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  #181  
Old 01.07.2012, 15:49
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

So Ive had some time to marinate on this. Ive figured it out.

So you were at a bar and you were hoping that this guy was going to be there to ask you "Hey baby, you looking hot. Why not cool down with me and a Pabst Blue Ribbon?"



But instead, you were in a Swiss bar and ended up having these two guys say "Hey young lady, how are you?"




So the real issue at hand is that you were too good for the guys who approached you? Is that it?

So you think youre too good for Swiss people?
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  #182  
Old 01.07.2012, 15:51
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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I heard one of these men talking to me but the music was loud and I didin’t understand him. I approached their table and the man wanted to shake my hand to „know the young girl‘s name“.
I am very possibly being thick or maybe sexist myself here - but at what point does this sound sexist? It sounds patronising to me certainly, but if I offered my hand to someone and they refused I would probably give them a bit of a stare, maybe my eyes would wander up and down too.

What I am trying to say is that in terms of how it is reported, and obviously without being there, Argent seems to me to be the one who was stepping out of the social norms and being rude.

Last edited by Homer; 01.07.2012 at 15:59. Reason: Edit
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  #183  
Old 01.07.2012, 15:56
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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Your comment is actually valuable, the problem is with the other forum users, whose comments aren't constructive, but rather bullying.
This is a forum ,what do you expect, honestly, one has to be open minded when you post anything here, remember you are dealing with total strangers.

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In case of this incident in the Swiss pub, a man offered me his hand while looking at me with lust- that is completely different sort of things.
My goodness, do you realise how many women are looked upon with lust, every day, not only in pubs, but everywhere. What happened to you is not a very special event, my dear. If I had a franc for each and every time, i was looked upon lustfully.......i would be owning google.
And if I was so touchy about it, I would still be single......

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But as far as I read the comments, the vast majority of their authors are hateful towards me and bullying me.
No one is hateful towards, you, dont take these posts seriously. And if its too much, then take a break from the EF, it always helps.

IF YOU CANT STAND THE HEAT, GET OUT OF THE KITCHEN
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  #184  
Old 01.07.2012, 15:57
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

Well, I don't know about the OP, but I'm ALWAYS a sucker for a Pabst Blue Ribbon.*



*Though, of course, having the distinguished palate that I do, I usually prefer a Miller High Life. It's the Champagne of Beers, baby!
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  #185  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:01
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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If I had a franc for each and every time, i was looked upon lustfully.......i would be owning google.
The opposite would be true for me. If I gave a franc for each and every time I looked lustfully....you could call me Greece.
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  #186  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:01
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

Yup, the only time I drink High Life though is when I am in a classy place like "the Paris of Ohio", Cincinnati.....

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Well, I don't know about the OP, but I'm ALWAYS a sucker for a Pabst Blue Ribbon.*



*Though, of course, having the distinguished palate that I do, I usually prefer a Miller High Life. It's the Champagne of Beers, baby!
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  #187  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:02
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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It sounds patronising to me certainly.
Remember that the guy did NOT say "young girl" in English but certainly jeune fille or jeune demoiselle in French. That is not even close to patronizing, rather a sign of polite positive friendliness. It's when you say "la dame" to a woman that it can be rude in an ironical way.
I say it often on the forum: connotations are not transferable through word to word translation. Sometimes, like in this case, you have to reformulate the sentence totally to have in English what the guys said in French. The OP is unfair to this man, because he has nothing to do with connotations of the English words the OP mistook the French ones to be.
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  #188  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:37
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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It bothers me that the overwhelming reaction is to assume she needs to adjust her behaviour, not them. That she was out of line in her reaction, not them. We don't know that. We weren't there. Some information on particular customs are fine. But even the most sympathetic posts here say she should change.

I think women should be able to sit alone in bars and not be harassed. How can I change that? Well, I can raise my voice in opposition to it. If I want to avoid direct confrontation, I can state my oppostion on an Internet forum. Maybe someone will read it and think twice about approaching a woman sitting alone working on her computer. Maybe they'll stop automatically thinking that women like this kind of attention. Maybe if enough women complain, men will stop doing it.

Maybe it won't change anything at all. But saying, "Don't go there anymore" or "Don't be upset anymore" certainly won't.
I don't know whether SHE should change anything.

However
A) she should NOT have risen and approached their table (confrontation)
B) she should have accepted the "young girl" as a compliment
C) she should have accepted the handshake
D) she should have accepted the curiousity of people about a woman sitting in a bar and working on a computer

At the other hand, those two men
A) should not disturb somebody working on a computer
B) should not approach a woman sitting alone just out of nothing
C) should realize that not everybody going into a bar wants socialising

AND finally, that bar-owner defused the situation in a really professional manner (Châpeau Monsieur ! )
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  #189  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:44
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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I don't know whether SHE should change anything.

However
A) she should NOT have risen and approached their table (confrontation)
B) she should have accepted the "young girl" as a compliment
C) she should have accepted the handshake
D) she should have accepted the curiousity of people about a woman sitting in a bar and working on a computer

At the other hand, those two men
A) should not disturb somebody working on a computer
B) should not approach a woman sitting alone just out of nothing
C) should realize that not everybody going into a bar wants socialising

AND finally, that bar-owner defused the situation in a really professional manner (Châpeau Monsieur ! )
And should she have accepted the situation when two men looked on her body, although she was dressed in trousers and long sleeve black shirt?

