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  #21  
Old 27.06.2014, 14:38
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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Hi everyone!

This is Nunzio from the tutti.ch team. First of all, I want to apologize for the bad experience you had. We found this thread and are eager to give you some additional pointers on how to spot potential scammers. We appreciate the discussion, as we're always interested in preventing fraudsters from using our platform and harming our users

We follow the strict rule that objects sold on tutti.ch must be located in Switzerland. If a seller suddenly tells you the opposite, even though the photos tell a different story, we advise you to be very cautious.

I just published a blog post about how to better spot potential fraudsters/scammers when going through classified ads. It's written in German, but I'm sure you can draw some important information from there: http://magazin.tutti.ch/so-schutzen-...ch-vor-betrug/

As a general three-step rule, I can tell you the following (all while risking to preach to the choir) when you're not sure if the seller's legitimate:

- Refrain from paying any "security" or "key deposits" in advance, especially when the seller's preferred payment method is Western Union or different similar money transfer services.
- Ask for more details, current photos are preferred
- Follow the rule: "If it's to good to be true, it most likely is"

@Confloozed: Would you be so kind and forward us the link to the ad, or any other information you have on the person you had contact with? Please send me a PM or e-mail us at help@tutti.ch – thanks!

If you have any other remarks: I'm happy to help.

Have a fantastic weekend!
Nunzio
I e-mailed Nunzio, pointing out that Ricardo send a password for the newly opened account by post, and this action would raise their security too.

The reply ignored this fact, but mentioned they were instigating a points scheme, (My opinion follows: so that long term Swiss traders would have a better reputation than Nigerian scammers) yeah, so how do you buy a bike? Probably hand over cash at the station and continue the plague of petty thefts here.
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  #22  
Old 27.06.2014, 14:38
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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i've been trying to buy a guitar for over 6 months now, the original ad was on tutti but it also turns up on gratisinserat and is currently on olx............

always exactly the same text and no phone number.

https://www.olx.ch/de/musik-film-gam...tarre/1935028/

"seller" seems to be either an english or american guy called mike from affolter am albis and despite several emails he has never given me his phone number and will not send me photos of the "damaged" parts of the guitar.

i don't know whether it's some sort of bizarre scam or maybe he's just a weirdo. i've never had any suggestions to send money anywhere.

the only mike with the same second name that he gives is listed in canton bern...........

maybe i should try calling that number?
Sounds to me like a scam. He is looking for people who will buy a "slightly damaged" instrument, when in fact there is no instrument at all - hence why he refuses to send pictures or a contact number.

Also, often enough, the name and location of the apparent seller is false. Localised common names for credibility can easily be farmed from many online websites. You will find out later if you get tricked that they just use a false name etc for credibility, but then ask for payment sending somewhere entirely different - like africa.

Whenever you make a payment, always ensure it is via Paypal or Credit Card - because with both of these, you can make a fraud claim if something goes wrong (on PayPal's case this is only for purchasing physical goods - not a virtual membership or anything you don't actually receive through the post). Western Union has no insurances or protections for buyers of goods. Also always check you are using a major shipping company such as FedEx, UPS, DHL etc etc. If you ever get given a tracking number for a company you haven't ever heard of, or has a non-standard domain such as .tk - beware because it's probably a sham.

With that last paragraph in mind, when shopping online, you should be able to stay pretty safe. Just always verify every information you have before making a payment
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  #23  
Old 27.06.2014, 14:43
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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I e-mailed Nunzio, pointing out that Ricardo send a password for the newly opened account by post, and this action would raise their security too.

The reply ignored this fact, but mentioned they were instigating a points scheme, (My opinion follows: so that long term Swiss traders would have a better reputation than Nigerian scammers) yeah, so how do you buy a bike? Probably hand over cash at the station and continue the plague of petty thefts here.
Unfortunately, sending passwords by post also has it's weaknesses. What if a person has a Postfach box paid for? They wouldn't need to be resident in the country where the Postfach address is located - only someone to check it (usually real scam artists are within an organised crime syndicate to enable such massive scale fraud across different continents). There is also other services which facilitate such fraud where you rent a post box virtually anonymously.

