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  #21  
Old 18.08.2015, 22:07
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Re: Spital Triemli

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I got a fancy you maybe missing something here, "Lost in translation" possibly ?
Definitely not, they spoke German.

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Surely as a German he would have been covered under EHIC agreements and could have shown his EHIC card at a later date subject to given his German home address?
Exactly, this should have been clear to whoever saw them.

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Different viewpoint, Assuming that the pool did basic first aid and bandaged it, it is not life-threatening and could be sorted at the local doctor or 24 hour clinic and did not need 'emergency' treatment in the sense that it had to be fixed in the next two hours.

Plenty of time to get the wallet, follow the paperwork and sort it out. The inability to produce Swiss ID (as insurance is compulsory in Switzerland) or some sort willingness to pay up-front, the hospital would consider them unlikely to pay...or deliberately trying to avoid paying.

Did they actually remove the bandages and 'triage' the patient or were they headed off at the door by the 'admin' staff? When we go to the kids hospital for non-emergency, we go to the admin desk (admissions) but it's a different place to the triage for emergency...I wonder if they got assessed as non-urgent...and of course the patient could have stayed at the hospital waiting room whilst someone else went home to get the paperwork/bank card.

Even if you had the paperwork, if the hospital is busy, you could be waiting several hours before getting treatment if it is simply not 'urgent'...

Edited to add: triemli is a massively big and busy hospital. Sometimes the smaller hospitals are far less busy.
Honestly, I don't know the exact details of what happened. And I'm not too fussed either. The state of that wound together with the speed that they received treatment at Spital Limmatal shows that it was urgent and they had reason enough to be there (not being local, they were pointed in the direction of Triemli by the Bademeister).

It wasn't life threatening, however we're not in the third world here. If someone had just applied a little common sense it would have saved a hell of a lot of pain and discomfort.
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  #22  
Old 18.08.2015, 22:29
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Re: Spital Triemli

Erm, the OP stated the visitors were from Germany - so unlikely.

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I got a fancy you maybe missing something here, "Lost in translation" possibly ?.
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  #23  
Old 19.08.2015, 09:21
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Re: Spital Triemli

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Erm, the OP stated the visitors were from Germany - so unlikely.
So if you went to Germnany, you'd be a visitor from Switzerland and therefore expected to speak fluent German/French/Italian or all 3 ?

Because you are a visitor, it has no connection with what you speak, especially on an ex-pat forum !

I agree it was likely they spoke German, but in view of the treatment, it was also a possibility they did not and something was lost in translation
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  #24  
Old 19.08.2015, 10:13
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Re: Spital Triemli

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not being local, they were pointed in the direction of Triemli by the Bademeister.
Bus 80 runs from Werdhölzili directly to Triemli Hospital. Walking distance is minimal.

But from the Triemli Hospital Website:
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Personen, die in einem EU-Staat Wohnsitz haben und einem gesetzlichen Krankenversicherungssystem angehören, benötigen eine Europäische Krankenversicherungskarte.

Falls diese (noch) nicht vorhanden ist, lohnt sich im Notfall der Versuch, die provisorische Ersatzbescheinigung via Fax beim Krankenversicherer telefonisch anzufordern.
https://www.stadt-zuerich.ch/triemli...itbringen.html

If you have not your EHIC with you, you may try to call your insurance and requested a fax copy of it.
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Old 19.08.2015, 10:20
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Re: Spital Triemli

You my write to the persons in charge:

Head of Triemli ER Prof. Dr. Andreas Platz
and
Managing Director of Triemli Dr. iur. Erwin Carigiet

Address:
Stadtspital Triemli
Birmensdorferstrasse 497
8063 Zürich

additionay

Head of the City of Zurich Health Department is Claudia Nielsen

Adress:
Stadt Zürich
Stadtrat Claudia Nielsen
Stadthausquai 17
8022 Zürich
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  #26  
Old 19.08.2015, 10:24
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Re: Spital Triemli

Thanks a lot for the info! So basically they didn't follow their own procedure. They offered to call up their health insurance to retreive their details but this was declined. I'll definitely be making a complaint now.
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  #27  
Old 19.08.2015, 15:05
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Re: Spital Triemli

How can life-threatening be a criterion with respect to being an emergency or not! Let's say you cut off your thumb, that's definitely not life-threatening. How would the "life-threatening" posters here react if they were refused? Go home take two aspirins?

