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  #261  
Old 04.06.2014, 10:55
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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I have to admit, I too find questions like the above ridiculous and I wonder what people expect with these? My answers to those would probably have been: for rice - "go to the supermarket (Coop, Migros)" and to post a letter - "go to the post office (look for yellow "die Post" sign)". That's it. Some probably would have considered this snarky and unfriendly too.

But all this being said, there are ridiculous questions in every forum. Sometimes, a quick google search does the trick and people then can't complain about oh-so-rude forum members. Which is why I love http://lmgtfy.com/

And sometimes it would help explaining a little. Asking "where can I buy towels" is one thing. Saying that you've looked in X stores in town Y, but are looking for a specific kind of towel and can't seem to find them, can someone please help - that is quite another.
While on the surface some of these questions look ridiculous, what you've got to remember is that people are coming here and very often don't understand a word of the language making finding what they want more complicated, add to that some products may not be available in the type of store where they would be available in their home country and you have somebody who ends up being frustrated as hell.

I remember trying to get some Ibuprufen when I first arrived here and scoured just about every supermarket trying to find the damn things. It honestly didn't occur to me that non prescription medicines would only be available from a pharmacy. I'll admit it seems stupid in hindsight, but in the UK, where I come from, you can buy general non prescription medicines in just about any supermarket or corner shop.
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  #262  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:22
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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While on the surface some of these questions look ridiculous, what you've got to remember is that people are coming here and very often don't understand a word of the language making finding what they want more complicated, add to that some products may not be available in the type of store where they would be available in their home country and you have somebody who ends up being frustrated as hell.

I remember trying to get some Ibuprufen when I first arrived here and scoured just about every supermarket trying to find the damn things. It honestly didn't occur to me that non prescription medicines would only be available from a pharmacy. I'll admit it seems stupid in hindsight, but in the UK, where I come from, you can buy general non prescription medicines in just about any supermarket or corner shop.
But isn't it this "cultural naivity" that invites snarky comments? There is so much information available in print form on and off the internet, that someone who can't be bothered to do a bit of basic snooping is revealing a special sort of can't be bothered "helplessness". There are plenty of EF posters who experienced CH and many other countries without such forums, and seemed to get along fine. Discovering things the challenging way is half the adventure of life/travel in another country. How boring it would be otherwise!

People turn to EF for different reasons. I do find EF to be more a social community than a "Dummies Guide to CH". I find it interesting in threads I sometimes read and don't contribute to, or in others I in which I get involved (and there are plenty I ignore) to experience the views and opinions of others who have experiences in CH or multiple other global locations, that intersect or overlap my own, or are completely distant from my own. There is also the added interest of members own life experiences reflecting different eras in history. Some posters are green twigs in life and others are like solid trunks of ancient oaks. I like that.

Someone called the banter British....I don't think it is specifically British but reflects different communication styles that can occur in most any language. The other day when sparks were flying, I was reminded of someone in the language department at my first teaching job in Bucks County, Pennsylvania. In the staffroom one day we must have been having a really good banter, but to one of the other teachers this came across as hostility, as they commented "B and A, they really don't like each other do they?" (This prompted me to track him down this last week - nearly 30 years later - and catch up on where our paths had taken us).

EF for me is like that impromptu conversation in the supermarket or elsewhere, sometimes "the same old chat", but often a source of fresh ideas for positioning myself within a global community.
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  #263  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:24
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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While on the surface some of these questions look ridiculous, what you've got to remember is that people are coming here and very often don't understand a word of the language making finding what they want more complicated, add to that some products may not be available in the type of store where they would be available in their home country and you have somebody who ends up being frustrated as hell.

I remember trying to get some Ibuprufen when I first arrived here and scoured just about every supermarket trying to find the damn things. It honestly didn't occur to me that non prescription medicines would only be available from a pharmacy. I'll admit it seems stupid in hindsight, but in the UK, where I come from, you can buy general non prescription medicines in just about any supermarket or corner shop.
I do understand that. However, frankly, I've travelled extensively and in some quite exotic locations too. I've found a post office in every country and I also found a supermarket or at least some kind of market in all of them. It can't be that difficult, can it? Walk around anywhere in Switzerland for 30mins tops, go into a few stores, you'll find what you're looking for. This is not the African desert. If I were to move to London and ask in a forum: where can I buy rice? I'm pretty sure people would react like they do here, don't you think?