Nothing is 100% safe. It is up to the buyer to keep themselves alert when buying online - especally as to what frauds are currently common and how to avoid them. It is up to the buyer to always make sure they are covered for payments too. I have been scammed before, and I concede it was my own fault because I was stupid enough not to validate information and ensure safety of payment before making payment via Western Union.

Such a point scheme is quite a valid method of reducing scam, because obviously, people will be more aware of who can be trusted, but then, what is to stop these scammers from points bumping by making fake transcations to each other to boost ratings? Like I said above - every method used can be circumvented. it is up to buyers to stay vigilent when dealing with people on the internet that they do not know.
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  #24  
Old 27.06.2014, 14:47
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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....the only mike with the same second name that he gives is listed in canton bern...........

maybe i should try calling that number?
Mike has moved his address to Zurich! https://www.olx.ch/de/musik-film-gam...tarre/1935028/
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  #25  
Old 01.11.2014, 20:27
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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"seller" seems to be either an english or american guy called mike from affolter am albis and despite several emails he has never given me his phone number and will not send me photos of the "damaged" parts of the guitar.
It wouldn't be unusual for a swiss "Michael" to call himself Mike.

The pictures show the guitar in its case, but no pictures of its backside, which thus could be pristine or have a hole in it, or anything in between. A buyer might be diverted by the six missing pins (I mean, really, he says he has them so why not put them in place right away?) and assume that's the problem even though the real issue might be the (just guessing here) damaged backside.

And yet Mike could rightfully say he always said it's damaged. 200CHF for a used guitar case (that may even be damaged too, no picture showing its back) seems quite steep (cough).
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  #26  
Old 17.12.2014, 18:01
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

I would like to thank sridhar1980 for alerting about the Abaco Real Estates scam. I was about to transfer money to them when I found this thread, and a similar alert has been posted on another forum by another person who was a victim of this scam: http://www.gutefrage.net/frage/wohnu...eal-estates-uk (in German)

They contacted me after an ad I posted to an online marketplace. They have a very clear pattern for catching naive potential tenants. Their website seems trustworthy, their Company and VAT numbers are valid and their "team" seems to be made of real people (although I'm not sure if these people are aware that their names are being used by scam artists). I was really impressed by how quick the apartment "owner" replied all of my questions, the apartment location was just perfect (very close to the place where I will work in Basel), the very good English level, and, of course, the price was just below the market average, but not so much in order to raise suspicion... in other words, "too good to be true".


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Again, no complaints with the website.
I had a similar experience. I am new to Swiss and was looking for an apartment for rent. I found one in immostreet.ch and sent an contact form. 1 guy from UK claimed he is the owner of the apartment and its his holiday home in swiss. He later introduced me to a rental agency un UK called Abaco Real Estates which deals/takes care of international rental agreements. This real estate also had a website and looked very trustworthy. The owner asked me a 2 months deposit, 1 month advance rent and asked me to deposit the money in the agency's barclays bank account in London and told me if I am not satisfied with the apartment or if the it is not as described as in the advertisement I would get full refund back from the agency. As the apartment looked nice I made the payment, later that guy cancelled the transaction and he is gone with the money. I complained to the UK police, local police and also in the bank but its of no use.
So friends please be careful, unless you see things do not buy. If someone claims he is not from Swiss, better avoid and look for options.
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  #27  
Old 17.12.2014, 18:22
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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I would like to thank sridhar1980 for alerting about the Abaco Real Estates scam. I was about to transfer money to them when I found this thread, and a similar alert has been posted on another forum by another person who was a victim of this scam: http://www.gutefrage.net/frage/wohnu...eal-estates-uk (in German)

