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  #161  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:38
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

Thank you. Now this makes sense to me!

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Indeed.

As per the IRS, ex-pats are those who have given up their US citizenship or green card, and are no longer US taxpayers.

So, in the legal sense, I am an ex-pat, unlike most on this forum.

And, I am also an immigrant.

Tom
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  #162  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:39
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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By marriage, yes I am. But, viewed, I'm sure, as an immigrant.

Can you sing the Swiss national anthem backwards underwater?
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  #163  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:41
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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By marriage, yes I am.
Hang on a minute: if you're Swiss and you're on the English Forum, why do you presume that Porsch1909 isn't Swiss, just because he's on the English Forum?
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  #164  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:47
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

Ok. Maybe your misunderstanding me or I'm miss understanding you and the others....
I'm an immigrant and proud to be one! I'm Swiss by marriage!
I would like to feel welcomed where ever I go and hearing from another (possible) immigrant that they do not want immigrants to migrate - says to me get rid of all those who are not Swiss.
Again, if I misunderstood then a I apologize.

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Hang on a minute: if you're Swiss and you're on the English Forum, why do you presume that Porsch1909 isn't Swiss, just because he's on the English Forum?
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  #165  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:48
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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hearing from another (possible) immigrant that they do not want immigrants to migrate - says to me get rid of all those who are not Swiss.
Porsch1909 said no such thing.

Let's play spot the difference. Here are two sentences:

  • Lots of immigration for the sake of it is a bad thing.
  • Immigration is a bad thing.
Can you tell me the difference between the first sentence and the second?
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  #166  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:50
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

Can you? Does that define you as being Swiss?

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Can you sing the Swiss national anthem backwards underwater?
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  #167  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:57
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

  • Lots of immigration for the sake of it is a bad thing.
  • Immigration is a bad thing.
To me its saying the same thing....
It just sounds like a Xenophobic statement to me.


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Porsch1909 said no such thing.

Let's play spot the difference. Here are two sentences:

  • Lots of immigration for the sake of it is a bad thing.
  • Immigration is a bad thing.
Can you tell me the difference between the first sentence and the second?
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  #168  
Old 19.08.2011, 21:59
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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Can you sing the Swiss national anthem backwards underwater?
I am Swiss, born and bred, and I can sing the first 2 sentences- on a good day

Nil btw, most people who move to another country for a job, move for a better job, so a better life. Most immigrants are economic migrants, in one way or another. My aunts and uncles who moved to the USA in the late 20s and 30s certainly were.

Nobody is saying that massive immigration is a good or desirable thing. Neither Switzerland nor the UK can absorb a constant stream of immigrants- it is just the WAY the UDC/SVP go about stereotyping and 'criminalising' immigrants which is so unpleasant. The latest poster is not as bad as previous ones- but the big black boot is a reminder of Military boots taking over a peaceful country, and unpleasant to say the least. I must say previous posters were much better candidates for a ban and more likely to be so for inciting hatred.

Nil i went to the UK for the sheer sake of it. To learn English, see another world- and go to the Isle of Wight to see Hendrix. Then I stayed - so I was an immigrant too.

Last edited by Odile; 19.08.2011 at 22:17.
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  #169  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:00
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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  • Lots of immigration for the sake of it is a bad thing.
  • Immigration is a bad thing.
To me its saying the same thing....
It just sounds like a Xenophobic statement to me.
How can they say the same thing, when each says something completely different?

And how is believing that lots of immigration for the sake of it is a bad thing xenophobic?
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  #170  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:06
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

I welcome immigration!

I just had a colleague explain her understand of the difference.

Not everything is so clear to a person, like myself. This is why I had asked for clarification!




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How can they say the same thing, when each says something completely different?

And how is believing that lots of immigration for the sake of it is a bad thing xenophobic?
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  #171  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:08
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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I welcome immigration!
Good for you.

Now please explain how two completely different sentences mean the same thing to you, despite actually meaning two completely different things.
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  #172  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:11
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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I am Swiss, born and bred, and I can sing the first 2 sentences- on a good day

Nil btw, most people who move to another country for a job, move for a better job, so a better life. Most immigrants are economic migrants, in one way or another. My aunts and uncles who moved to the USA in the late 20s and 30s certainly were.
What about those, like us who move from one country to an other in the goal to learn new tasks to get higher position in the same company (send by the company to other countries)?
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  #173  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:18
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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What about those, like us who move from one country to an other in the goal to learn new tasks to get higher position in the same company (send by the company to other countries)?
I would hardly imagine you were forced or threatend to move countrys.
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  #174  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:21
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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Not everything is so clear to a person, like myself. This is why I had asked for clarification!
My previous post was submitted before you added this, so I'll explain here:

Immigration is a bad thing = a moronic statement which none but the most lump-headed nationalist extremist would say and mean it. Immigration is necessary for all kinds of reasons, most too boring to go into here.