<scratches head in disbelief>

Loz1983 you're supposed to send your complaint to the Beschwerdestelle. Their service is free. If they think the complaint has merit, it will be forwared to the Gesundheitsdirektion ZH. Not sure why not to send it directly to the Gesundheitsdirektion, that's just how it's supposed to work. They have an online form, but it seems to not be encypted, which would mean the mail including personal info is readable by anybody.

Beschwerdestelle SPFG
AerzteGesellschaft des Kantons Zürich
Freiestrasse 138
8032 Zürich

Tel. 044 421 14 14
info@aerzte-zh.ch

Last edited by Urs Max; 19.08.2015 at 15:34.
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Old 08.03.2017, 09:10
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Re: Spital Triemli

My girlfriend had an emergency situation last night and we went to Triemli. We were quickly attended and a small surgery was planned. We arrived 21:00 and she had almost nothing for dinner for not feeling well. We had to wait around 3 hours which is completly acceptable knowing the circumstance. During surgery, she had some pain (although local anesthesia) but when asked she bravely said she was just very very hungry.

After the intervention asked again for food but they asked us to wait for a moment which resulted in +1h wait and me searching for a vending machine. I eventually found one in the closed cafeteria with a single Mars chocolate bar in it.

When the nurses and doctor came back they handed us a drug recepie and said we were free to go and just left. My girlfriend had trouble sitting up to get dressed still with pain from the surgery. She couldn't handle it and fainted in my arms. I yelled for help. Some nurses came. Very low blood sugar. I asked again if she could eat something. Again no food just an orange juice box.

I mean no direct complain here. The staff was OK but seemed there was no food available?
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Old 08.03.2017, 10:31
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Re: Spital Triemli

I'm asking for trouble replying to this but nevertheless -

So your girl friend missed one meal?
When asked if she was in pain (she was?) she replied 'bravely' that she was very, very hungry.
It is highly unlikely that the staff at a minor operation will ever produce food for a patient.

Afterwards (still in pain?) she asked again (was this to the same person?) for food. Did they refuse to fetch something? or did you go off looking for a vending machine while they were away?
You found a machine with a Mars bar (chocolate). Did you buy it? Did she eat it?
You were given a prescription for drugs and told you could leave. Your girl friend was still in pain. (Had you clearly told the doctor and the nurse this?)
Your girl friend fainted. You called. Staff came back. Presumably your girls friends blood sugar was then tested as you say it was very low. She was given orange juice. Aren't there about 30 calories in a small pack, which are quickly absorbed by the body? Other food would take longer to influence the blood sugar even if the feeling of hunger went away.

If she has had blood sugar 'problems' in the past she should say so. Missing one meal sure doesn't make mine drop enough to make me faint. I would imagine that the pain could easily be as instrumental as the low blood sugar in the fainting. Being 'brave' is not always helpful. One cannot blame overything on the staff even if their actions seem very hard-hearted.

This all sounds like splitting hairs but it is difficult to see the whole picture.
Hope she is feeling better today.
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Old 08.03.2017, 11:28
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Re: Spital Triemli

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I'm asking for trouble replying to this but nevertheless -

So your girl friend missed one meal?
When asked if she was in pain (she was?) she replied 'bravely' that she was very, very hungry.
It is highly unlikely that the staff at a minor operation will ever produce food for a patient.
We did not ask for food during the operation obviously. I've asked some staff before but no doctor was around so probably the nurse couldn't tell if she was allowed to eat or not. When the doctor arrived she (doctor) said it wouldn't take the procedure more than 20min. When asked how she felt, she said very very hungry.

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Afterwards (still in pain?) she asked again (was this to the same person?) for food. Did they refuse to fetch something? or did you go off looking for a vending machine while they were away?
Doctor quickly dissapeard (should I have explicitly asked again for food even though the patient exclaims she is very very hungy?) I asked a staff member (nurse I guess) if there was food availible. Here they told me there was a Vending machine in the cafeteria where I later found out only a Mars was available.