They contacted me after an ad I posted to an online marketplace. They have a very clear pattern for catching naive potential tenants. Their website seems trustworthy, their Company and VAT numbers are valid and their "team" seems to be made of real people (although I'm not sure if these people are aware that their names are being used by scam artists). I was really impressed by how quick the apartment "owner" replied all of my questions, the apartment location was just perfect (very close to the place where I will work in Basel), the very good English level, and, of course, the price was just below the market average, but not so much in order to raise suspicion... in other words, "too good to be true".
Looking at the Companies House website in the UK there is no Abaco Real Estates listed. There is an Abaco Estates (incorporated in 1992) based in Brighton and an Abaco Ltd (inc 2000) based in Angus Scotland - both of which are letting agents. What company number do they have?
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Old 17.12.2014, 18:28
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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Looking at the Companies House website in the UK there is no Abaco Real Estates listed. There is an Abaco Estates (incorporated in 1992) based in Brighton and an Abaco Ltd (inc 2000) based in Angus Scotland - both of which are letting agents. What company number do they have?
The company number is 6458515 which is valid for GEORGIAN ENTERPRISES & TRADING LIMITED, the group that Abaco Real Estates alledgely belongs to, according to their website: http://www.abacorealestates.co.uk/Searching for this URL on Google also leads to several scam/hoax listing websites.
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  #29  
Old 17.12.2014, 19:04
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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thank you for sharing, me and my spouse oftenly try tutti for item search. does it mean, we should not buy anything from tutti? Risky?

I liked the way Ricardo send security letter for new user account activation.
Not necessarily - it is a good site with a lot of buyers and sellers. As with anything on the internet (or off), one should just be aware and use common sense.
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  #30  
Old 17.12.2014, 19:05
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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thank you for sharing, me and my spouse oftenly try tutti for item search. does it mean, we should not buy anything from tutti? Risky?

I liked the way Ricardo send security letter for new user account activation.
just wondering if maybe you're intending to sell something on EF?
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  #31  
Old 17.12.2014, 19:18
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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The company number is 6458515 which is valid for GEORGIAN ENTERPRISES & TRADING LIMITED, the group that Abaco Real Estates alledgely belongs to, according to their website: http://www.abacorealestates.co.uk/Searching for this URL on Google also leads to several scam/hoax listing websites.
Well, I would report Abaco aka Georgian to Companies House and see what they say.

https://www.gov.uk/government/organi...rvices#cc-info

Or the CMA

https://www.gov.uk/government/public...ues-to-the-cma
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  #32  
Old 17.12.2014, 19:53
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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The company number is 6458515 which is valid for GEORGIAN ENTERPRISES & TRADING LIMITED, the group that Abaco Real Estates alledgely belongs to, according to their website: http://www.abacorealestates.co.uk/Searching for this URL on Google also leads to several scam/hoax listing websites.
Also, what kind of reputable company doesn't have a land-line number?

Nice pictures. I was tempted to pay a hefty deposit on one of those houses straight away.
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  #33  
Old 19.12.2014, 22:41
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