Also, honestly, if people come here, I would assume they did at least a tiny bit of research upfront. And that includes learning three words of the local language... But I admit, this is my personal issue or rather my personal lack of comprehension - I just don't get how you can move to a foreign country and not even bother bringing one of those tiny travel dictionaries with you to help you move around a bit.

Searching for very specific or exotic stuff is another issue. If someone looked for Indian specialties, I can understand that you ask here as this isn't India, and you can't find an Indian store on every corner. But rice? Come on.

Also, again, it's often about how a question is asked. To pick up your your meds example - if you had posted a thread here simply asking "where can I buy pain killers/Ibu" - the answer would have been "at the pharmacy". Some would, again, have considered this response snarky and my question still is: what extensive answer would someone expect to a question like this? However, had you written "I am looking for pain killers/Ibu; in the UK, I can buy them at the supermarket, but I can't seem to find them in any supermarket here, can anyone help", the answers would either have been different, or they would have been the same, but they would not have been perceived as snarky as you asked the question differently. Do you know what I mean?
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  #264  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:24
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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I have to admit, I too find questions like the above ridiculous and I wonder what people expect with these? My answers to those would probably have been: for rice - "go to the supermarket (Coop, Migros)" and to post a letter - "go to the post office (look for yellow "die Post" sign)". That's it. Some probably would have considered this snarky and unfriendly too.

But this being said, there are ridiculous questions in every forum. Sometimes, a quick google search does the trick and people then can't complain about oh-so-rude forum members. Which is why I love http://lmgtfy.com/

And sometimes it would help explaining a little. Asking "where can I buy towels" is one thing. Saying that you've looked in X stores in town Y, but are looking for a specific kind of towel and can't seem to find them, can someone please help - that is quite another.
Completely and utterly agree, great post which sums up the situation perfectly. Some people could seemingly not survive to do the most mind basic common sense things without being able to ask on the forum. It's hilarious.

What, I wonder, did people do before the Interwebs?
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Old 04.06.2014, 11:28
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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I completely agree with you and your grandmother:-). In fact I recently went through this in my post for Sale of TV. One guy decided not only to deride me on the thread, which was still kind of OK, (s)he went on to give me couple of negative reps on account of his/her trolling!!

Yet, this forum provides a unique platform to express yourself and exposes you to a variety of people of all shapes and sizes.

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Your TV was a scam trying to get the unwise and naive to part with excessive cash for a worthless product. How do you sleep at night?
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  #266  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:31
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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What, I wonder, did people do before the Interwebs?
They made an effort.
They could ask other people.
Read maps.
Think.
etc
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  #267  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:31
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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I remember trying to get some Ibuprufen when I first arrived here and scoured just about every supermarket trying to find the damn things. It honestly didn't occur to me that non prescription medicines would only be available from a pharmacy.
Newb: (thread title) Where can I?
(post) can't find Ibuprofen, jesus this is a country built on pharmacuticals! wtf?!

Poster 1: "In the pharmacy"
Poster 2: "Go to the pharmacy"
Newb: "Why can't I get it in the supermarket?!"
Poster 1 "Because here you can't, you have to go to the pharmacy"
Newb: "That's crazy, back home you can get it in a gas station even!!"
Poster 3: "This isn't back home, it's another country"

4 months later...
Newb, post count now 4: (thread title) "My thoughts"
(post) You're all a bunch of meanies! Everyone I talk to agrees, all meanies!

...and 14 more pages about what a bunch of jerks we are here. Circle jerks for Adrian.
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  #268  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:32
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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I remember trying to get some Ibuprufen when I first arrived here and scoured just about every supermarket trying to find the damn things. It honestly didn't occur to me that non prescription medicines would only be available from a pharmacy.
Did you post on EF about it? Were you slagged off? If not, what's the relevance?
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Old 04.06.2014, 11:35
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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Did you post on EF about it? Were you slagged off? If not, what's the relevance?
He's trying to make the more dim members among us feel a little better about themselves.
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Old 04.06.2014, 11:36
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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He's trying to make the more dim members among us feel a little better about themselves.
I feel fine already, thanks
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  #271  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:37
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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I feel fine already, thanks
if not, take an ibuprofen
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  #272  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:41
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Re: English Forum [complaint about negative responders]

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Discovering things the challenging way is half the adventure of life/travel in another country. How boring it would be otherwise!
I do see what you're saying, and I largely agree with you, but sometimes all the "challenge" and "adventure" gets a bit wearing - especially in the early days when the language barrier means that every damn thing you do all day is a challenge. I did loads of reading up and research before I came out here and I still find myself confounded on a regular basis, because one simply cannot foresee all possible instances of where things might be done differently.

