Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Living in Switzerland > Complaints corner  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #41  
Old 16.03.2017, 10:53
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
@Anjela,

The incentive for a woman to work in Switzerland is the lowest in Europe. In terms of gender equality, Switzerland is the worst in Europe, according to the Economist.
http://www.bilan.ch/economie-plus-de...ravail-feminin

That said, you don't want your kid to stay home until the age of 4, instead you want you r kid to get social skills, have friends and learn.
To be fair, usually people then chuck up the Scandinavian example of work/life/family balance, then wave it in the face of the Swiss model, right?

All good in Sweden or Norway or Denmark where there is cheap childcare, endless maternity leave, generous paternity leave, shorter working weeks, and basically ample provision for women to get stuck into working life, right?

All this comes at a price, though. Taxes in Scandinavia are eye-watering by comparison.

Basically, Switzerland can offer you the same service but the only difference is that you have to pay for it directly out of your own pocket instead of via the national pot.

You can't expect to get a nice fat salary and tiny taxes then expect society to pick up the tab for childcare and all the services needed for both parents to work - it would collapse.
Reply With Quote
The following 7 users would like to thank for this useful post:
  #42  
Old 16.03.2017, 10:57
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: Ostschweiz
Posts: 8,043
Groaned at 348 Times in 282 Posts
Thanked 10,400 Times in 5,497 Posts
Urs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond reputeUrs Max has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

I think OP hasn't really arrived yet despite having lived here for 1 year. He still compares to what's available elsewhere for his salary, ignoring the fact that he lives in a country with much higher average incme than SG.

And he seems to apply a good measure of selectiveness. Why would you need daycare if you have one salary only? It's either or, otherwise it's only fair if you pay up for the luxury.

Frankly if you have trouble financing your family of 3 on 180k gross you're doing a lot of things wrong or your expectations are simply not realistic.

Just don't get me started on the following one. To paraphrase: "Wouldn't it be nice if the unskilled were paid less so I can abuse them some more, and also lived in their own slums". OP move elsewhere. With this attitude this country is not for you.
Quote:
However, wouldn't it be ideal if there were neighborhoods with affordable rent and affordable services for low-wage workers, i.e. they have a very decent, fulfilling life there, yet their salaries are lower than highly skilled professionals, enabling the broader society to enjoy affordable services.
Reply With Quote
The following 10 users would like to thank Urs Max for this useful post:
  #43  
Old 16.03.2017, 11:01
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 13,945
Groaned at 272 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 17,096 Times in 7,244 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
To be fair, usually people then chuck up the Scandinavian example of work/life/family balance, then wave it in the face of the Swiss model, right?

All good in Sweden or Norway or Denmark where there is cheap childcare, endless maternity leave, generous paternity leave, shorter working weeks, and basically ample provision for women to get stuck into working life, right?

All this comes at a price, though. Taxes in Scandinavia are eye-watering by comparison.

Basically, Switzerland can offer you the same service but the only difference is that you have to pay for it directly out of your own pocket instead of via the national pot.

