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  #21  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:12
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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Why do about 80% of cyclists think that regulations (red lights, give way signs) don't apply to them?
Just like the 80% of motorists (myself included) who think that speed limits don't apply to them, then? Anyway, although some cyclists do disregard such things some time, it's n no way a majority.

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Cycle paths are just part of that. Legally, if there is a cycle path, cyclists are supposed to use it, but then they're supposed to stop at red lights too.
Rubbish.

I've seen that this is so in some US cities, with disastrous results, but it certainly ain't the case in CH.
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  #22  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:16
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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Legally, you must use a cycle lane if present subject to a fine (don't recall the magnitude - probably 80 CHF).
Got a reference for that, have you?
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  #23  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:17
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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Why?
Because it's usually quicker, safer and less hassle, is why.
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  #24  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:17
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

Ace1,

I repeat, legally you are obliged to use the cycle path if it is available. I don't like it but that is the federal law in Switzerland.
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Old 03.08.2012, 09:18
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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Rubbish.

I've seen that this is so in some US cities, with disastrous results, but it certainly ain't the case in CH.
Cyclists HAVE TO stop at traffic lights when these traffic lights are RED. This is not an idea of me, it is federal law
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  #26  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:21
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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Why do about 80% of cyclists think that regulations (red lights, give way signs) don't apply to them? Cycle paths are just part of that. Legally, if there is a cycle path, cyclists are supposed to use it, but then they're supposed to stop at red lights too.
Yup then you still find the buggers in the middle of the road, running into pedestrians (me) mouthing off demanding and getting (bloody ball-less insurance) 800 Chuff's.
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  #27  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:21
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

I have found sometimes cycle lanes more dangerous than being apart of the traffic flow. this was espeically the case in london. The amount of times i was riding in my little lane, was passed by a motorist who shortly after wanted to turn left and cut accross my lane to get into a side street almost resulting in a collision was incredible! Drove me nuts!!!

A good cyclist on the road is less of an obstruction than a piece of farmers equipment or a slow truck or a bus. Which often slow traffic too.
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  #28  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:22
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

I'm sure you all speak German:

http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/7/741.01.de.pdf

Art.46.1

(Looks like I'm the only one who can actually be bothered to type the relevant search terms into Google...)
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  #29  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:23
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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... Legally, if there is a cycle path, cyclists are supposed to use it,...
I'd like a reference for that too. Or does it join the same principle as "80% of statistics are invented on the spot"?

In the UK there was a court case where a cyclist chose to cycle up a hill on the road, rather than on the path to the right of the road (shared with pedestrians, not well maintained). He was arrested, because a car overtaking him was forced over the single while line in the centre of the road. The judge agreed.

There was an appeal, and it was established that cyclists do not have to use cycle lanes.

I guess the exception would be if the road was marked with a "no-cycling" sign.

Anyway, that's the UK. What's the status - with references - here?

(Btw, I reckon the majority of cyclists ride safely and defensively. It's just the minority behaving stupidly (ignoring red lights, pedestrians, pulling out into traffic without looking, or, my particular bug bear - riding without lights) that we notice (or in the latter case, notice almost too late)).
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  #30  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:23
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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I love bikes and am always very respectful (and wary) of cyclists, but I'm not sure that criticizing a driver for wanting to get to the Migros before it closes is fair if the cyclist is a dude just trying to beat his personal best between Adliswil and Sihlbrugg.
Uh oh, Silverburn thinks to himself...I hope he doesn't mean me...

In my defence, I do stick to the cycle lane at all times; I'm another UK cyclist, and compared to back home the Swiss lanes are bloody paradise. I have also found the swiss drivers very respectful - apart from that one **** who insisted on blocking the cycle lane because he was turning right 1/2 a km ahead but was stuck in a queue, and who gave me abuse when I passed him.

Interesting side note: The Adlibach - Sihlbrugg section has no cycle lane, but on the downhill section I am actually faster than most of the cars. Perhaps we can relegate the cars to a slow lane to allow us cyclists to pass...? Also noted: The Neuheim cameras are set to over 36mph/57kph - I have yet to find their trigger speed.
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  #31  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:25
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

I usually drive (or used to) over to Elisabethenstrasse in Basel, going over the bridge and many times have I been 'overtaken from the right' by a crazy cyclist trying to overtake their fellow cyclists on the bike lane...that is seriously dangerous and it really annoys me...
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  #32  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:30
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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I'm sure you all speak German:
I do, at least.

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http://www.admin.ch/ch/d/sr/7/741.01.de.pdf

Art.46.1

(Looks like I'm the only one who can actually be bothered to type the relevant search terms into Google...)
I don't see anything in section 1 (I didn't read the rest) that mandates the usage of cyclist lanes where they are available. Admittedly my German isn't perfect, but perhaps you can clarify that?
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  #33  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:33
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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I usually drive (or used to) over to Elisabethenstrasse in Basel, going over the bridge and many times have I been 'overtaken from the right' by a crazy cyclist trying to overtake their fellow cyclists on the bike lane...that is seriously dangerous and it really annoys me...
It is? Were you trying to turn right at the time? Not right into the path of both cyclists I hope? And if he "overtook" you, how slow were you driving?

From this description, it sounds like you were the hazard, not him. Perhaps some re-wording is required.
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  #34  
Old 03.08.2012, 09:34
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

Art.46
1 Radfahrer müssen die Radwege und -streifen benützen

and whilst we're at it, cyclists are also prohibited from riding two-abreast (some exceptions are foreseen) (art. 46.2)

Once more, I don't think these rules are particularly conducive to safe travel however they are the law here.

EDIT and I'm a little surprised that several people are clamouring for references - surely you have all read the Swiss highway code in order to familiarise yourselves with the rules and regulations here in Switzerland

Last edited by Jekyll; 03.08.2012 at 09:47.
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  #35  
Old 03.08.2012, 10:51
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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Cyclists are traffic.
I wish someone would tell the cyclists that

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EDIT and I'm a little surprised that several people are clamouring for references - surely you have all read the Swiss highway code in order to familiarise yourselves with the rules and regulations here in Switzerland
Say what?
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  #36  
Old 03.08.2012, 11:08
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

I ride bikes on footpath / pedestrian path.... and walkers are annoyed .
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  #37  
Old 03.08.2012, 11:15
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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I ride bikes on footpath / pedestrian path.... and walkers are annoyed .
Justifiably so....
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Old 03.08.2012, 11:19
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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I ride bikes on footpath / pedestrian path.... and walkers are annoyed .
Tell me your not surprised by that
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  #39  
Old 03.08.2012, 11:26
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

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Really? In which cantons? .
The whole of Switzerland....

Art. 33 Piste cyclable, chemin pour piétons, allée d’équitation

1 Le signal «Piste cyclable» (2.60) oblige les conducteurs de cycles et de cyclomoteurs à deux roues à emprunter la piste qui leur est indiquée par ce signal

RS 741.21 Ordonnance sur la signalisation routière
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  #40  
Old 03.08.2012, 11:30
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Re: Cyclists who don't use cycle lanes

My cycling experience in Zurich is that most cars are respectful but few angry drivers can't stand to be behind a bike. As soon as there's the smallest space, they zoom by and get back the 50m they've lost behind you.
I always think that they should be grateful that I'm sweating on a small bike rather than adding to the traffic with my car.
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