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  #81  
Old 23.04.2008, 18:19
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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But I'll bet she appreciates you asking, Sutter! Neighbourhood brownie points for you!



Barbra.
Thanks, i never would of dreamed of going upstairs to ask her if my smoke bothered her before i read this thread. I smoke outside because i do not want my flat smelling of my smoke, so why should someone who does not smoke have my smoke floating in her flat that is just so wrong
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  #82  
Old 23.04.2008, 19:27
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

This is very nice from you! I'm glad we talk about it.

The fact we talk about it, makes people think and understand both side, so if it can make some of us changing our habits, we will have better relationship with our neighbours.

I'm sure the ladie appreciated your concern, and I'm quite sure she will be nicer, or find a way to be more careful about something else.

Butterfly effect!
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  #83  
Old 24.04.2008, 10:33
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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Old, particularly the very old buildings ("Jugendstilhaus/-wohnung") often have much higher ceilings (sometimes 3.3 m and up) which is nice to have if you can't open the windows. So that would be an option too (potentially a very expensive one however!). These old properties usually have worse windows though, that don't isolate that well against smoke, dust, noise and low temperatures outside. Of course, the ideal (comfort- and energy-wise) would be to have high ceilings, well isolated windows and an air circulation system. Personally, I can't complain as the ceiling is at 2.7 m which is sufficiently high, IMHO.

Regarding the heat exchanger bi-pass. AFAIK, most air circulation systems use a technique that passes air from outside in pipes through the cellar (which is usually cooler than the environment in summer and warmer in winter). Not as effective as reversing a heat exchanger in summer, but OK and more environment-friendly.
Well I didn't want to go into the FULL details, but yes the air comes in from one corner of the house, goes underground about 15metres before coming into the house. This 'preheats/cools' the air. But it then goes throug a heat exchanger (Warmgewinen system sp?). The bi-pass we have it to avoid the heat recovery system in the summer. Obviously I want to get rid of the heat in the summer not bring it back in. One of teh diasadvantages of a well insualted house with LARGE windows. Sun blinds have reduced this problem considerably. Have thought about installing A/C. My preference would be to use the existing heat exchanger but to get rid of the heat. I've felt the air coming out of this system and it is cold. Just not very easy to do. Also some heat pumps (erdesonde pump) can be reversed, but not ours.

And yes this is sort of a Minergie house -actually 3-litre (German standard) which in some respects is higher than Minergie (too long winded for this thread).

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But I'll bet she appreciates you asking, Sutter! Neighbourhood brownie points for you!



Barbra.
+1 respect.
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  #84  
Old 21.07.2008, 20:19
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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Cant help thinking theres a lot of intolerance around towards smokers. Surely if someone is smoking on the balcony below you the smoke is very diluted by the time it reaches up to your balcony. A lot of it will be absorbed or deflected by the roof of their balcony/floor of your balcony and the odd whiff of smoke now then wont cause too much damage. Do you have to open the balcony doors when they are outside or sit outside at the same time as them below?

Instead of trying to change someone elses behaviour and habits - try changing your own perceptions and reactions (which is the only thing you really are responsible for).

P.S. I dont smoke.
I do know what you mean there. The strange thing is, I hate smoking...don't like smokers (I don't mean the people of course, but the habit -- my older brother is a smoker but it drives me nuts).

But the treatment of smokers in more and more countries (such as outlawing smoking in public places, which they have done here in Pittsburgh USA where I live) is very concerning to me. No, I don't like smoking but I hope it is not banned entirely in Switzerland like they are trying to do in many places here (not even in your own car? Come on.).

I don't like to see small personal freedoms frittered away, or yanked away in some cases, and yes, this includes smoking.
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  #85  
Old 21.07.2008, 21:27
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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we only have one balcony there is no choice.
... This is definitely not true! Usually, all balconies of an apartment building are on the "living rooms" side, so when the smoke goes up, it enters the living rooms of your upper neighbours. To avoid that, you could for example smoke at the open window of some other room (for example the kitchen), or smoke under the "Dampfabzug" (sorry, don't know the word in english!) of your kitchen.

Think about it! There should be a solution for everyone.

I also have problems with my neighbours who smoke on their balcony. They don't smoke cigarettes and they don't use an ashtray but throw all the butts down in the meadow . It's really disgusting! All the bad smelling smoke is blown into my bed- and livingroom!
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  #86  
Old 23.07.2008, 14:55
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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Actually, if you were to examine life on a subatomic level, and given that intelligence is merely life experiencing itself through a stimuli/feedback loop then in fact.....

You -ARE- the centre of the universe, as you are a being experiencing at that juncture of the feedback loop. Are we one of the whole, or whole of the one. Or am I just rambling?

Or did Xenu do it?

I liked that explanation, it reminds of the Buddhist joke "A Buddhist goes to a hot dog vendor and says ' make me one with everything'"
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  #87  
Old 23.07.2008, 15:04
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

BTW, I would like to add that I sympathise with the OP in this Fred, I am (at the moment, until 8th August) a smoker and I used to always go out onto our balcony and smoke. The I overheard the neighbours moaning about the smell - I would have preferred them to speak to me directly but so be it, now I smoke in the kitchen under the extractor vent. I do feel a bit of a wally though, my head stuck under the extractor hood, "enjoying" a cigarette. Stupid addiction I've got myself into and need to stop.

