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  #61  
Old 06.12.2012, 17:32
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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But most can spell/type accurately
Honest typo, still dense, they keep thinking they're in Canada when they're not .
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Old 06.12.2012, 17:52
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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Honest typo, still dense, they keep thinking they're in Canada when they're not .
Keep making a twat of yourself, it gives us all a laugh. If I was Canadian, which I'm not, I'd rather be dense than ignorant.
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Old 06.12.2012, 17:56
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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Keep making a twat of yourself, it gives us all a laugh. If I was Canadian, which I'm not, I'd rather be dense than ignorant.

If only you knew who was laughing at who
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Old 06.12.2012, 18:03
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

well if trying to wind up people on an internet forum gets you all aroused good luck to you mate, and if it gives you a laugh I'm glad I've brought a little into your life.
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Old 06.12.2012, 18:09
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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well if trying to wind up people on an internet forum gets you all aroused good luck to you mate, and if it gives you a laugh I'm glad I've brought a little into your life.
Now, now, let's not get too predictable.

That only shines out of one place of mine.

Now this thread is getting a little too off topic, lets get back to the subject matter if there is anything additional to add, not including what happens in Canada.
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Old 06.12.2012, 18:53
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

Someone mentioned that small gaps along the baseboards are responsible. Walls in old houses behave much like a chimney, i.e., a draft effect. A simple test is light up an incense stick and very slowly wave it around the problem corner; yeah, more smoke. Try this with the door open and closed and again with the window open/closed. The result should be obvious. My apartment is over eighty years old and the parquet floor is quite uneven and there are many air leaks along the walls. I can feel the air coming in with my hand! My best guess is the smoke enters the walls through gaps/cracks around the window frame(s), ceiling corners or even lower entry points down below and finds its way into your room. Another useful suggestion is to seal the electrical wall outlet. Many years ago in the U.S. a thin foam pad with cutouts for the two socket holes was marketed; it's mounted behind the cover plate. It's not fireproof so other, safer material is warranted. Other simple remedies are to use rtv or other non-toxic sealants to fill the gaps along the baseboards. An air filter/purifier like an ionizer may help too. Speak with contractors or experienced carpenters in the area about this and ask what they recommend. I'm certain that this topic has come up many times as there are a lot of old houses in CH.

Good Luck,

Mark
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  #67  
Old 06.12.2012, 19:12
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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Its their issue, not mine.

Why shuld one need to have to get up from watching a film or drinking with guests or whatever, just becuase smoke might drift somewhere thats not of their concern, when they are smoking in their own home. Its not a case of being too nice or considerate its a case of your the one with the issue,
I disagree. It's not a private lifestyle choice when it affects the health of others. And it does. The fact that are 'allowed' to smoke in your building under the terms of the lease is one thing but when it affects people detrimentally - especially in their own home - and you're the one generating the problem, I do think the "tough, not my problem" attitude rather than a bit of consideration is unsociable.

But, you're talking about Switzerland and the rules of Switzerland/that particular building are what they are. Gotta deal with it how it is.

Me, I'd be pissed off, not use the smokey room and move out as soon as I could (having exhausted all other possibilities). "Tough on me" it is. Move on.
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Old 06.12.2012, 19:36
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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I disagree. It's not a private lifestyle choice when it affects the health of others. And it does. The fact that are 'allowed' to smoke in your building under the terms of the lease is one thing but when it affects people detrimentally - especially in their own home - and you're the one generating the problem, I do think the "tough, not my problem" attitude rather than a bit of consideration is unsociable.

But, you're talking about Switzerland and the rules of Switzerland/that particular building are what they are. Gotta deal with it how it is.

Me, I'd be pissed off, not use the smokey room and move out as soon as I could (having exhausted all other possibilities). "Tough on me" it is. Move on.
woah woah woah, lets not get it twisted. No ones health, other than the OPs mind, is being affected. By that I mean, the stress and frustration of the issue to them.

Smelling and inhaling vast quantities are two different things.

But your missing the point. It's not the neighbours problem. Its the landlord, building owner, whatever, its their problem to fix and they wont, because they wont care enough, and it probably cant be properly fixed if building is so old.

If one tenant has a dispute with another tenant doing something that affects them, as long as its not against the law its not a concern of the tenant causing the problem, its a problem with the building. As unsociable as it may be is irrelevant.

It's like saying my neighbour cooks curry everyday, and i smell it in my house. Some people really dislike that. I actually love the smell of curry, but could I demand someone stop cooking curry because I can smell it?

It's ludicrous.
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Old 06.12.2012, 19:42
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

No, I got your problem. We just disagree on a couple of points.

When it comes to cigarette smoke, it isn't 'just' an aesthetic dislike of the smell. It does affect health. Whenever I'm exposed to cigarette smoke for more than a couple of hours - even remote smoke, I get a sore throat and sometimes a cold. I'm probably in the minority with that but even a little cigarette smoke, over time, does affect people. You disagree, you think it's just an aesthetic thing. OK, we disagree. And I see it as unsociable (of the smoker), you say it's nothing to do with the smoker (even though they know it has an effect). We just disagree.

