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-   -   Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now? (https://www.englishforum.ch/complaints-corner/298329-ugh-rude-shop-owners-don-t-they-need-business-right-now.html)

azncandycow 28.05.2020 20:05

Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
I had a really terrible confrontation with a super rude shop owner where he went out of his way to personally harass me on the street. Instead of doing something horrible back to him which my my initial reaction, I just left him a good review (of course documenting EXACTLY what happened) and recommended that people go visit his shop because he's probably just hurting and having a bad time like many small businesses right now.

Also...anyway he slices this short of a public apology on the business review site, it's not going to look good for him.

Here's the review I left if you're curious:

Quote:

This shop needs more business and is likely hurting right now like most small business this year.

I recently had a very jarring experience with the store owner. I was late to an appointment and jumped out of my car to pay the meter in front of the store. In my hurry, I hadn’t realized I didn’t fully turn the motor off, which is when he came out of his store and told me. He intimidated me and would not let me pay for the meter until I complied with his order to turn off the motor even though I was already standing at the meter with coins in hand. Unfortunately, after this unpleasant confrontation I realized I did not have the right coins for the meter and seeing that his bike shop was the only shop in sight, I went into his store to ask him for change even trying to offer a bit more change for any inconvenience or grief I might have caused him. However, he just told me he could not help me and then ignored me. Luckily a kind stranger walking by on the street after hearing what happened, went into the store on my behalf and got the right coins for me.

I think this store owner is not in a good place right now and needs a bit more kindness during these uncertain times. He probably just had a bad day when he met me, because his last bad reviews about his customer service/people skills was 3 years ago so he has clearly been working on this.

It looked like a nice store with quality high-end bikes and accessories. Go give his wares a look and support local small businesses.

roegner 28.05.2020 20:11

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by azncandycow (Post 3185938)
I had a really terrible confrontation with a super rude shop owner where he went out of his way to personally harass me on the street. Instead of doing something horrible back to him which my my initial reaction, I just left him a good review (of course documenting EXACTLY what happened) and recommended that people go visit his shop because he's probably just hurting and having a bad time like many small businesses right now.

Also...anyway he slices this short of a public apology on the business review site, it's not going to look good for him.

Here's the review I left if you're curious:

And what is your problem? Because he didn´t give you change?

Guest 28.05.2020 20:32

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Typical one of those reviews where people do not realise that they themselves are the biggest fool in the story.

AbFab 28.05.2020 20:38

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
How does „not fully turn the motor off“ work? Is it possible to partly turn it off??

Guest 28.05.2020 20:43

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
From your post, you had no intention to go into the store and give him the business he needed- did you? But taking a space that customers would have required to go into the shop.

curley 28.05.2020 20:44

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
<<In my hurry, I hadn’t realized I didn’t fully turn the motor off,>>
:rofl: right, happens all the time

Well, if your car has a manual gearbox it either jumped forward and you would have paid for the wrong parking space or it rolled off and you didn't need a parking space at all. Ergo: No need for change. Thank God for bikers, huh? :msnsarcastic:

Guest 28.05.2020 21:10

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
What a nasty and mean spirited thing for you to do. Reviews are supposed to be about the quality of service and/or goods that you receive from the store and not for spiteful and petty revenge from someone who has no intention of being a customer. Shame on you for posting it and double shame for coming onto a forum to whine and brag about what you have done

k_and_e 28.05.2020 21:17

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by azncandycow (Post 3185938)
I had a really terrible confrontation with a super rude shop owner where he went out of his way to personally harass me on the street. Instead of doing something horrible back to him which my my initial reaction, I just left him a good review (of course documenting EXACTLY what happened) and recommended that people go visit his shop because he's probably just hurting and having a bad time like many small businesses right now.

Also...anyway he slices this short of a public apology on the business review site, it's not going to look good for him.

Here's the review I left if you're curious:


Great post but keep in mind that Friday is joke-day here.

Island Monkey 28.05.2020 21:45

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
You clearly wanted to write a bad review about this guy and wrapped it up in niceties to make yourself look/feel better..... I believe we call it a shit sandwich, a way of giving negative feedback but making people feel better whilst doing it.

Either leave a bad review because you think he deserves it, or don't bother writing anything.

lost_inbroad 28.05.2020 21:46

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
If some of you would read the entire post provided by OP, they state, that the shop owner prevented them from paying the meter and from a legal standpoint, he had no right to do so.

Letting the car idle at length is a misdemeanor, if anything, but it has to be proven.

Jim2007 28.05.2020 22:01

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by azncandycow (Post 3185938)
I had a really terrible confrontation with a super rude shop owner where he went out of his way to personally harass me on the street. Instead of doing something horrible back to him which my my initial reaction, I just left him a good review (of course documenting EXACTLY what happened) and recommended that people go visit his shop because he's probably just hurting and having a bad time like many small businesses right now.