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You found a machine with a Mars bar (chocolate). Did you buy it? Did she eat it?
You were given a prescription for drugs and told you could leave. Your girl friend was still in pain. (Had you clearly told the doctor and the nurse this?)
While still layin on the Bed, the doctor gave us the perscription. The Mars was being eaten. The doctor DID asked how she felt. She did say she had pain but minor at this time (still under effect and laying down). At this time we were cleared to go.
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Your girl friend fainted. You called. Staff came back. Presumably your girls friends blood sugar was then tested as you say it was very low. She was given orange juice. Aren't there about 30 calories in a small pack, which are quickly absorbed by the body? Other food would take longer to influence the blood sugar even if the feeling of hunger went away.
After some 10min of being cleared to go home, I helped my gf to get dressed and when she slowly got on her feet, she had incredible pain in the area of the surgery. She couldn't move. Here she became aware she would faint as I've hold her and asked for help. My girlfriend was laying over 4 hours same position on that bed.

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One cannot blame overything on the staff even if their actions seem very hard-hearted.
As I said, the Staff was OK. Also after asking for food to the staff and saying how hungry she was to the doctor, we wouldn't know that we explicit have to ask for food again.

Again, I meant no complain here. Just be sure you get what you need if you feel so.

The only think I wonder was why no nurse assisted us before leaving. That's all. Just sharing an experience at the Triemli Urgency at mid-night.
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Old 08.03.2017, 13:02
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Re: Spital Triemli

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I mean no direct complain here. The staff was OK but seemed there was no food available?
You being non-stationary you didn't book the hospitaltiy part (bed & food). And even if, in the middle of the night the kitchen is closed.
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Old 08.03.2017, 14:27
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Re: Spital Triemli

Basically hospitals, especially large ones, are like most other organisations. You have to ask the right question of the right person in the right place at the right time.
To a doctor (plus mothers, carers and people in a hundred other professions) a missed meal and/or hunger are sometimes par for the course. One negative side effect is that talking of hunger diverts attention from a real problem - pain.

Off topic - Sometimes I, unfortunately, produce a similar effect in that I often see the funny side of things. In A&E, dripping wet from cycling the rain, I say, laughing, to my daughter, that I'd likely only broken my collar-bone and anyway at my age they probably won't bother with treatment but just put me down. The nursing staff seemed quite surprised that their diagnosis after the x-ray agreed with mine. A broken collar-bone is no big deal but it does hurt and I just didn't fit in with their ideas.
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Old 08.03.2017, 14:44
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Re: Spital Triemli

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You being non-stationary you didn't book the hospitaltiy part (bed & food). And even if, in the middle of the night the kitchen is closed.
On the other hand an empty vending machine tells stories. Now I wait for the story from the guy and gal which came after the last Mars bar was sold.
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Old 08.03.2017, 15:45
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Re: Spital Triemli

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My girlfriend had an emergency situation last night and we went to Triemli. We were quickly attended and a small surgery was planned. We arrived 21:00 and she had almost nothing for dinner for not feeling well. We had to wait around 3 hours which is completly acceptable knowing the circumstance. During surgery, she had some pain (although local anesthesia) but when asked she bravely said she was just very very hungry.

After the intervention asked again for food but they asked us to wait for a moment which resulted in +1h wait and me searching for a vending machine. I eventually found one in the closed cafeteria with a single Mars chocolate bar in it.

When the nurses and doctor came back they handed us a drug recepie and said we were free to go and just left. My girlfriend had trouble sitting up to get dressed still with pain from the surgery. She couldn't handle it and fainted in my arms. I yelled for help. Some nurses came. Very low blood sugar. I asked again if she could eat something. Again no food just an orange juice box.

I mean no direct complain here. The staff was OK but seemed there was no food available?
It's not famine
Joke aside, I experienced a quite similar event (hungry and emergency) at UniSpital. I was swiftly transferred from SeeSpital to Unispital once the doctors at SeeSpital found that my pregnancy complication needed further help. I was sent by an ambulance around 6 PM. I didn't get a room immediately at UniSpital, so I was stuck at a birthing room. It's not pleasant at all given that I had a preterm contractions.
The trip with the ambulance was already stressful enough for me, let alone the contractions. It consumed all my energy that it's not surprising that I got very hungry after I arrived at UniSpital.
Around 8 PM and still I didn't get any food. Apparently, the patient dinner schedule was at 6 PM and I was too late for that. OH asked the attending midwife whether I'd get food. She was not sure, but she'd tried, she said. OH checked the cafeteria, but it's already closed. He asked the midwife again, and luckily she was able to source a plate of food (someone must have decided to abandon dinner at the time). All in all, it took a lot of patience that day for me to get my food. And here we're talking about pregnant mum, who need to feed two persons
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Old 08.03.2017, 22:03
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Re: Spital Triemli

Hospitals aren't hotels.