Sometimes folks just want an easy answer so they can get on with their lives, especially when they're juggling kids, getting to grips with a new job, sorting out a new home, etc etc. Yes, if the forum didn't exist, they'd have to work it out for themselves, but there's nothing wrong with using all the resources available to make life a bit easier.

I've seen a few comments along the lines of "how dare these n00bs waste our time with their dumbarse questions", but there's no duty or expectation that everyone on the forum has to reply to every thread. If a member thinks it's a dumbarse question, they should just not reply and leave the thread to people who do want to help.
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  #273  
Old 04.06.2014, 11:48
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

Have you seen the price of Ibuprofen here?

Back home it's three and six for a bantamweight.
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Old 04.06.2014, 11:50
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

I don't see the issue with asking so called stupid questions, one persons smart question is another's stupid one. its not a banning offence and after all we're not forced to take intelligence tests to post on here. if you don't like someone's poist or question, then simply ignore it.
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Old 04.06.2014, 12:01
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

I think the issue isn't stupid questions, or bullying new members, but the feeling that some people might not make an effort to find information on their own.

It is felt that some people expect to be coddled and are entitled to the information they seek without any effort whatsoever.

and that such people, once they have their information, will flounce and not contribute to the 'community' once they've gotten what they need.

This is why I believe some new posters get 'attacked'.

It is a common occurance on many internet forums, and it makes the community feel like they are just a disposible tool for the flouner, used and thrown away.
At least if the new member takes the time to search and show some effort, they might come across some other threads of interest and also have some advice to contribute to the community.
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Old 04.06.2014, 12:23
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

I think what gets people's collective backs up is not the apparent stupity of the question itself, but rather how the question is put.

And no, I didn't need to post on the EF about my Ibuprufen crisis - I politely asked a member of staff in the last supermarket I went to.

The word politely would apply here as well.
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  #277  
Old 04.06.2014, 12:35
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

Stupid questions asked is what makes the forum enjoyable and interesting. Where else could one get entertainment and banter in Swiss with one simple click?
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Old 04.06.2014, 12:38
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

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I think what gets people's collective backs up is not the apparent stupity of the question itself, but rather how the question is put.

And no, I didn't need to post on the EF about my Ibuprufen crisis - I politely asked a member of staff in the last supermarket I went to.

The word politely would apply here as well.
I'm sure that's true in a lot of cases, but I also see plenty of snarky replies to perfectly polite inquiries. Some people do seem to use the forum just to bitch at anyone newer than themselves.

There doesn't seem to be much slack given to people who don't write perfect English, or who don't necessarily know how a forum works - a "rude" question might actually just be someone who doesn't realise that a forum is a different kind of thing to a google search.

I should say that, despite the one thread I mentioned earlier, my experience has been overwhelmingly positive with the vast majority of responders trying to give useful information and advice.
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Old 04.06.2014, 12:46
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

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I'm sure that's true in a lot of cases, but I also see plenty of snarky replies to perfectly polite inquiries. Some people do seem to use the forum just to bitch at anyone newer than themselves.

There doesn't seem to be much slack given to people who don't write perfect English, or who don't necessarily know how a forum works - a "rude" question might actually just be someone who doesn't realise that a forum is a different kind of thing to a google search.

I should say that, despite the one thread I mentioned earlier, my experience has been overwhelmingly positive with the vast majority of responders trying to give useful information and advice.
exactly, spot on.

however, tbf this trait is not restricted to EF, there are far worse nastier cliquey Forums
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Old 04.06.2014, 13:12
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Re: The Treatment of New Posters

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I'm sure that's true in a lot of cases, but I also see plenty of snarky replies to perfectly polite inquiries. Some people do seem to use the forum just to bitch at anyone newer than themselves.
Can you link to any? Maybe I don't spend enough time here, but I just don't see it.
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