Also...anyway he slices this short of a public apology on the business review site, it's not going to look good for him.

Here's the review I left if you're curious:

Absolutely despicable, but hi you have now demonstrated to the world twice, just what you are. well done.

st2lemans 28.05.2020 22:16

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lost_inbroad (Post 3185983)
If some of you would read the entire post provided by OP, they state, that the shop owner prevented them from paying the meter and from a legal standpoint, he had no right to do so.

Letting the car idle at length is a misdemeanor, if anything, but it has to be proven.

Be nice, or I will post all the kiddie porn that I downloaded from a broken USB that someone sent me. ;)

Tom

doropfiz 28.05.2020 22:18

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lost_inbroad (Post 3185983)
Letting the car idle at length is a misdemeanor, if anything, but it has to be proven.

... or admitted to, freely, which OP has done, in writing, both on whatever place he/she first posted the review, and here, again.

Axa 28.05.2020 22:19

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
There's crazy people everywhere.

A few weeks ago I drove to a nearby farm for greens and eggs. The farm has a gravel parking for a dozen cars, albeit no markings at all. I arrived there and simply parked.

I was reaching my wallet when a couple arrived in another car and parked next to me.....in a damned empty large parking during the COVID time. I was about to leave my car when the passenger started to gesticulate and move her arms, trying to say something. I more or less understood that the front bumper of my car was not enough close to the shrubs delimiting the parking, therefore I was not properly parked.

I drive an sporty car, not an SUV, therefore I need to be careful of not denting the low front bumper. Of course I did not move and stayed in my car just to see what happened.

The man went into the farm shop and returned 5 min later. The woman also stayed in her car but she never stopped doing funny faces and pointing how I was not properly parked in an empty large parking with no markings. I just waited in my car until they left with a face of disgust.

Sometimes it's just better to ignore crazy people. What can I do if I leave the car and the crazy woman starts to shout at me and then complain about my inappropriate behavior? I'm a magnet for this type of problems. If she was crazy enough to start arguing out of nothing, sadly everything can happen :(

I appreciate the rules and order in Switzerland, but sometimes people break the order in serious way only to avoid a minor disruption to their perceived order, FAIL!

OP, crazy people doesn't need any kind of punishment, but forgiveness. Their mental health issues, anxiety and manias are more than enough as punishment for them and their loved ones.

lost_inbroad 28.05.2020 22:24

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by doropfiz (Post 3185993)
... or admitted to, freely, which OP has done, in writing, both on whatever place he/she first posted the review, and here, again.

Yeah, OP forgot, that's all. But that's neither here nor there. I don't know the "idling" laws off the top of my head. But IMO, that doesn't constitute an idling violation and even if it does, that's in the range of a parking ticket and who hasn't gotten those before. Preventing somebody's personal movement by intimidation is a whole different story.

greenmount 29.05.2020 06:22

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by azncandycow (Post 3185938)
I had a really terrible confrontation with a super rude shop owner where he went out of his way to personally harass me on the street. Instead of doing something horrible back to him which my my initial reaction, I just left him a good review (of course documenting EXACTLY what happened) and recommended that people go visit his shop because he's probably just hurting and having a bad time like many small businesses right now.

Also...anyway he slices this short of a public apology on the business review site, it's not going to look good for him.

Here's the review I left if you're curious:

The funny thing is that you think you've been generous or kind. :)

Let me tell you something: this sort of shops survive because they have loyal customers or the type of customers who are after their products, come there with a plan i.e. they often know quite well what are they looking for and when they have an appointment they're not late. :)


IMHO...of course.
He'll survive.

In my experience these specialised shops are run by people with a passion. It's too bad they fail to cater for every client's needs and are not always in the best mood....well, as they say, nobody is perfect.

Guest 29.05.2020 08:23

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by greenmount (Post 3186047)
The funny thing is that you think you've been generous or kind. :)

Let me tell you something: this sort of shops survive because they have loyal customers or the type of customers who are after their products, come there with a plan i.e. they often know quite well what are they looking for and when they have an appointment they're not late. :)


IMHO...of course.
He'll survive.

In my experience these specialised shops are run by people with a passion. It's too bad they fail to cater for every client's needs and are not always in the best mood....well, as they say, nobody is perfect.


Yes, but OP was not a customer or had an appointment at his shop at all, she merely took a parking space directly outside his shop, stopping potential real customers of his from using it.