hi everyone, same to me on tutti.ch, of course the website is not responseble for that.
i'm selling some forniture of a 1500chf value and one day i recived a message from skype tha a person was interested, i contact him by email, wich is abiliohadallberto@gmail.com, and he agreed to pay thru paypal and because he is in Portugal to add speditions costs. i though why he want to spend more then 2000 euro for a second hand bedroom? portugal is cheap so i spot the scam but i continue to follows instruction to spot the way they do.he asked me to send a payment request with paypal including speditions costs and i did it doesn't cost a penny, after i recived an email looking like is from paypal saying that i have to pay the spedition cost to a company in U.S. thru western union and send them the recived and then the money would have been ready to withdrow from paypal to my account.of course i didn't do it and after 1 week i recived another email from paypal sayng that if i didn't pay they would have token legal action.of course i ignore them so be aware that when is too good to be true probably isn't.
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  #34  
Old 19.12.2014, 23:00
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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hi everyone, same to me on tutti.ch, of course the website is not responseble for that.
i'm selling some forniture of a 1500chf value and one day i recived a message from skype tha a person was interested, i contact him by email, wich is abiliohadallberto@gmail.com, and he agreed to pay thru paypal and because he is in Portugal to add speditions costs. i though why he want to spend more then 2000 euro for a second hand bedroom? portugal is cheap so i spot the scam but i continue to follows instruction to spot the way they do.he asked me to send a payment request with paypal including speditions costs and i did it doesn't cost a penny, after i recived an email looking like is from paypal saying that i have to pay the spedition cost to a company in U.S. thru western union and send them the recived and then the money would have been ready to withdrow from paypal to my account.of course i didn't do it and after 1 week i recived another email from paypal sayng that if i didn't pay they would have token legal action.of course i ignore them so be aware that when is too good to be true probably isn't.
I had something like this happen to me a few years ago when we still lived in the states. We put online we were having a local garage sale in our tiny town. We got an email from a guy who lived in an African country, that he loved a couch we were selling and wanted it for his daughter. Said he would pay something over what we wanted, and wanted us to ship it like Dubai...from Michigan. Those were the naïve days, and actually looked into it.


It was a scam, and don't remember the exact info. But it is about getting your personal details to double charge you for something, and in the end you are out of money.
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  #35  
Old 19.12.2014, 23:15
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

they invent a lot of things to get monay i report it but why they never got cought. the monay i suppose to send to the states where under a women's name pretending she was the accounting manager of this company and then i cheked on facebook and i found it she is a girl that work in a bar so i thought why they never get cought?swiss police send evidence to U.S. police and that's it you got them.
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  #36  
Old 16.03.2019, 11:39
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

Has anyone experienced the opposite?? I am trying to sell a higher priced item on Tutti. Then getting responses from many people asking about the item, any damage, more photos, etc. Quite normal, THEN, informing me it is a gift or the are not in country, if I can send it to UK, US. Willing to pay right away, plus shipping, using bank transfer. Not sure what the could do with my bank information, I give it to agencies in CH for refunds/payments? But I will not send it online over email to these dodgy buggers.
I don’t send anything and request them to make an appointment to see the item, as I do not ship internationally. They stop responding.

Example:
HI Friend,
Good Day ,Thanks for your respond concerning the item ..How are you ? Yes. i am really interested and ready to buy it for my daughter, I have checked the item several time and i really like what i have see there in the site, i stay and work in the Canada .....And i will be paying you through bank to bank transfer....I will like to offer you sum of 2'000sfr and also am sending the item to my daughter over there in USA with Local Post office www.post.ch ..i will be paying you via bank transfer direct to your account
...
Name...
Account Number...
Iban...
Swift code...
I will be waiting for your bank details so that i can make the payment immediately ..
Best regard

Gesendet: Mittwoch, 13. März 2019

And another:
(Please note I am selling a handbag* RED FLAG)
Thank you very much for your email. I am ready to buy your wrist watch* on Tutti.ch. How long have you owned it and what is the condition? I would like to have more pictures if there are no scratches. I like to have a business and can make the payment via IBAN transfer. Wait for your urgent response. Many thanks.
Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 9:35 PM
To: 1@outlook.com

And lastly:
Kaufen Sie Ihren Artikel als Geburtstagsgeschenk für meine Tochter,
wie lange haben Sie ihn und wie hoch ist der Preis, für den Sie ihn
verkaufen möchten? Ich werde Sie per Banküberweisung bezahlen. Ich
werde meiner Tochter in Großbritannien 60 CHF für den Versand
hinzufügen. Ich warte darauf, von Ihnen zu lesen, um die Zahlung mit
Ihrem vollständigen Bankkonto für die Zahlung fortzusetzen, Mail me
English

Warten Sie auf Ihre schnelle Antwort.

Danke vielmals.

