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Old 07.09.2012, 17:05
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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As I understand it: "I think I have problems with a racist Swiss lady that believes she owns the building and therefore s me. How do I solve it?"

Proposed solution so far: Start a war and don't look for allies even if you don't know she actually is the bad guy here (because all Swiss and old Swiss ladies in general just behave like that so it's obvious she must be the bad guy and it's not even worth discussing with them.)

Yes, good strategy.
Oh, you've missed the point. Clearly the point is not to "make friends with a little old lady"...

The point is: "little old lady stresses me out. Let's see how we can turn this around so that I am no longer stressed out, and perhaps even get some entertainment out of it."

I'm not harming little old lady by putting her junk mail outside her door, where it belongs. And I'm contributing to her health, for if she goes up the flight of stairs it takes to put the junk mail back on MY door, she gets exercise, too!

So I'm actually probably helping extend this woman's lifespan. Lots of good karma everywhere. If only the Swiss little old ladies were as nice as I am.

And good karma to you too! Or am I not helping make your workday a little bit more interesting?

Right, guys, need to go shopping now. I'll let you know how it goes for the next few days, I'm still taking bets for how long the junk mail pile will be making the rounds in my building. Correct guesser gets a prize! Let's see...I'll make it interesting...a date with me, how's that? Or maybe a pizza. Don't worry, I'll think of something.
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  #22  
Old 07.09.2012, 17:09
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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Oh, you've missed the point. Clearly the point is not to "make friends with a little old lady"...

The point is: "little old lady stresses me out. Let's see how we can turn this around so that I am no longer stressed out, and perhaps even get some entertainment out of it."

I'm not harming little old lady by putting her junk mail outside her door, where it belongs. And I'm contributing to her health, for if she goes up the flight of stairs it takes to put the junk mail back on MY door, she gets exercise, too!

So I'm actually probably helping extend this woman's lifespan. Lots of good karma everywhere. If only the Swiss little old ladies were as nice as I am.

And good karma to you too! Or am I not helping make your workday a little bit more interesting?

Right, guys, need to go shopping now. I'll let you know how it goes for the next few days, I'm still taking bets for how long the junk mail pile will be making the rounds in my building. Correct guesser gets a prize! Let's see...I'll make it interesting...a date with me, how's that? Or maybe a pizza. Don't worry, I'll think of something.
Never said you should be friends.
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  #23  
Old 07.09.2012, 17:11
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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Well, I like those 'old Swiss ladies', in general they keep things in order at their own risk of being disliked. We all want to live in a decent place. I'm not averse to complaining when need be either (being an old Swiss gentleman). But I wouldn't blame something on anyone unless I knew that they were 'the one', and then, depending on various factors I'd consider my options. In this case removing a few sheets of paper wouldn't get my knickers in a twist. But the last thing I'd do is (passively?) aggravate the situation, we should all look at our own doorstep first.
I like the little old Swiss ladies too. But I don't take it personally in that I assume they are like that with everyone and not just me. But I'm used to this type of busy body. So I'm already trained in nodding and smiling and commiserating without actually listening too much.

We have an old cousin in the family who is like this. She really only wants to hear herself talk. So we give her an ear every once in a while. The trick though is to listen just enough, but not too much or you'll become her new best friend.
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Old 07.09.2012, 17:15
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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True, I don't know if it was the little old lady or not....

But past behavior predicts future behavior. Our Housewart doesn't live in our building, and I can't imagine any of the other neighbors going through the trouble of collecting some junk mail that isn't theirs then putting it outside someone's door, either.

Here's what I think is going to happen. If it turns out it is not the little old lady, then she won't know it was me who put the papers there. So she will either take care of the papers, or put them outside the door of who she happens to suspect put them outside HER door.

If the papers end up outside my door, because she suspects me (and again, WHY should she suspect me if she doesn't know I put them outside her door? I guess cuz I'm "the foreigner"?) I'll pass them along to her again (and in fact if the papers end up on my door again it will confirm it was indeed her who put them outside my door in the first place...otherwise she wouldn't know who put them outside her door!). It will be an interesting experiment, to see how long the "paper passing game" actually lasts....anyone want to place some bets?
In fact there is a pile of paper in Unterbünzlihofen that neighbours have been passing from door to door since 1964.
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  #25  
Old 07.09.2012, 19:21
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

I assume you are an adult person? So why on earth don't you just ask the lady directly instead of just assuming that she is the "culprit". In Switzerland we might know the expression "passive agression" but we know expressions "Klatsch, Tratsch und Feigheit".
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  #26  
Old 07.09.2012, 19:34
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

I like my neighbors and have no problems (knock wood). I am going to give them a big hug when they get home from work.
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  #27  
Old 07.09.2012, 20:14
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