For someone whose first instinct was to do "something horrible to him", if there had been real harassment and intimidation as she claims, then she seems the type of person to have just called the police. She could hardly have been that harassed or intimidated either or she wouldn't have then gone into his shop asking for change. More likely this is about him, as was his right, not giving her the change she wanted and so she has become childish

I would not be at all surprised if she was the one that was very rude to the poor man. I stand by my earlier post that it was a very juvenile and petty thing to write that review which had nothing to do with her experience of his services and/or goods. In her own words she wanted to do something horrible and so she did and now hopes for a public apology. OP you are the one that should be making apologies

greenmount 29.05.2020 10:07

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Dog (Post 3186060)
Yes, but OP was not a customer or had an appointment at his shop at all, she merely took a parking space directly outside his shop, stopping potential real customers of his from using it.

For someone whose first instinct was to do "something horrible to him", if there had been real harassment and intimidation as she claims, then she seems the type of person to have just called the police. She could hardly have been that harassed or intimidated either or she wouldn't have then gone into his shop asking for change. More likely this is about him, as was his right, not giving her the change she wanted and so she has become childish

I would not be at all surprised if she was the one that was very rude to the poor man. I stand by my earlier post that it was a very juvenile and petty thing to write that review which had nothing to do with her experience of his services and/or goods. In her own words she wanted to do something horrible and so she did and now hopes for a public apology. OP you are the one that should be making apologies

Awww, you're right. She/OP didn't have the appointment there...anyways, I'd like to read the other side of the story, it could be way different than what she/OP wrote here...apologies for the misunderstanding.

Just had two appointments at similar shops and all was good. I started to believe some people live somewhere else not CH. :)

DerDieDas 29.05.2020 10:52

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

From your post, you had no intention to go into the store and give him the business he needed- did you? But taking a space that customers would have required to go into the shop.
Nonsense. The metered parking spaces are for everyone, not just for the customers of the shops they are in front of!

aSwissInTheUS 29.05.2020 11:00

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lost_inbroad (Post 3185996)
Yeah, OP forgot, that's all. But that's neither here nor there. I don't know the "idling" laws off the top of my head. But IMO, that doesn't constitute an idling violation and even if it does, that's in the range of a parking ticket and who hasn't gotten those before. Preventing somebody's personal movement by intimidation is a whole different story.

I never got two (!) CHF 60 parking ticket at once.

Engine idling OBV No. 326.2 CHF 60 (Art. 33 Bst. a VRV)
Key in ignition when not in car OBV No. 317 CHF 60 (Art. 22 Abs. 1 VRV)

Guest 29.05.2020 11:11

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by DerDieDas (Post 3186117)
Nonsense. The metered parking spaces are for everyone, not just for the customers of the shops they are in front of!


True, but that does not give OP the right to expect the shop to supply her with the correct coins and then have a hissy fit and post a passive aggressive review that had nothing whatsoever to do with his business when he declined to.

DerDieDas 29.05.2020 11:15

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by azncandycow (Post 3185938)
I just left him a good review (of course documenting EXACTLY what happened) and recommended that people go visit his shop because he's probably just hurting and having a bad time like many small businesses right now.

I think it was wrong of you to leave a review without being a customer. The reviews should be for services/products businesses provide to the customers or their attitudes to a customer.

I understand you were hurt and tempted to hurt him in turn though. Sometimes these aggressions come out of nowhere for the most trivial reasons and when you are in stress already. You should have indeed turned off the ignition but he could have told this to you in a polite manner. Unfortunately I see this sort of policing behaviour quite often and almost everyt ime, I am unprepared (usually later I beat myself for not having told them to bog off) Sometimes I do not even understand what the other person is trying to correct. It happens in such random places.

You, like quite a few newcomers thought you could come here and rant but you were met with the usual EF treatment. I do sympathize with you though and do not necessarily think that 'there is another side to the story'.

I wouldn't have gone in to the shop to ask for change though. The guy was being mean and was likely to be petty.

DerDieDas 29.05.2020 11:19

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mr Dog (Post 3186131)
True, but that does not give OP the right to expect the shop to supply her with the correct coins and then have a hissy fit and post a passive aggressive review that had nothing whatsoever to do with his business when he declined to.

That's is a different matter. I just commented on a post that made no sense.

BTW, I understand the OP is more upset at the first part of the altercation where they felt intimidated. The business with the coins is a different matter. I personally wouldn't have asked such a mean person for further help.