You can't expect to get a nice fat salary and tiny taxes then expect society to pick up the tab for childcare and all the services needed for both parents to work - it would collapse.
Or maybe you can. Just earn money here, then move to Scandinavia before having kids and then wind things down there.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Phil_MCR for this useful post:
  #44  
Old 16.03.2017, 11:07
gbn's Avatar
gbn gbn is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Zuri Oberland
Posts: 2,748
Groaned at 109 Times in 74 Posts
Thanked 2,381 Times in 1,120 Posts
gbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
...All good in Sweden or Norway or Denmark where there is cheap childcare, endless maternity leave, generous paternity leave, shorter working weeks, and basically ample provision for women to get stuck into working life, right?...
As a childless older couple, we're very happy with low taxes and not having to subsidise ungrateful parents with free childcare in their socialist utopia.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank gbn for this useful post:
  #45  
Old 16.03.2017, 11:28
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: CH
Posts: 9,532
Groaned at 326 Times in 266 Posts
Thanked 13,809 Times in 7,129 Posts
greenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond reputegreenmount has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
@Minimia, you make an interesting point which seems to be the core of the issue. There is so much income equality in the country, that you could basically "live next door to your cleaner". Nothing wrong with that, I agree, on the contrary. However, wouldn't it be ideal if there were neighborhoods with affordable rent and affordable services for low-wage workers, i.e. they have a very decent, fulfilling life there, yet their salaries are lower than highly skilled professionals, enabling the broader society to enjoy affordable services. Otherwise, the broader society only has a (limited) choice between expensive and very expensive services.
Hmm, not sure how to interpret this, really. Should low-wage workers live in separate, cheap areas so we can have more access to services we feel entitled to? And "they", whoever they might be, live there happily ever after. It sounds a bit like this, no offence. Switzerland avoided lots of social problems exactly by diminishing the income gaps, and not by ghettoizing social strata.
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank greenmount for this useful post:
  #46  
Old 16.03.2017, 11:45
gbn's Avatar
gbn gbn is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Zuri Oberland
Posts: 2,748
Groaned at 109 Times in 74 Posts
Thanked 2,381 Times in 1,120 Posts
gbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
...Switzerland avoided lots of social problems exactly by diminishing the income gaps, and not by ghettoizing social strata.
tl;dr Low pay in Switzerland is relatively high and buys you more

Now the blah

The Gini coefficient (admittedly imperfect) puts Switzerland (4th) ahead of Norway (5th), Denmark(6th) and Sweden (11th) *before* taxes and redistribution
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._and_transfers

*After* taxes, Switzerland drops to 17th
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o..._and_transfers

There are several interpretations to this, but this tells me that the Scandinavians take a lot in tax then give a lot back in the free socialist utopian things. In Switzerland, they just take less overall so there is less redistribution of wealth.

But you have more left over to spend as you wish

And what to spend it on? What can I buy with it? GDP at PPP rates puts Switzerland well up compare to the Scandie utopias without oil https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...PP)_per_capita
__________________
Don't let Sean Connery teach your dog to sit
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users would like to thank gbn for this useful post:
  #47  
Old 16.03.2017, 11:49
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,488
Groaned at 372 Times in 287 Posts
Thanked 16,313 Times in 9,257 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

nickmartin, you always have the option to go home. Switzerland isn't for everyone.
Reply With Quote
This user groans at Medea Fleecestealer for this post:
  #48  
Old 16.03.2017, 13:09
miniMia's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: romandie
Posts: 9,993
Groaned at 101 Times in 92 Posts
Thanked 9,106 Times in 4,522 Posts
miniMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond reputeminiMia has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
@miniMia,

Thanks for your answer. I wasn't referring to poor people, but layers in a society that have access to goods and services they can afford (e.g. low-end to high-end hairdresser, housing etc.). Conceptually, it's interesting to think about such model, but I may be wrong about its viability.

Regarding your comments on purchase power. Add another 2000CHF-2600CHF for childcare, which is the budget probably covering your two cars and part of your savings... and then you may realize that you got to make lots of choices on a daily basis... a skiing weekend costing 1300CHF++ (it really does cost as much Friday-Sunday, with hotel, 4 meals, ski rental, ski pass) is becoming though to justify, perhaps just once or twice per year, which is sad when the mountain's "calling" on a daily basis.

Regarding your comment on shopping around, in my mind that is another element impacting your quality of life. Suspecting that you getting "ripped off" every time you shop is not a good feeling. Same goods sold at double the price as in France are way to common. There is little justification for this except Swiss willingness to pay and lack of competition. Also, I experienced that sometimes the product range on offer can be limited to high-end goods, giving you the impression that this is the budget you have allocate to such type of product. Luckily we have Amazon to get some sense of fair prices and full product ranges.
Seriously?

-Low to high end services do exist. it seems you want low end to be even lower.

-You need to shop around anywhere you go.

- my savings were not eaten up by child care as I was at home.... now had I needed
child care, that means both of us were working. Imagine your spouse works and makes 6500f a month (the median income in Geneva), probably more... . You can't cover 2500 in child care?