Swiss people are often like walnuts. If you dare to crack them it's nothing but marzipan inside. But you have to make the first step.
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Old 07.09.2012, 20:16
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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Swiss people are often like walnuts. If you dare to crack them it's nothing but marzipan inside. But you have to make the first step.
Not cheese??
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Old 07.09.2012, 20:29
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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Not cheese??

depends if they have washed recently
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  #30  
Old 07.09.2012, 20:29
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

Cheese is just something else we try to sell to those foreigners who think it's "typical". I mean, honestly, did you ever try to eat a cheese fondue?
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  #31  
Old 07.09.2012, 20:31
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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Cheese is just something else we try to sell to those foreigners who think it's "typical". I mean, honestly, did you ever try to eat a cheese fondue?
Yup ... just the once.
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Old 07.09.2012, 20:43
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

About the remarks : What is wrong with just saying thank you with a big smile and keep doing what ever you do as usual? I can't count the number of "yes" I've said that were straight lies both in Switzerland and in Scandinavia before. No big deal.

About the paper pile: What is wrong with taking it downstairs and make a big card with written on it "Who ever forgot that in the corridor might want to collect it him/herself, so here you go*". No big deal either.


* Wer auch immer dies auf dem Flur vergessen hat, mag es selber wieder aufheben wollen - also: bitte schön.
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Old 07.09.2012, 20:56
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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About the remarks : What is wrong with just saying thank you with a big smile and keep doing what ever you do as usual? I can't count the number of "yes" I've said that were straight lies both in Switzerland and in Scandinavia before. No big deal.

About the paper pile: What is wrong with taking it downstairs and make a big card with written on it "Who ever forgot that in the corridor might want to collect it him/herself, so here you go*". No big deal either.


* Wer auch immer dies auf dem Flur vergessen hat, mag es selber wieder aufheben wollen - also: bitte schön.
I agree.

Sometimes here you just have to learn to play the game.

Think back to how you used to behave when you 5 years old, and that's how it works here.....with adults

But, it is fun, just like it was when you were 5
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  #34  
Old 07.09.2012, 21:00
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

I don't think it's childish at all, it's just a way of confronting perceived problems without direct attack. Culturally speaking, I find that stupid, but less so than other tactics used or proposed as solution here by people of different cultural background.

What counts here is honesty: Be openly a simple straight forward honest person and just say "it's not me" as many times as necessary with no argument whatsoever when it's really not you. Simple really. In Germany, you have to be right - here, being innocent is enough. Enjoy.
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Old 07.09.2012, 21:09
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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What counts here is honesty: Be openly a simple straight forward honest person and just say "it's not me" as many times as necessary with no argument whatsoever when it's really not you. Simple really. In Germany, you have to be right - here, being innocent is enough. Enjoy.
No it isn't!!! As has been shown to be the case on here many, many times.

And I think you missed the point about the pile of paper on the 'innocent' person's doorstep. Why was it there? And why should he have to bother to write a note and take it back to the entrance?
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  #36  
Old 07.09.2012, 21:10
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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About the remarks : What is wrong with just saying thank you with a big smile and keep doing what ever you do as usual? I can't count the number of "yes" I've said that were straight lies both in Switzerland and in Scandinavia before. No big deal.

About the paper pile: What is wrong with taking it downstairs and make a big card with written on it "Who ever forgot that in the corridor might want to collect it him/herself, so here you go*". No big deal either.
It's wrong because it is the same passive-aggressive-anal behaviour you don't like.
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Old 07.09.2012, 21:16
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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No it isn't!!! As has been shown to be the case on here many, many times.
You definitely missed my point: The Swiss way to say "Fyck you" is to make something open (blossstellen). By making it open that somebody put it on your door step, you are positioning yourself as innocent and basically accuse the anonymous person of being wrong. You become the accuser, end of story.
Remember: there is no feeling of guilt when others perceive you as guilty, only when one sees oneself as guilty. That's a huge difference with Anglo-American culture.

I actually think that there is no way anybody understands other cultures. Not on this forum, not other places either. Because you know what? People would have to take my word for it when I explain a process that is culturally foreign to people, and they won't take my word for it. It's an old runner for me, my German part of the family never understood my French part of the family and the other way around. But they've been talking to each other for 40 years. So imagine on a forum...

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It's wrong because it is the same passive-aggressive-anal behaviour you don't like.
I never said I don't like it and I never said it is passive aggressive anal. You did.
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  #38  
Old 07.09.2012, 21:33
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

Gee, no one suggested doing what I would probably do. Shrug, pick it up, and put it with my pile of recycling. If it were to happen again in the future I would worry about it. But is it worth all this scheming?
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  #39  
Old 07.09.2012, 22:35
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

Update: It came back!

The pile is back at my door. So we know who it was, then.

OK, put it back downstairs. Let's see how long this little game lasts....
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Old 07.09.2012, 22:40
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Re: Passive aggressive message from Swiss little old lady?

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Then I asked her to change her purple flowers, as I do not like them.
Brilliant, just brilliant! I would have loved to see the look on her face.
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