And we disagree on whose problem it is too. As the law currently seems to stand in Switzerland, I think it's the non-smoking tenant's problem. It's different to other places, but that's just how it is. The OP themselves said they don't think the landlord will be short of a tenant if they move out.
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Old 06.12.2012, 19:43
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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It's like saying my neighbour cooks curry everyday, and i smell it in my house. Some people really dislike that. I actually love the smell of curry, but could I demand someone stop cooking curry because I can smell it?
I knew someone in Zurich who had the neighbors complain to the powers that be that they cooked with too much garlic!

I think they had to move out.

Tom
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Old 06.12.2012, 19:48
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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On other news...

I was stuck in the Gubrist tunnel this morning after a inconsiderate AG plated Range Rover was playing bumper cars with two other victims stuck in the morning traffic.

The fumes in there were unbelievable, as it's such a huge risk to my health to breathe these toxic fumes should I leave my car while stationary and place bananas up everyone's exhaust pipe within the vicinity?

Just wondering, who dies first in a sealed garage? The person with the car engine running, or the person throwing a party with 50 smokers? Think about it...Overblown risks and "when the book suits."

Seriously, Paddy G shows the way to go and good luck with it. Welcome to Switzerland not part of fascist California/Australia/UK * Delete as applicable.
funny that, i passed this afternoon west bound and there was sets of accidents about 20m apart, 1 accident where some tool ran into the back of 2 cars and the other, again some tool ran into the back of another car no doubt gauking at the other accident.

i swear the tosser in front of me in the traffic actually turned in his seat to keep looking at the accident..... i reminded him to look forward with a sharp blast of the horn and a simple hand gesture.......
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Old 06.12.2012, 19:53
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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No, I got your problem. We just disagree on a couple of points.

When it comes to cigarette smoke, it isn't 'just' an aesthetic dislike of the smell. It does affect health. Whenever I'm exposed to cigarette smoke for more than a couple of hours - even remote smoke, I get a sore throat and sometimes a cold. I'm probably in the minority with that but even a little cigarette smoke, over time, does affect people. You disagree, you think it's just an aesthetic thing. OK, we disagree. And I see it as unsociable (of the smoker), you say it's nothing to do with the smoker (even though they know it has an effect). We just disagree.

And we disagree on whose problem it is too. As the law currently seems to stand in Switzerland, I think it's the non-smoking tenant's problem. It's different to other places, but that's just how it is. The OP themselves said they don't think the landlord will be short of a tenant if they move out.
Ok, if you say so. I would probaly argue 90% of that is in your mind, it quite simply does not have the qualities to do that. I mean, I like cooking Chinese and Indian food, bit of a sucker for chili, when cooking or even smelling other strong exotic flavours and spices I get a sore throat, watery eyes and runny nose. But my health is not being affected.

We definitely disagree on "even a little over time....etc etc"

I truly dont see how it is the smokers problem, or why they should have to do anything about it. If a plane could not take off because there was a morbidly obese passenger and the plane had made a mistake with weight distribution etc (trust me, it does happen), rather than what happens in practice, i.e they deny obese passenger boarding, are you advocating all passengers do not take plane? As it would be unfair? Thats basically how i see your argument. Ludicrous.

I dont think its different in any other place, re: law. Unless there was a smoking ban in the apartment. That seems to only be common in Canada and Australia. If someone can smell what someone else is doing in their apartment, then no law in any land will do anything about it. It's and issue with tenant who has the problem, and their respective landlord, and whilst the tenant has rights etc, as has been discussed, they are not going to remodel a whole building because someone is a little over sensitive to the smell of smoke. Sorry if that sounds unfair, but it is the reality of the situation.
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Old 06.12.2012, 20:03
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

Change of tack. I work in an ultra-new apartment building and it has a ventilation system that draws air from near the front entrance to the building. When someone smokes in that area, it draws the smoke into the entire building...we had to basically let the smokers know that they should smoke in a different area...

Point is, if you are in an apartment block with a newer 'air recirculation' system, it might be that the smoke is coming in from a very specific area...if you can work out where the inlet is...
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Old 06.12.2012, 20:38
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

Despite the fact that I (unfortunately) smoke, I really do feel so sorry for anyone that is forced to put up with second-hand smoke. No one should be forced to suffer the consequences of another person's bad habit. I can't stand it when smokers talk about their "rights," because I think everyone has a right to enjoy a smoke-free home. I only smoke on my balcony and even I, as a smoker, wouldn't want people smoking in my home.

To the OP... I suggest getting a good air purifier for that room. Run it for at least an hour before you go to bed. We have one that has a tank of water to be filled and it makes a nice steady hum that actually helps me sleep. It also helps keep the room humid and so it can also be good for your health.

If that doesn't work, I suggest making their life hell. They live below you. Try stomping on the floor in high heels early in the morning on a repeated basis. Maybe eventually they will move.
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Old 06.12.2012, 20:50
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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Despite the fact that I (unfortunately) smoke, I really do feel so sorry for anyone that is forced to put up with second-hand smoke. No one should be forced to suffer the consequences of another person's bad habit. I can't stand it when smokers talk about their "rights," because I think everyone has a right to enjoy a smoke-free home. I only smoke on my balcony and even I, as a smoker, wouldn't want people smoking in my home.