Last edited by miniMia; 16.03.2017 at 13:47.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 16.03.2017, 14:16
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Geneva
Posts: 40
Groaned at 36 Times in 12 Posts
Thanked 52 Times in 10 Posts
nickmartin has made some interesting contributions
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Thanks guys for your replies and opinions. Everybody is different, is the product of his own set of experiences. Judgments and expectations are relative to one's experience as well. There is no right or wrong here, at least in my mind.

@gbn, thanks for your insightful post on OECD Gini distribution, makes a lot of sense.
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 16.03.2017, 14:16
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Vaud
Posts: 4,552
Groaned at 492 Times in 321 Posts
Thanked 4,099 Times in 1,952 Posts
CorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
nickmartin, you always have the option to go home. Switzerland isn't for everyone.
Why that type of comments always come up during criticism?

The OP has made a fair description of the situation, it's not about "home vs Switzerland". It's his view on what is wrong in Switzerland, should he be denied of having an opinion?

And instead of "retreating" why not taking the issues as a statement to move forward, as a basis of improving what is possible and coping with the rest?

Maybe you have been Swissified to be able to say such comments. Having said that I fully agree it's not for everyone here.

To me this country is full of ostriches , happy in their own holes. Don't tell me the OP's critics about the health system are not correct, for exemple?!!
It's one thing to "accept", another to play ZenMaster and cover your eyes under the earth when things are not positive...


Oh and frankly the OP can go "in another Canton" rather than "going home" because a lot of his issues are Geneva related. Changing canton changes a lot sometimes, a few issue won't be there in Fribourg for example.
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 16.03.2017, 14:26
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
Maybe you have been Swissified to be able to say such comments. Having said that I fully agree it's not for everyone here.

To me this country is full of ostriches , happy in their own holes. Don't tell me the OP's critics about the health system are not correct, for exemple?!!
It's one thing to "accept", another to play ZenMaster and cover your eyes under the earth when things are not positive...
Actually, it's not that difficult to crunch your own personal figures to see if you're better off, as well as look out of the window to figure out whether you like what you see and add any other criteria into the mix which are important to you and see where you are better off.

Next, ask yourself if the stuff that bothers you is a deal breaker or whether it doesn't alter your grand scheme sufficiently to send you packing.

That's called being a grown up, and is nothing to do with being "Swissified".
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank for this useful post:
  #52  
Old 16.03.2017, 14:32
gbn's Avatar
gbn gbn is offline
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Zuri Oberland
Posts: 2,748
Groaned at 109 Times in 74 Posts
Thanked 2,381 Times in 1,120 Posts
gbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond reputegbn has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
@gbn, thanks for your insightful post on OECD Gini distribution, makes a lot of sense.
You're welcome.

Personally, the idea of being over in the Socialist Republic of Geneva to live and work fills me with horror. Even visiting is a chore.

For example, there is a lot of distortion in the housing market because of NGOs and UN things: they have far bigger budgets dragging the prices up even for hovels. And they don't pay tax, thus shrinking the tax base.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank gbn for this useful post:
  #53  
Old 16.03.2017, 14:33
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Vaud
Posts: 4,552
Groaned at 492 Times in 321 Posts
Thanked 4,099 Times in 1,952 Posts
CorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
Actually, it's not that difficult to crunch your own personal figures to see if you're better off, as well as look out of the window to figure out whether you like what you see and add any other criteria into the mix which are important to you and see where you are better off.

Next, ask yourself if the stuff that bothers you is a deal breaker or whether it doesn't alter your grand scheme sufficiently to send you packing.

That's called being a grown up, and is nothing to do with being "Swissified".
Something that the OP is perfectly capable of doing, without being suggested to "go home".
He made a fair assessement of his experience in Switzerland. Some might not agree, fair enough.

No need to "send him packing HOME", there are other options like>
a) Changing canton.
b) Improving things
c) Learning to ignore or cope with other things

Funny and pathetic at the same time, I am sure many are thriving and drooling at the idea that the OP should "go home", while in fact there ARE many better options for everyone. It's called improvment, a foreign concept for many.

Oh and anyway the OP did not seem to ask advice on what to do but discussing about "quality of life". A classic case of misplaced expectations.

