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  #41  
Old 23.08.2012, 09:31
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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What do you mean. That is exactly what they claim, that I have put myself under their guardianship. What do you mean that it can not be revoked
Then that is a big problem. In Switzerland, once you are under guardianship, it is almost impossible to end it.

There are various degrees, see here.

Tom
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  #42  
Old 23.08.2012, 10:30
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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Then that is a big problem. In Switzerland, once you are under guardianship, it is almost impossible to end it.

There are various degrees, see here.

Tom
Thank you Tom. I am so worried. In the link you provided it is written "A person can only be placed under guardianship due to mental illness or mental deficiency if an expert psychiatric opinion has been obtained". I do not understand how they obtained papers to support this. Or they found two "friends" to sign that I am mentally ill. However I have never lived in Switzerland and I was never examined. Oh, my god, what shall I do.
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  #43  
Old 23.08.2012, 10:36
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

Get legal advice.
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  #44  
Old 23.08.2012, 11:18
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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Thank you Tom. I am so worried. In the link you provided it is written "A person can only be placed under guardianship due to mental illness or mental deficiency if an expert psychiatric opinion has been obtained". I do not understand how they obtained papers to support this. Or they found two "friends" to sign that I am mentally ill. However I have never lived in Switzerland and I was never examined. Oh, my god, what shall I do.
All this says is that if you were mentally ill they would not need you to sign anything, they could just do it without your signature. I don't think this is relevant. It does sound like you need a different lawyer as you are not happy with the first.
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  #45  
Old 23.08.2012, 11:20
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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In the link you provided it is written "A person can only be placed under guardianship due to mental illness or mental deficiency if an expert psychiatric opinion has been obtained".
That, however, does not mean that that is the only way to be placed under guardianship, as one is free to request it or can be ordered for "mismanagement". So, if the document was a request for your affairs in Switzerland to be placed under guardianship, and you signed it, that's enough (my wife knows several people who have done so voluntarily due to problems managing their lives).

Tom
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  #46  
Old 23.08.2012, 14:59
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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That, however, does not mean that that is the only way to be placed under guardianship, as one is free to request it or can be ordered for "mismanagement". So, if the document was a request for your affairs in Switzerland to be placed under guardianship, and you signed it, that's enough (my wife knows several people who have done so voluntarily due to problems managing their lives).

Tom
If I understood all advices properly I should do as follows:
1. Find a good lawyer (I would appreciate very much any suggestion)
2. Rescend PoA with relevant cantonal authorities and inform all related institutions involved by registered mail
3. Contact Amsthouse
4. Try to get my pension back directly through the pension funds
5. If it all fails file a criminal charge for forgery of my signature with pension funds and for fraud with PoA (last option)

My husband did not want to live in Switzerland. He did not want to be even burried there. His ashes are with me by his own request. I know now why. The other proble (aside of finacial aspect) for me is that I deeply loved my husband (forever shall) and I am very hurt that they disrespected his Will ("My wife will be sole tutor and guardian of my children and all my financial affairs. All other authorisations apart of hers shall be imediatelly deemed invalid"). They do not allow that. They took over our lives, they want total control, to make decisions over children and we have seen them only couple of times in our lives. Unknown cruel people. They told me that my children will be taken away from me. Luckily for me both my children were born here in Montenegro and they can forget about that. No money in the world would help them here to take away children from their mother (Wild Montenegro)
Thank you Tom. Thank you so much. I am completely excluded, ignored, considered dead, even tghough I still move and breath. Helpless. If you ever come to Montenegro please any of you who were helping me in this forum feel free to write me an email and shall take you to a Montenegrin dinner It will be my honour to meet you in person.

Last edited by jrspet; 23.08.2012 at 15:33. Reason: Removed email address as per forum rules
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  #47  
Old 23.08.2012, 15:29
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

I can't provide any help Branka, sorry.

I just want to tell you how horrible I feel for you and it must be such a terrible situation. I really really hope things will work out and you will be able to grieve in peace. It is already a difficult situation to lose a man you love, a father of your children without having to deal with something so shameful.

My thoughts are with you.
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  #48  
Old 23.08.2012, 15:34
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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If I understood all advices properly I should do as follows:
1. Find a good lawyer (I would appreciate very much any suggestion)
2. Rescend PoA with relevant cantonal authorities and inform all related institutions involved by registered mail
3. Contact Amsthouse
4. Try to get my pension back directly through the pension funds
5. If it all fails file a criminal charge for forgery of my signature with pension funds and for fraud with PoA (last option)

My husband did not want to live in Switzerland. He did not want to be even burried there. His ashes are with me by his own request. I know now why. The other proble (aside of finacial aspect) for me is that I deeply loved my husband (forever shall) and I am very hurt that they disrespected his Will ("My wife will be sole tutor and guardian of my children and all my financial affairs. All other authorisations apart of hers shall be imediatelly deemed invalid"). They do not allow that. They took over our lives, they want total control, to make decisions over children and we have seen them only couple of times in our lives. Unknown cruel people. They told me that my children will be taken away from me. Luckily for me both my children were born here in Montenegro and they can forget about that. No money in the world would help them here to take away children from their mother (Wild Montenegro)
Thank you Tom. Thank you so much. I am completely excluded, ignored, considered dead, even tghough I still move and breath. Helpless. If you ever come to Montenegro please any of you who were helping me in this forum feel free to write me an email and shall take you to a Montenegrin dinner It will be my honour to meet you in person. My adress

You've summed it up pretty well there I think but if I were you I wouldn't put my private email address on a public forum. (especially given the circumstances)

Last edited by jrspet; 23.08.2012 at 15:35. Reason: Quotes deleted text
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  #49  
Old 23.08.2012, 15:37
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

And Branka, if this is any consolation, this kinda thing also happens from where I come from ( Asia ) and Australia, so please do not assume that everyone in CH or elsewhere is like that.

I wish you all the best in your endeavours and invite you to keep visiting the forum.
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Old 23.08.2012, 15:51
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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You've summed it up pretty well there I think but if I were you I wouldn't put my private email address on a public forum. (especially given the circumstances)
Thank you so much, you are right. It is just my personality, I have nothing to hide, have done nothing wrong. But it is much wiser not to expose myself to any further troubles. I have enough of them already. Thank you.
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  #51  
Old 23.08.2012, 15:56
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

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And Branka, if this is any consolation, this kinda thing also happens from where I come from ( Asia ) and Australia, so please do not assume that everyone in CH or elsewhere is like that.

I wish you all the best in your endeavours and invite you to keep visiting the forum.
Oh no, I shall never think like that. I have lived all over the world and have met so many good people like you are. The bad ones are just very loud and I like the sound of silence. Thank you for your nice words.
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  #52  
Old 23.08.2012, 16:36
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

.. and the bottom line is NEVER EVER EVER EVER ... and go on 100 times ... EVER! sign a document without fully understanding it.
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  #53  
Old 23.08.2012, 17:30
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Re: Inheritance - ( alleged ) forgery ( Fraud / Deception )

I don't know anything about the legal issues, so I will stay out of that. However, it is 100% solid advice never to sign anything in a language you don't understand. Tell the person(s) you'll consider it and leave with the document in your hand. At the very least, take a copy and do the easiest thing possible: go to www.translate.google.com and type in the text letter for letter including any accents or symbols.

It is not perfect by any stretch, but you can quickly get a sense of whether a document is asking you to sign over your rights (or money) or is just informational. From there you can decide whether you need further assistance or if you can just sign.

Good luck!
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