireworks. You'd tune into the car radio to listen to the music in synch. We'd splurge on all the rides and rollerskate on the quais from Eaux-Vives all the way around to the other side until late late in the evening. It was fun, there was space and it was safe.
Things started to change around 88. You'd feel hassled, warding off unsollicited attention. It was a pity, it simply became a big city with a very big summer festival.
Anyway.... Geneva does remain my hometown and I still love it regardless of the change.
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:52
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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my theory is that its a matter of culture and has nothing to do with oppression (theocratic or not). there are many oppressive-authoritarian cultures who wouldnt do this kind of thing, like the asians for example (n. korea and singapore to name a few), and many who are not oppressive who would happily to this kind of thing (italians, turks, etc).

its more related to the "Mediterranean culture" i think
No, it is not a matter of culture. If it was, people from the other countries of the same culture also would behave like the Saudis whidch is NOT the case. It quite clearly is the Saudi Arabians who behave in the bad ways as indicated. So, if you do not accept the argument mentioned, let's put it quite bluntly, that the Saudi Arabians are a primitive, arrogant, self-assuming, pompous, idiotic lot , of a country which by some "Westerners" is taken as THE good partner . Italians and Turks do NOT do this kind of things, just to have it mentioned.
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:53
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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No, it is not a matter of culture. If it was, people from the other countries of the same culture also would behave like the Saudis whidch is NOT the case. It quite clearly is the Saudi Arabians who behave in the bad ways as indicated. So, if you do not accept the argument mentioned, let's put it quite bluntly, that the Saudi Arabians are a primitive, arrogant, self-assuming, pompous, idiotic lot , of a country which by some "Westerners" is taken as THE good partner . Italians and Turks do NOT do this kind of things, just to have it mentioned.
you seem to have no idea about all these people you mentioned
  #52  
Old 10.07.2011, 16:54
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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"It is NOT a "culture" matter but simply the result of them being citizens of a rich country which is a totalitarian theocratic dictatorship."

this is BS, for many reasons related to common sense and intellect
For Geneva, Wolli is right, so my experience, it's always the Saudi. A waiter in a Thai restaurant though told us that the Saudis are not the only one to behave like divas all the time, incl. children. Always Arab culture, so he said. I have no idea, I am not a waiter in Geneva.
BUT:
I must admit that seeing how these youngsters behave in Paris at Les Halles when girls pass by, confirms your intuition. Those guys didn't grow up in a totalitarian theocratic dictatorship, or are those neighbourhoods now becaming such moral cultural dictatorships. I don't know. The game consists in getting as many phone numbers as possible, charming up to the point when the women say no and the sweet words are replaced with obsene insults. It's only a game and it's only the young generation and it's only around in Paris (same on Champs Elysée).
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:55
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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its more related to the "Mediterranean culture" i think
I am not sure how related it is to culture. I tend to think it is more related to the omnipresent laissez faire attitude of authorities during the festivities in GE (it's similar, where we live near GE). Should cops be patrolling and actually protecting people, making their presence felt, I doubt certain guests would feel at ease harrassing girls, littering and making a mess. Some people do what they are allowed to do, irrespective of culture. It does seem to be a priority of cops, so if there is anyone to bash...I wouldn't bash a culture/nationality.
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  #54  
Old 10.07.2011, 16:56
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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I must admit that seeing how these youngsters behave in Paris at Les Halles when girls pass by, confirms your intuition. Those guys didn't grow up in a totalitarian theocratic dictatorship, or are those neighbourhoods now becaming such moral cultural dictatorships. I don't know. The game consists in getting as many phone numbers as possible, charming up to the point when the women say no and the sweet words are replaced with obsene insults. It's only a game and it's only the young generation and it's only around in Paris (same on Champs Elysée).
of course.