Fair enough the Swissified comment was rather unexplained and without context a bit strange. A small poke.
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 16.03.2017, 14:56
Phil_MCR's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Basel
Posts: 13,945
Groaned at 272 Times in 178 Posts
Thanked 17,096 Times in 7,244 Posts
Phil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond reputePhil_MCR has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
Hmm, not sure how to interpret this, really. Should low-wage workers live in separate, cheap areas so we can have more access to services we feel entitled to?
Yes. We call this place: France.
Reply With Quote
The following 8 users would like to thank Phil_MCR for this useful post:
  #55  
Old 16.03.2017, 17:52
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Location: Zurich
Posts: 312
Groaned at 456 Times in 185 Posts
Thanked 41 Times in 24 Posts
aresid is considered unworthyaresid is considered unworthyaresid is considered unworthyaresid is considered unworthyaresid is considered unworthy
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
Hi all,

I moved to the Geneva area about 3 years ago, hoping to move to a well run, clean and safe country with beautiful nature.

Weekends are certainly great here, so much to explore, and every season has its charm. However, daily life feels really worse than any place I have lived before, so I am not sure how quality of life can be considered the best in the world here. I look for guidance! What I am getting wrong here?

Let me explain:

- Even compared to our Swiss salaries, in percentage terms, services seem extremely expensive. To the extent that you end up avoiding dealing with anyone, do everything yourself or ask friends for favors. It's that bad. Services include babysitters, taxis, home repair, home delivery services, etc.

- There is in my mind a culture of scarcity in this country. Everything seems a scarce resource that you need to fight for, and which gives the seller a strong position, eventually reflected in pricing. Examples: housing (200 applicants for one apartment I heard in Geneva), childcare (long waiting lists), road infrastructure (try coming back from Valais on Sunday, crossing Geneva,etc.), spas and swimming pools (often overcrowded making the experience really unpleasant), want a spot to moor your boat on Lake Geneva --> years in a waiting list, etc.

- There is also a culture of doing the strict minimum: insurance coverage (limited scope, and an obsession with franchises), childcare opening hours (often until 6pm only!!), opening hours of shops (no Sunday, 7pm weekdays), call centers closed during lunchtime and in the evenings/weekends, architecture-wise it's usually purely utilitarian, indoor pools are kept at low temps, 25-27degrees which is too cold for young children, etc.

- There is a culture of "having to pay for everything", even for things you didn't know existed. Go to Zermatt and it's really in your face, even before you get there. You're paying your taxes but somehow there is more: "Firemen service insurance", the public broadcasting fee, "trash tax", etc. Sometimes you wonder what is the next fee you had not anticipated...

- Restaurants are significantly more expensive than eating at home. Like 5-10x more, and food is not particularly amazing. Food in France for instance is much more sophisticated in my mind. So you end up never eating out, and inviting people at your place (with the huge overhead involved in cleaning up and preparing food). Even on a daily basis at work, the canteen charges you 12CHF++, for canteen food that is, so that you end up eating sandwiches to keep budget reasonable.

- Public transport seems more expensive for a family than owning car. It's hard to believe but it seems true. Everybody here is praising the public transport network , but I feel it's rarely in my (financial) interest to use it. In the mountains and nature, a car is so much more convenient anyways. Now, talking about cars... it's a real nightmare to drive through Geneva, it feels like the traffic light system is archaic and not coordinated, generating artificial(!) congestion. Really frustrating and makes the city look so badly managed (ok some will say its an incentive for using public transport, but not everyone, especially families with young kids, can enjoy public transport). Not even talking about parking fees in Geneva (paid once 20++CHF for 3-4 hours).

- The concept of public good and space is not as developed as in other countries. The mentality is steered towards private ownership and capitalism (in a negative sense). Look at how most of Lake Geneva's shores have been sold to the rich and famous, leaving very little infrastructure for everyone to enjoy. Try riding a bike or go for a run along Lake Geneva, it's a terrible experience. Just go to Annecy and see what shared premium public places can look like. Similary, parking space across the country is under the dictatorship of private ownership, instead of shared or available for free. Just cross the border to France and you enjoy "freedom" to park wherever you. It feels good/much better.