It is not only words, it's also the way a man looks on a woman, and it also hurts.
  #190  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:45
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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At the other hand, those two men
A) should...
learn from the best how to approach a lady:
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  #191  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:48
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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Nope, not hateful. Many of us just think that you are overly sensitive.
Having spent some time in the region myself dealing very closely with the locals I think that you are expecting them to be something that they are not. It's the way they behave when they are at home. Where they live it is acceptable. You are a guest, possibly even an intruder. If you do not like their customs you can suffer in silence or you can leave. Why should they change the way they behave for you? So, add culturally insensitive to the list.

Of course you can also try and become a prophet, but remember they also came in for a lot of stick and didn't have an easy life either...

So, hateful? No, I don't think so.
Acceptable? If something is acceptable, that doesn't mean it's good for a woman. If the pub looked rough, I wouldn't go inside. As I had written before, I never had a similar experience in the bars, neither in Switzerland, nor abroad.

On what grounds do you state that I was an intruder? By sitting calmly and drinking Ovomaltine?
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Old 01.07.2012, 16:50
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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And should she have accepted the situation when two men looked on her body, although she was dressed in trousers and long sleeve black shirt?

It is not only words, it's also the way a man looks on a woman, and it also hurts.
A) That they looked at your body possibly was not very decent, but shows that you possibly look better than you think
B) also hurts ? Did you possibly take the two chaps a bit too seriously ?
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  #193  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:50
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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So you were at a bar and you were hoping that this guy was going to be there to ask you "Hey baby, you looking hot. Why not cool down with me and a Pabst Blue Ribbon?"

This guy is married... look at his left hand fingers.
Just that you know before picking him up.
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  #194  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:52
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

You have bragged enough about how you dress like a nun. Now fill us in as to what these Swiss Hunks looked like.

Were they clean cut?

Were they good looking?

Did they have money?

Were they sober?

AND were they OLDER than you?

Please answer.......



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And should she have accepted the situation when two men looked on her body, although she was dressed in trousers and long sleeve black shirt?

It is not only words, it's also the way a man looks on a woman, and it also hurts.
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  #195  
Old 01.07.2012, 16:53
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

NO! He's French so it doesnt matter. Thats the French way of signifying he is not gay.....

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This guy is married... look at his left hand fingers.
Just that you know before picking him up.
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Old 01.07.2012, 17:00
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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A) That they looked at your body possibly was not very decent, but shows that you possibly look better than you think
B) also hurts ? Did you possibly take the two chaps a bit too seriously ?
How do you know that?

If a woman says that she feels humiliated and hurt, the common answer she receives is: STOP, shut up, you are overreacting!

I merely described the behaviour of those men which wasn't acceptable. A woman is not a piece of meat to be looked at, she also has feelings. As far as I read the posts, except several really valuable, the notion is that it's OK to humiliate a woman and it is OK when she gets over it. But it is NOT ok when a woman is distant towards strange men.
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Old 01.07.2012, 17:06
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public



Um? I know a place where you would fit right in..... Youre gonna love it. Hot year around. Beachs. Sun. Sand. Cheap Oil. And when an infidel looks at you the wrong way? They cut off his nose!!!!!!!!

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I merely described the behaviour of those men which wasn't acceptable. A woman is not a piece of meat to be looked at,
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  #198  
Old 01.07.2012, 17:10
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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I merely described the behaviour of those men which wasn't acceptable.
I think this is the key phrase here, most of us (yes, I am generalising hugely) cannot figure out how this behaviour was not acceptable as you seem to have been willing to engage in a discussion with them and then turned down what appears to me to be a friendly offer of a handshake.
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Old 01.07.2012, 17:11
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

And this communiqué just in from the Sion Police:

"Please be on the lookout for potential handshakers or other deviants who may, or may not, be looking in a slightly sexist way at members of the opposite sex. Furthermore, whilst this may well concern 98% of the male population, we would like to point out that even if a hand is shaken that it probably won't lead to the immaculate conception. However, this may possibly be linked to another event some 2012 years ago and although we are still following up on a few leads, we don't have much new to go on. Mary was unable to take a lie detector test at the time because they hadn't invented them yet. But even if they had, it would have required a few more thousand years for electricity to have been made available at a suitable socket so that we could have plugged the thing in."
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Old 01.07.2012, 17:16
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Re: Unwanted sexist comments from men in public

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On what grounds do you state that I was an intruder? By sitting calmly and drinking Ovomaltine?
In many cases in small villages in the Valais, merely be not being a local and by being there and by acting "strange". And I say "strange" because they probably don't witness too many single woman going into the bar with their laptop at night. For heaven's sake, we are not talking about Starbucks.

And by the way, don't put words into my mouth. I didn't say you were an intruder, I said that you may have been as far as the locals are concerned.

Looking at your post history I can see that you are a very sensitive person. Your first post was complaining about questions that HR asked you (yes, you can ask questions here that you couldn't ask elsewhere). Then you got bent out of shape about a slightly "Xenophobic" question (that may actually have been quite innocent depending on how good the person's English was). Then you were complaining that social services were putting you under pressure because you were on benefits and they wanted to know what your plans were (yes, this is not the UK and I am glad that they try and ensure my tax money goes to those who genuinely may need it). Then you wanted to protest about the recent assisted suicide vote passed in the canton of Vaud (where incidentally you no longer live, and which anyway was voted by a majority of those voting, which is actually what democracy is all about, even if you disagree). And now unwanted sexist comments....

Maybe these guys actually knew you and were hoping that you would leave? You just sound like someone who is really, very, very, high maintenance....
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