Cheers
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  #88  
Old 23.07.2008, 16:15
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

How on earth can you a smoker until August 8th? Is that when you die??
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  #89  
Old 23.07.2008, 16:21
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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How on earth can you a smoker until August 8th? Is that when you die??
Hopefully not! To explain, I never smoke in front of my children as I don't want to encourage them - I know, it's a completely stupid, irrational and awful thing to smoke but it's an addiction, not a habit. As I don't smoke in front of the children that means I don't smoke when I am with them. On the 8th of August we will be driving on holiday for 10 days or so to the Uk meaning I will be with the children for pretty much 24 hours a day and also in the UK where smoking has become rightfully socially unacceptable. That gives me a good opportunity to stop smoking. In preparation, I'm re-reading Allen Carr's stop smoking book, doing a lot of inward thinking about it, observing other smokers and my mental preparedness is coming along - I am beginning to really hate being addicted to this stupid stuff and watching other smokers helps to reinforce how ridiculous it is.

Last edited by Louis Wu; 23.07.2008 at 16:22. Reason: cus oi cant spel
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  #90  
Old 23.07.2008, 16:30
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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...on the risk of earning groans and being called a 'racist' of some kind, this is exactly the reason why i am only renting our flats out to non smoking tenants,i'd rather turn someone away even if they want to rent the flat,other than that i don't care at all from where someone hails or what profession an applicant works in
Had a good chuckle on this one. Reminds me of an episode of so you think you can dance (american reality show) that i caught whilst channel flipping recently.

Participant was not selected to progress further, said the judges were "racist against tall people"
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  #91  
Old 18.08.2013, 08:44
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

is this still the case since the law changed? guy downstairs stinks our place out
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  #92  
Old 18.08.2013, 09:10
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

I am quite anti-smoke, but in such cases I thing the law allowing smokers to smoke on their own property is correct.
The upstairs neighbors should be able to close the windows and be smoke free - and can open the window again and enjoy their own balconies a bit after the downstairs smoke disperses.

On the other hand, now that smoke-free e-cigs have been around for a while, you could suggest this alternative to a neighbor (and perhaps offer to cover parts of the costs for the equipment as long as the neighbor agrees to switch to using those whenever smoking in the balcony).
But possibly this is only a real alternative for those cases where you actually get along very well with the neighbor other than the smoking issue.
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  #93  
Old 18.08.2013, 09:29
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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I don't know what the answer to this is. I am a smoker and I smoke on our balcony so our daughter doesn't have to breathe it. I know it cheeses the woman two floors up off but, as we only have one balcony there is no choice. We did have a deal that I wouldn't smoke between 6.30 and 7am, but she started getting a bit arsey with me so all deals are off.
My husband smokes but out of respect for my feelings about it (lost my mom to lung cancer) and that we have young children whom we both do not want to see him smoke, he, by his own choice "goes on walks" to smoke. This is a win/ win situation as he values some time to himself, a bit of exercise, it reduces how much he smokes, and does not barrage us or our neighbours with his second hand smoke that always manages to sneak through windows and doors.

I know, good luck convincing neighbours of this method but it does prove that there are ways of compromising.
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  #94  
Old 18.08.2013, 11:30
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

Our downstairs neighbours chain smoke - and frequently on their balcony. I know it's their right to but....it means I have to breathe their crap if I want to open the balcony door and let some air in the apartment.

I would be more forgiving if these were not the same "Bünzlis" [nitpickers] who frequently post passive aggressive notes in the entrance lobby and lord it over the wash room.

Cheers,
Nick
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  #95  
Old 18.08.2013, 13:25
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

I sometimes smoke on our balcony, never had a complaint... Some of my neighbours also smoke on their balcony and we've never had a problem with smoke coming in.. Our neighbours also have grills and gas BBQs which we can often smell - however we smell it when they are cooking and then it goes away so I don't mind at all..

To those complaining about the smokers -- do you actually get the smoke smell long after the smoking has finished? Maybe I'm just lucky our place is big and airy with over 200 sqm .. We have balconies on both sides and usually all of windows are open so any smell just goes straight through really.

I'm all for protecting others from second hand smoke (i have young kids) but there comes a point i think when it becomes a pointless exercise, I mean just smelling the smoke surely does no more harm than walking along a busy road with all of that exhaust smoke? Or breathing the brake dust everyday at the train station? Trying to say I think it's more annoying than harmful.
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Old 18.08.2013, 13:38
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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I do know what you mean there. The strange thing is, I hate smoking...don't like smokers (I don't mean the people of course, but the habit -- my older brother is a smoker but it drives me nuts).

But the treatment of smokers in more and more countries (such as outlawing smoking in public places, which they have done here in Pittsburgh USA where I live) is very concerning to me. No, I don't like smoking but I hope it is not banned entirely in Switzerland like they are trying to do in many places here (not even in your own car? Come on.).