Lots of immigration for the sake of it is a bad thing = mass immigration without thought for the social and economic consequences, where anyone is allowed to settle in a country whether or not he can actually offer something of value to that country. This is pretty universally acknowledged as a bad thing, even by those of us who understand that saying that immigration is a bad thing without qualification is just plain stupid.

If lots of immigration for the sake of it is a good thing, why is it that not a single country in the world* operates by this principle?

*that I can think of.
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  #175  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:22
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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It doesn't make sense to me to say: "lots of immigration for the sake of it isn't a good thing". Especially if you are an immigrant yourself.
Migrating to another country, makes you an immigrant. Therefore you are hurting yourself to by turning away immigration.
It makes perfect sense to me if there is a quota and no skill requirements, then as a skilled person I would be very keen to introduce a more closed system that would favour me.
It makes perfect sense if I am a EU citizen and unlimited immigration from the rest of the world is crushing a county's social services that they limit immigration to people from countries with similar or better social services.
Come on, just because you are something does not stop you from having a debate about if it is good or bad and how it should work.

And assuming that people on this forum are not Swiss is also a mistake as there as a lot of very active Swiss citizens on here.
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  #176  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:33
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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Thank you for explaining the difference as to who are Expats and who are immigrants. But because Expats are coming from another country, that to me still makes you an immigrant.
Its just my understanding. Since my family are from another country and I, born and raised in the States - we are still viewed as immigrants.
An expatriate (in abbreviated form, expat) is a person temporarily or permanently residing in a country and culture other than that of the person's upbringing or legal residence. The word comes from the Latin term expatriātus from ex ("out of") and patriā the ablative case of patria ("country, fatherland"), from Greek Exo (outside) and Patrida (Fatherland, Country).

immigrant (plural immigrants) - A person who comes to a country from another country in order to permanently settle in the new country.

The difference over here being for many of us the opposite of the Americanisation is that expats may want to head home at some stage but immigrants are there to permanently settle.

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Can you? Does that define you as being Swiss?
Yes, when you have Swiss citizenship which gives you immediate rights to vote (I am not sure what voting rights non-citizen residents have) and a passport. Do you have those?
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  #177  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:48
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

Ok. I now understand. Thank you.
And I'm sorry for making the assumption that people on this forum are not Swiss.

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It makes perfect sense to me if there is a quota and no skill requirements, then as a skilled person I would be very keen to introduce a more closed system that would favour me.
It makes perfect sense if I am a EU citizen and unlimited immigration from the rest of the world is crushing a county's social services that they limit immigration to people from countries with similar or better social services.
Come on, just because you are something does not stop you from having a debate about if it is good or bad and how it should work.

And assuming that people on this forum are not Swiss is also a mistake as there as a lot of very active Swiss citizens on here.
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  #178  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:50
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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I would hardly imagine you were forced or threatend to move countrys.
Huh?

What this has to do with what I am saying? I didn't say we were persecuted, running away, etc. I just asked what was the name for this description.

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  #179  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:51
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

Thank you. This information you have provided helps clarify a lot for me...

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An expatriate (in abbreviated form, expat) is a person temporarily or permanently residing in a country and culture other than that of the person's upbringing or legal residence. The word comes from the Latin term expatriātus from ex ("out of") and patriā the ablative case of patria ("country, fatherland"), from Greek Exo (outside) and Patrida (Fatherland, Country).

immigrant (plural immigrants) - A person who comes to a country from another country in order to permanently settle in the new country.

The difference over here being for many of us the opposite of the Americanisation is that expats may want to head home at some stage but immigrants are there to permanently settle.



Yes, when you have Swiss citizenship which gives you immediate rights to vote (I am not sure what voting rights non-citizen residents have) and a passport. Do you have those?
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  #180  
Old 19.08.2011, 22:51
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Re: Complain to the SBB about the posters

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And I'm sorry for making the assumption that people on this forum are not Swiss.
It's OK. I'm not Swiss: I'm an immigrant.
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