- Early child education is a nightmare. First if you want to be subsidized (which with one salary you usually want to), you will be put on a waiting list at the commune and cannot directly contact kindergardens nor visit them!!! Very frustrating and you feel at the mercy of a system, no free choice. Then, when you get a spot, probably after 6 months or so, you have to pay the price, up to 2600CHF per month, which is steep. If the quality of education was great, you could still swallow it, but then, most creches are really just advanced "garderies", there is personalized child development, they don't learn anything really, mostly play in a supervised and unsupervised environment. So, you end up having to put your kid in a private school, not subsidized, which is typically good in terms of quality of early child education. Overall a poor system, depending on what you're used to in your own country.

- Housing is a nightmare. Another aspect where supply and demand are totally imbalanced. It's a seller's market, definitely, with as I said 10s or 100s of applicants per vacancy. Moreover many apartments are old, some expect you to share washing machines with others, etc. so you somehow feel you're paying a lot, but don't get much value or a high-end product.

- Taxes. They might look low or high depending where you're coming from. One thing is for sure, the system is so complex that in advance even tax advisors find it difficult to tell you how much you're going to pay. Moreover, married couples pay more taxes than singles, which goes against what most people think is right (i.e. state should incentivize marriage and having children).

- Healthcare and health insurance. International surveys say it's great, but my experience it's exactly the opposite. First coverage is really minimalistic (Lamal). No IVF covered for instance, no dentistry, etc. so you better safe 1000s of CHF just for such costs which are incurred by many at some point. If you want better coverage, the complementaires exist, but somehow only cover a limited number of things as well and require a 5-year commitment, which is crazy! Then this culture of having huge franchises and a quote-part is difficult to swallow and you always think twice before going to the doctor. No peace of mind! Finally, my experience is that doctors are so much overpaid here, it's quite ridiculous. They earn at least 5x more than in France I would say. Moreover, if you want an appointment on the same day or the next day with a GP, they apply a "emergency" surcharge. Also, every minute counts, i.e. there is no fixed cost for a GP visit. All in all, it's a stressful, painful and expensive system built in my mind rather for the medical profession rather than with the patients in mind.

- Switzerland is clean - well, Geneva is not clean with plenty of graffiti's everywhere and buildings not being well maintained.

- Switzerland is beautiful - well, architecture-wise in the cities, it feels mostly like the "soviet-union", minimalist architecture. Modern architecture is often not very inspired either. For some reason also, they kept these tram power lines everywhere which looks messy at best. Overall, the earlier you leave cities the better it gets in Switzerland (i.e. live close to the highway to escape!).

- Switzerland is safe - this is very true I must admit, to an extent I have never experienced elsewhere (postman leaving valuable deliveries in front your door outside the apartment building, etc.). That said, in Geneva at night, you often stumble upon drug dealers, junkies and people that make you uncomfortable. As a woman I would not walk alone at night in many areas of Geneva.

There is more to say, but this is probably a good list to start with. If my assessment above makes sense, at least to some extent and to some people, how on earth can this correspond to a highest quality of life on earth? In my mind the system doesn't give peace of mind, is very competitive and delivers little value at the end of the day. The beauty of the nature only compensates this partially. If you're local with a good network of friends and family you can rely on, or are an expat with an generous package, you might be fine, but otherwise, quality of life is quite low in my mind ! Also, how come it isn't better? In a highly democratic and rich country you would expect the system to be "customized for people" and not protecting special interests so much.
The OP is right, though I can't speak for Geneva, I live in Zurich, I wish to visit Geneva but the train costs 89chf per way! In any other Country I could travel the same distance by taxi for less money! this fact alone is sufficient evidence that the living standards in ch are actually much lower than elsewhere. That Switzerland has a quality of life is just an illusion with no real basis. People keep saying that Swiss people have better lifestyle because they have higher income. Truth is that Swiss people are richer only in nominal terms, in Real terms hey are much poorer than any other country. The op is right, everything in ch is scarce, the size of your appartment, the size of Hotel rooms, the restaurant portions and so on.
Reply With Quote
The following 3 users groan at aresid for this post:
  #56  
Old 16.03.2017, 18:00
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
The op is right, everything in ch is scarce, the size of your appartment, the size of Hotel rooms, the restaurant portions and so on.
I live in a house with thirteen rooms and a view of snowcapped mountains. I am a school teacher.