I don't like to see small personal freedoms frittered away, or yanked away in some cases, and yes, this includes smoking.
No worse then smokers taking the personal freedom of non smokers away by turning up and smoking in their personal space

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I also have problems with my neighbours who smoke on their balcony. They don't smoke cigarettes and they don't use an ashtray but throw all the butts down in the meadow . It's really disgusting! All the bad smelling smoke is blown into my bed- and livingroom!
Recommend you collect all the butts together and dump them on their balcony so they can appreciate how disgusting cigaretter butts look when they are not put in a bin. Alternatively tell them you are goung to call the police and report them for littering.

If they want to smoke they they shpuld damn well clean up their disgustng butts
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  #97  
Old 18.08.2013, 13:58
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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I sometimes smoke on our balcony, never had a complaint... Some of my neighbours also smoke on their balcony and we've never had a problem with smoke coming in.. Our neighbours also have grills and gas BBQs which we can often smell - however we smell it when they are cooking and then it goes away so I don't mind at all..

To those complaining about the smokers -- do you actually get the smoke smell long after the smoking has finished? Maybe I'm just lucky our place is big and airy with over 200 sqm .. We have balconies on both sides and usually all of windows are open so any smell just goes straight through really.

I'm all for protecting others from second hand smoke (i have young kids) but there comes a point i think when it becomes a pointless exercise, I mean just smelling the smoke surely does no more harm than walking along a busy road with all of that exhaust smoke? Or breathing the brake dust everyday at the train station? Trying to say I think it's more annoying than harmful.
Quite right. The trouble is, a lot of non smokers have been brainwashed now with much successful campaigning, as well as smokers outcasted to a degree, that this self righteous beast grows within as they deem any whiff of cigarette smoke a deadly assassin.

It must be very stressful for them.

They choose to ignore greater pollutants and poisons which have a more significant impact on their health because they are not as easily identifiable or smelt, as well as there has been no marketing campaign to demonise them.

As long as you stick to current laws you can just sit back and enjoy the hot air from these protesters.
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Old 18.08.2013, 17:03
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

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Quite right. The trouble is, a lot of non smokers have been brainwashed now with much successful campaigning, as well as smokers outcasted to a degree, that this self righteous beast grows within as they deem any whiff of cigarette smoke a deadly assassin.

It must be very stressful for them.

They choose to ignore greater pollutants and poisons which have a more significant impact on their health because they are not as easily identifiable or smelt, as well as there has been no marketing campaign to demonise them.

As long as you stick to current laws you can just sit back and enjoy the hot air from these protesters.
It is not always about health fears or wishing to demonize smoking. I have no problem with my neighbours smoking. It is when the smell of it gets in my apartment that the problem begins.

For some non-smokers second-hand smoke stinks. It stinks alot. It stings the eyes. It gets into cloth and lingers. It is roughly equally unpleasant a smell to me as the smell of urine or unwashed body or strong fish. Smokers may not be conscious of how bad the smell is (to some people at least) but I am guessing they would not like if any other bad smell were constantly seeping into their apartment from the neighbours to the degree that you had to avoid opening up your windows of your sweltering apartment at night. Is it the end of the world to have a smelly apartment? No. But non smokers are not just being precious when they complain about it. It really is distracting and more than a little unfair.

Last edited by M_McPoyle; 18.08.2013 at 18:51.
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  #99  
Old 18.08.2013, 19:13
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

To be honest I don't like the smell. It's just like a decomposing troll with its spouting effluent of complete drivel.



Cheers,
Nick


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Quite right. The trouble is, a lot of non smokers have been brainwashed now with much successful campaigning, as well as smokers outcasted to a degree, that this self righteous beast grows within as they deem any whiff of cigarette smoke a deadly assassin.

It must be very stressful for them.

They choose to ignore greater pollutants and poisons which have a more significant impact on their health because they are not as easily identifiable or smelt, as well as there has been no marketing campaign to demonise them.

As long as you stick to current laws you can just sit back and enjoy the hot air from these protesters.
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Old 18.08.2013, 21:51
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Re: Smoking in the balcony :-O

It is annoying when people start smoking on their balconies and though it would be fantastic in no one smoked in public places I doubt I will see that utopia in my lifetime. It is annoying having to close your windows during summer because the smoking neighbours have not thought about the people in the other apartments.

I was quite bemused by this comment:

"Quite right. The trouble is, a lot of non smokers have been brainwashed now with much successful campaigning, as well as smokers outcasted to a degree, that this self righteous beast grows within as they deem any whiff of cigarette smoke a deadly assassin."

I don't think there has been any brainwashing going on that I have seen. There are two big problems with smoking the fact that kills the person who smokes and that it damages the health of the people around them. I doubt you are going to disagree with that.

Luckily after years of non smokers having to extreme tolerance having to tolerate people smoking everywhere it is time for smokers to start thinking more about others and to moderate their smoking when they are in public. There needs to be change from areas where smoking is not allowed to having areas where smoking is allowed. That way where smoking is not explicitly allowed it will not be possible to smoke. That seems a sensible way of resolving the current tensions.

Have fun

Martin
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