i know this is true from personal experience
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Old 10.07.2011, 16:59
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No.... when I was a teen it was a lovely event. We'd have a Corso Fleuri along the lake. It was artistic and tasteful. All the boats would park in the middle of the lake to see the musical fireworks. You'd tune into the car radio to listen to the music in synch. We'd splurge on all the rides and rollerskate on the quais from Eaux-Vives all the way around to the other side until late late in the evening. It was fun, there was space and it was safe.
Things started to change around 88. You'd feel hassled, warding off unsollicited attention. It was a pity, it simply became a big city with a very big summer festival.
Anyway.... Geneva does remain my hometown and I still love it regardless of the change.
"became a big city" ? In what way really ? I mean, I liked Geneva for decades. And Geneva in the 60ies and 70ies had more "savoir-vivre" than Zurich, more interesting restaurants, and a more liberal general attitude. To me, Geneva never was "small town", but for its actual size fairly metropolitan

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you seem to have no idea about all these people you mentioned

I have seen those Saudis in Zurich, Geneva, Paris, London, Cairo, Beirut, Amman, Aqaba, and so DO have an idea about them. And I know about the other nationalities quite well.

Last edited by MusicChick; 13.07.2011 at 11:58. Reason: Merging consecutive posts.
  #56  
Old 10.07.2011, 17:03
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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I wouldn't bash a culture/nationality.
GEnerally speaking, yes. No problem.
However...
When a body guard forbids you to walk by the lake because a child is playing, it's a rich Saudi. The guy was there a whole week with that Rotzjunge (throughout rotten spoiled child-king) and my friends telss me it like that every year in August. Not always the same child, but alsways Saudi. The "black" women are around too usually and you have to go as far as 30m away when they walk by. Sorry dear, but the police never ever get involved, they have free hands only because they are rich and saudi.

I am sure that a poor Saudi wouldn't do that. But fact is that the rich Russians don't do that.

EDIT: That being said, I do not always find it easy to identify whether said trouble makers are Saudi, Kuwaiti or Emirati. I admit that too but that would rather confirm the "culture" theory.
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Old 10.07.2011, 17:09
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

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I am not sure how related it is to culture. I tend to think it is more related to the omnipresent laissez faire attitude of authorities during the festivities in GE (it's similar, where we live near GE). Should cops be patrolling and actually protecting people, making their presence felt, I doubt certain guests would feel at ease harrassing girls, littering and making a mess. Some people do what they are allowed to do, irrespective of culture. It does seem to be a priority of cops, so if there is anyone to bash...I wouldn't bash a culture/nationality.
This of course is a different aspect in case of Geneva. I can imagine that Geneva police is a bit "stretched" during the festivities and find it difficult to cope. And so possibly regard badly behaving Saudis as a rather minor problem afterall. This may be so UNTIL something really bad happens.
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Old 10.07.2011, 17:12
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

we seem to be discussing two distinct issues here:

1) men pinching unknown womens "naked" legs

2) saudi royalty behaving like, well, royalty

regarding 1), i think it is a cultural thing, i am from a similar culture and i know. i hate it though, and anybody doing it to a woman i know invites major trouble. so, there is also that, if you dare do this kind of thing better be prepared to fight your way out when their big brother, father or husband comes around. why western men do not stand up for their women in such instances, its above me to argue

regarding 2), i have no experience with, but seems like typical aristocrat behavior no? i dont think you could approach prince charles, william and the red haired dude, or duchess kate and her ugly sister whom media pushed down our throats every day, so easily, no?
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Old 10.07.2011, 17:19
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

No F16, Gulf aristocracy implies thousends of people, European royalty is peanuts and hides from public rather than let a single rotten kid evacuate a 50mx50m square by the lake twice a day for one week.
I will be furious about this kiddo for the rest of my life. And I can't blame it all on one kiddy alone, can I?

And about women: I've seen a Tobago woman with big but arrassed every meter between Paquis bath and the restaurant by the men we are talking about in this thread. Brave woman not to punch them k.o. It was verbal, it was getting to close, it was trying to touch, it was interrupting and blocking the way... it was disgusting. And I am usually a guy who doesn't care about heterosexual circus.

I see no reason to be in Geneva during Fêtes de Genève. Twice I was, twice I was disgussed and outraged. Enough is enough. I wish however everybody else a nice time.
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Old 10.07.2011, 18:30
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Re: Our Middle Eastern Guests in Geneva

This is all news to me. I will be around during the Fetes this August and will watch out for this behaviour. I have seen a lot of Gulf Arabs around these past few days but so far no bad behaviour.
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