Due to the nature of my Job, i work in an Oil Offshore Marine
department, i would have love to come for the inspection but i will
Offshore for the next two month but i do have a lot of trust in you,
it not possible for me to make calls or to come for inspection

gmail.com

Last edited by Monaco; 16.03.2019 at 13:06. Reason: Personal info
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  #37  
Old 16.03.2019, 12:06
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

Yes, a very common scam. There are different ways how day will get money from you, including: trying to get money for overpayment or some "fake expenses" back from you, later cancellation of payment by bank ( If a check you deposit turns out to be a fake, you’re responsible for repaying the bank.). etc. et.c Just google it.
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  #38  
Old 16.03.2019, 12:24
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

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Has anyone experienced the opposite?? I am trying to sell a higher priced item on Tutti. Then getting responses from many people asking about the item, any damage, more photos, etc. Quite normal, THEN, informing me it is a gift or the are not in country, if I can send it to UK, US. Willing to pay right away, plus shipping, using bank transfer. Not sure what the could do with my bank information, I give it to agencies in CH for refunds/payments? But I will not send it online over email to these dodgy buggers.
I don’t send anything and request them to make an appointment to see the item, as I do not ship internationally. They stop responding.

Example:
HI Friend,
Good Day ,Thanks for your respond concerning the item ..How are you ? Yes. i am really interested and ready to buy it for my daughter, I have checked the item several time and i really like what i have see there in the site, i stay and work in the Canada .....And i will be paying you through bank to bank transfer....I will like to offer you sum of 2'000sfr and also am sending the item to my daughter over there in USA with Local Post office www.post.ch ..i will be paying you via bank transfer direct to your account
...
Name...
Account Number...
Iban...
Swift code...
I will be waiting for your bank details so that i can make the payment immediately ..
Best regard

Gesendet: Mittwoch, 13. März 2019
An: "Personalinformation" <personalinformation@gmx.at>
And another:
(Please note I am selling a handbag* RED FLAG)
Thank you very much for your email. I am ready to buy your wrist watch* on Tutti.ch. How long have you owned it and what is the condition? I would like to have more pictures if there are no scratches. I like to have a business and can make the payment via IBAN transfer. Wait for your urgent response. Many thanks.
Sent: Wednesday, March 13, 2019 9:35 PM
To: personalinformation@outlook.com

And lastly:
Kaufen Sie Ihren Artikel als Geburtstagsgeschenk für meine Tochter,
wie lange haben Sie ihn und wie hoch ist der Preis, für den Sie ihn
verkaufen möchten? Ich werde Sie per Banküberweisung bezahlen. Ich
werde meiner Tochter in Großbritannien 60 CHF für den Versand
hinzufügen. Ich warte darauf, von Ihnen zu lesen, um die Zahlung mit
Ihrem vollständigen Bankkonto für die Zahlung fortzusetzen, Mail me
English

Warten Sie auf Ihre schnelle Antwort.

Danke vielmals.

Due to the nature of my Job, i work in an Oil Offshore Marine
department, i would have love to come for the inspection but i will
Offshore for the next two month but i do have a lot of trust in you,
it not possible for me to make calls or to come for inspection

personalinformation@gmail.com
Come on man don't even waste your time worrying or replying to them... just accept these scams exist, ignore them and move on.

PS: Don't post peoples names and email addresses without their permission... it is personal information regardless of whether you believe they are scammers or not.

Last edited by Chuff; 16.03.2019 at 12:34.
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  #39  
Old 16.03.2019, 13:03
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

Sorry thanks for the heads up! I just copy and pasted emails with their info. I only reply to first enquiry and to explain I don’t ship. I would rather that than have them further contact me.
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  #40  
Old 05.12.2019, 22:09
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Re: Scam Artists using the site Tutti.ch to try to scam

Is there any type of scam that could work with someone simply picking up an item and paying cash? Aside from coming back to the house later for the cash.

Any type of transaction law that non-Swiss residents might find surprising?

Selling a 1000CHF+ item on Tutti and there are a number of people making reasonable offers but without really asking any questions about the item. Or even determine my validity as a seller. Im just wondering if there is an illicit aspect I am not suspecting.

Thanks.
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