If I lived anywhere else in the world, I'd be lucky to afford a squalid flat in a vile suburb.

What were you saying about quality of life?
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank for this useful post:
  #57  
Old 16.03.2017, 18:04
baboon's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Rheintal
Posts: 4,068
Groaned at 155 Times in 134 Posts
Thanked 7,107 Times in 3,261 Posts
baboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond reputebaboon has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
The OP is right, though I can't speak for Geneva, I live in Zurich, I wish to visit Geneva but the train costs 89chf per way! In any other Country I could travel the same distance by taxi for less money! this fact alone is sufficient evidence that the living standards in ch are actually much lower than elsewhere. That Switzerland has a quality of life is just an illusion with no real basis. People keep saying that Swiss people have better lifestyle because they have higher income. Truth is that Swiss people are richer only in nominal terms, in Real terms hey are much poorer than any other country. The op is right, everything in ch is scarce, the size of your appartment, the size of Hotel rooms, the restaurant portions and so on.
So much bullshit in just one paragraph.
Reply With Quote
The following 6 users would like to thank baboon for this useful post:
  #58  
Old 16.03.2017, 18:13
Junior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2016
Location: Geneva
Posts: 40
Groaned at 36 Times in 12 Posts
Thanked 52 Times in 10 Posts
nickmartin has made some interesting contributions
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
I live in a house with thirteen rooms and a view of snowcapped mountains. I am a school teacher.

If I lived anywhere else in the world, I'd be lucky to afford a squalid flat in a vile suburb.

What were you saying about quality of life?
Seriously? That's indeed stunning.
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 16.03.2017, 18:14
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Vaud
Posts: 4,552
Groaned at 492 Times in 321 Posts
Thanked 4,099 Times in 1,952 Posts
CorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
View Post
The OP is right, though I can't speak for Geneva, I live in Zurich, I wish to visit Geneva but the train costs 89chf per way! In any other Country I could travel the same distance by taxi for less money! this fact alone is sufficient evidence that the living standards in ch are actually much lower than elsewhere. That Switzerland has a quality of life is just an illusion with no real basis. People keep saying that Swiss people have better lifestyle because they have higher income. Truth is that Swiss people are richer only in nominal terms, in Real terms hey are much poorer than any other country. The op is right, everything in ch is scarce, the size of your appartment, the size of Hotel rooms, the restaurant portions and so on.
Talking about being right, you are...lef...I mean wrong.
"sufficient evidence" that you have problems with analysis...

The cost of an expense is meaningless without taking into account the income. Something you ignored.

Also, a Swiss would pay for the 1/2 fare card (around 170chf/year) and "only" pay 44.50chf per way Geneva-Zurich. It's almost paid in 2 similar trips.


The OP is right with many things, you are simply...wrong.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank CorsebouTheReturn for this useful post:
  #60  
Old 16.03.2017, 18:21
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Vaud
Posts: 4,552
Groaned at 492 Times in 321 Posts
Thanked 4,099 Times in 1,952 Posts
CorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond reputeCorsebouTheReturn has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Is Quality of Life in Geneva really that good?

Quote:
I live in a house with thirteen rooms and a view of snowcapped mountains. I am a school teacher.

If I lived anywhere else in the world, I'd be lucky to afford a squalid flat in a vile suburb.

What were you saying about quality of life?
I'd be careful about that reference, I heard they eat dogs in that part of Switzerland...
Probably because they are too far from Migros or Coop!
Reply With Quote
The following 5 users would like to thank CorsebouTheReturn for this useful post:
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Salary / cost of life / quality of life question JuanP Employment 33 11.03.2014 12:24
Is the quality of life declining in Switzerland? Prabhu Guptara Daily life 99 20.02.2012 21:20
Mammut clothing range - is it really that good? magic Other/general 18 19.11.2011 17:58
Hair extensions in Zurich.really good quality and price caro1 Commercial 1 21.02.2011 13:48
Is it because of the altitude here that the cheese is high quality? transition Daily life 47 06.08.2010 22:07


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 17:07.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0