To the OP... I suggest getting a good air purifier for that room. Run it for at least an hour before you go to bed. We have one that has a tank of water to be filled and it makes a nice steady hum that actually helps me sleep. It also helps keep the room humid and so it can also be good for your health.

If that doesn't work, I suggest making their life hell. They live below you. Try stomping on the floor in high heels early in the morning on a repeated basis. Maybe eventually they will move.
As much as I loathe the smell of smoke, I agree with JordanBarr in that it's unreasonable to expect someone not to smoke in certain areas of their apartment, and trying to make them miserable is also not fair. It sucks, and I think comparing the acrid smell of burning chemicals to food odors or even undesirable body odors is ludicrous, but renovating the floor is unrealistic, the only option is to deal with it or move.
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  #76  
Old 06.12.2012, 21:43
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

Is the floor made of concrete?

I ask this because I just asked a friend who popped in, who happens to be a Maurer who builds apartment blocks.

He just laughed about the smoke, and said "Smoke will not penetrate the floors of an apartment block. If the smell is only in the bedroom, then her husband is either smoking secretly, or mixing with people who smoke, and it`s his clothing she is smelling".

Or if it`s a very old block (circa 50 years old) then there could be a blockage in bathroom vent that carries moisture out, and it`s backlashing into the nearest space, perhaps it needs to be checked out. Although this last is highly improbable.

What about that?
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Old 06.12.2012, 21:51
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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they are not going to remodel a whole building
As I said. It's the tenant's problem.


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because someone is a little over sensitive to the smell of smoke. Sorry if that sounds unfair, but it is the reality of the situation.
Apart from the fact it isn't the smell of smoke that bothers people, it's the smoke itself, I say we disagree, you say people are just being over-sensitive, it's in the mind.

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Sorry if that sounds unfair, but it is the reality of the situation.
It doesn't sound unfair, it sounds like you're dismissing people's issues as being in their mind.


Like I say, we disagree. And n'ere the twain shall meet, it seems. Subject dropped on my part.



[cheap shot]Just the one grammar point, though:

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If only you knew who was laughing at whom.

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Old 07.12.2012, 00:01
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

I thought "colds" were caused by viruses. Perhaps I'm wrong although some of the viruses may survive 600 deg C on the end of a ciggie??

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No, I got your problem. We just disagree on a couple of points.

When it comes to cigarette smoke, it isn't 'just' an aesthetic dislike of the smell. It does affect health. Whenever I'm exposed to cigarette smoke for more than a couple of hours - even remote smoke, I get a sore throat and sometimes a cold. I'm probably in the minority with that but even a little cigarette smoke, over time, does affect people. You disagree, you think it's just an aesthetic thing. OK, we disagree. And I see it as unsociable (of the smoker), you say it's nothing to do with the smoker (even though they know it has an effect). We just disagree.

And we disagree on whose problem it is too. As the law currently seems to stand in Switzerland, I think it's the non-smoking tenant's problem. It's different to other places, but that's just how it is. The OP themselves said they don't think the landlord will be short of a tenant if they move out.
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Old 07.12.2012, 00:13
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

Fair questioning, but what happens is the smoke irritates the back of my throat and back of my nose area, it reacts, whether it's a histamine reaction or smoke reaction or whatever, I don't know what it is, it just happens. I think that makes me much susceptible to colds and I do come down with one as a direct result, sometimes.


I'm going to look to see if there's some function or button to ignore a thread now, to be honest. Not in the mood to have a load of people (not necessarily you cricketer but it seems to be the way this thread's going) tell me I'm imagining things or being over-sensitive. I *could* turn around and say that some smokers are self-centred arses. Up until now I've managed to, and yet ... ah whatever

Good luck with it OP.

*walks away from the thread*
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Old 07.12.2012, 00:28
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Re: Smoking issue from neighbours

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I guess this is a complaint...but also a thread because i need some advice on what to do.

I live in a very old building which has been totally refurbished. I have lived there for just over 4 months now, and am having problems with the tenants downstairs smoking.
Obviously there is a structural problem with the ceiling/floor which separates our apartments because all the cigarette smoke from their room comes into our bedroom. Its only in one particular room and when they smoke we basically get gased out.
We are non smokers so we dont appreciate our house being filled with smoke.......and it takes days to get the smell out of the house.

I have spoken to them about it and they said they would only smoke in the kitchen with the doors open. Things havent changed though, and its obvious they still smoke in the same room.
I emailed the landlord (who owns the entire building) and asked him could we have someone look at the floor. He replied but instead of helping out he just spoke to the tenants downstairs like i did....so again no resolution.

The apartment is very expensive to rent, and even though we rent a 3.5 room house we are only using a 2.5 room house.
How far can i push the landlord to get it fixed??
As you say that it is an old house, there is a mistake with the building. Two possibilities. First the central heating may be connected from one apartment to the other with some hidden open spaces. Second, there may be an old chimney closed and hidden but not properly sealed, which leads the smoke into your lodgings. You have to find out and then demand a solution from the side of the house-owner
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