There's usually no food outside meal-times other than what you have brought or saved yourself (if the cafeteria is closed).

Is it a common problem among women that blood-sugar gets so low that they faint?

That would IMO be a real concern and should be investigated further (but then, my medical qualification is basically googling).
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Old 08.03.2017, 23:40
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Re: Spital Triemli

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After some 10min of being cleared to go home, I helped my gf to get dressed and when she slowly got on her feet, she had incredible pain in the area of the surgery. She couldn't move. Here she became aware she would faint as I've hold her and asked for help. My girlfriend was laying over 4 hours same position on that bed.
Then she didn't faint because she had had no food

Agree with others, it was the middle of the night, food is not part of the "deal" and outside regular hours, there's no options at hospitals, normally. An empty vending machine - well, not ideal, but unless she has severe issues with blood sugar (which she would definitely know about and be prepared accordingly by carrying snacks), it's really not such a big deal to miss one meal...

From the sounds of it, the nurses did what they could.


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Is it a common problem among women that blood-sugar gets so low that they faint?
I used to faint literally all the time, but in my case, low blood sugar was combined with critically low levels of iron and anaemia. I don't have the fainting problem anymore (or only very rarely), but still carry some food and/or drinks everywhere I go.

I don't think it's common though. With most people it's situational rather than a regular occurrence.
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Old 09.03.2017, 00:30
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Re: Spital Triemli

I had the same situation but for the course of three days, we asked at the end to speed up the hospital discharge.

I just chuck it under a disorganized mess. Hospital is not a hotel but as good medicine knows, comfortable patients (with some granola bars or apple mouse in nurse's cabinets) actually recover better.

The food where I was (they made mistakes in ordering and delivery) was supposedly healthy but quite terrible. My kid has had similar throughout her daycare, botched up organic and healthy nutrition program. It is ok, makes me a well cooking mom...easily
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Old 09.03.2017, 00:35
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Re: Spital Triemli

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On the other hand an empty vending machine tells stories. Now I wait for the story from the guy and gal which came after the last Mars bar was sold.
Being hungry is no medical condition.

There are exceptions of course but generally, as long as you drink enough it's a complete non-issue to go without food for half or a full day. The hospital won't particularly care if a generally healthy looking walk-in ("ambulant") patient is hungry especially given widespread overweightedness around here. Even more so if they're young as OP (and thus his gf) gives the impression to be.

With planned surgery that includes anesthesia you're actually required to not eat 6 hours before the procedure, not drink two hours before, and in the hours in between to only drink fiberless liquids. She probably would not have been given anything before the procedure unless actually dehydrated. And until it's clear there's no more cutting-up to be done that probably includes some time after the op.

Many people in a hospital are on a diet of some kind or other during their stay. One may not realise it but they are and think there's too little to eat.

In both cases (op and diet) a filled vending will interfere with the medical best practice. From a medical POV it's probably a quite bad idea to have vendng machines with the typical stock.

OP's gf "being brave" was a stupid thing to do. For one there's just no need to suffer pain of that intensity, removing it is part of the reason why the two went to the hospital in the first place. But more importantly it can be actually harmful or outright dangerous because the pain will hide, gloss over, other symptoms. Had she been open and given pain treatment she might have realized her dizziness much earlier, and perhaps have gotten a shot of sugar of some kind much earlier. Tablets of "Traubenzucker" are ubiquituous among nurses as, short of intravenous shots, there's no quicker way to increase your blood sugar level than to dissolve a tablet under your thongue.
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Old 14.04.2017, 21:01
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Re: Spital Triemli

Guess you are trying to make a joke?
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The picture is fine.


I would agree if it was like an open flesh wound down to the bone or something, but this? Hardly worth complaining about and definitely not a wound needing medical attention.


Jeez.


How do you like your admissions job at the hospital, BTW?
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Old 14.04.2017, 21:48
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Re: Spital Triemli

Actually, if low blood sugar is an issue, orange juice or something sugary without much fat or protein is the best way to raise blood sugar, so oj was among the best treatments. Plus it can be obtained in non perishable, small quantities.

In recovery, you don't have access to food either....too much other stuff to do and they really can't be dealing with either perishable food or vomiting patients who've eaten too fast.

As for vending machines, I seriously doubt there is a health imperative - someone just screwed up and didn't get them filled.
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