DerDieDas 29.05.2020 11:22

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by st2lemans (Post 3185992)
Be nice, or I will post all the kiddie porn that I downloaded from a broken USB that someone sent me. ;)

Tom

I am not sure if this post should stay here. It might be written in jest but joking about such things should be avoided. It might even put you in trouble.

doropfiz 29.05.2020 11:23

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
I just don't get the point of, or worth of, OP's review posted online. What is the aggression and the malice for? Who is to gain anything from it? Nor do I see the sense of posting the story of umbrage here, other than if she/he wants to learn something.
EDIT: Maybe like the opening post of another thread of hers/his: "Is it just me or...?"
https://www.englishforum.ch/complain...nfriendly.html
  1. When I set out driving a car, I am responsible for switching the car off, and removing the key from the ignition, before I get out of the car. This is always the case, no matter what.
  2. If I want to park, I am free to choose any legal parking space, including the one right in front of a shop into which I don't intend to go.
  3. I am responsible for putting sufficient coins into the parking meter. I can plan ahead, and take these coins with me, before I leave home. Or I can hope that some kind person will help me, when I get there. Or I can just not bother to full the meter correctly, and risk the fine.
  4. If any shop-owner, or anyone else, does not want to give me change for the meter, he's completely within his rights. I have no expectation that he must give me change, and he has no obligation do to so.
Surely that's all just adult, responsible behaviour about driving and parking.

Now, even if the man was uncooperative, grumpy or downright nasty, what of it? Why do the counter-nastiness of posting a bad review of him? The more so when she/he was not even a customer.

OP, is all this fuss just because you were disappointed that someone didn't help you out, when you hadn't planned properly?

If, on the other hand, the man is truly dangerous: if, OP, he hit you or threatened you seriously, then that, indeed, is important, and you should try to decide whether or not his behavour is likely to harm anyone else and, if so, you might consider reporting it to the police.

Axa 29.05.2020 12:04

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by aSwissInTheUS (Post 3186122)
I never got two (!) CHF 60 parking ticket at once.

Engine idling OBV No. 326.2 CHF 60 (Art. 33 Bst. a VRV)
Key in ignition when not in car OBV No. 317 CHF 60 (Art. 22 Abs. 1 VRV)

Art 33 is about avoidable noise. Leaving the engine idling is indeed avoidable.

Art 22. is clear: drivers that leave their vehicle must stop the engine.

But this left me wondering, I may have broken these 2 laws recently: turning the car on, receiving a warning that the boot is not properly closed, put the car in neutral + parking brake and descended to close once again the boot........without turning the engine off :msncrazy:

If the police sees this and a fine is given, no prob. If a bored neighbor without anything better to do with his life comes to tell something I'd simply ignore him. The consequence is that once you make this person upset, you cannot expect any politeness anymore.

Urs Max 29.05.2020 12:51

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Axa (Post 3186165)
But this left me wondering, I may have broken these 2 laws recently: turning the car on, receiving a warning that the boot is not properly closed, put the car in neutral + parking brake and descended to close once again the boot........without turning the engine off :msncrazy:

Why would it not be necessary to close the car trunk?

Impairied rearview mirror vision, exhaust being sucked back into the car and dizzying the driver, breaking the hinge and other damage to the car if you need to brake hard, are just a few very solid reasons to close it that come to mind immediately.

The German version of the OrdnungsBussenVerordnung speaks of "verlassen des Fahrzeugs". Like the English "leave", "verlassen" has two meanings:
a) exit, and
b) moving (far) away from and thereby losing control
I would think b) is meant WRT to the fine, otherwise it would be fineable to exit the car in order to open the garage door so you can drive it in. The hand brake alone kind of keeps the car under control in the sense that it won't drive off on its own, probably not even if a child happens to sneak in and change gear.

Urs Max 29.05.2020 13:13

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by lost_inbroad (Post 3185996)
Yeah, OP forgot, that's all. But that's neither here nor there. I don't know the "idling" laws off the top of my head. But IMO, that doesn't constitute an idling violation and even if it does, that's in the range of a parking ticket and who hasn't gotten those before. Preventing somebody's personal movement by intimidation is a whole different story.

She's obviously trying to pretty-paint her own actions. Remember, we only hear one side of the story. She's clearly a petty and vindictive person trying to get revenge without giving the shop owner a chance to show his version of events.

I wouldn't be surprised if hearing the other side would turn the entire thing completely upside down.

Axa 29.05.2020 13:19

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Urs Max (Post 3186187)
Why would it not be necessary to close the car trunk?

Impairied rearview mirror vision, exhaust being sucked back into the car and dizzying the driver, breaking the hinge and other damage to the car if you need to brake hard, are just a few very solid reasons to close it that come to mind immediately.

The German version of the OrdnungsBussenVerordnung speaks of "verlassen des Fahrzeugs". Like the English "leave", "verlassen" has two meanings:
a) exit, and
b) moving (far) away from and thereby losing control
I would think b) is meant WRT to the fine, otherwise it would be fineable to exit the car in order to open the garage door so you can drive it in. The hand brake alone kind of keeps the car under control in the sense that it won't drive off on its own, probably not even if a child happens to sneak in and change gear.

Well, the law says nothing about neutral/parking and parking brake. I also consider the parking brake is enough in a flat place.....but the law says engine off :(

Anyway, you need to be doing this in front of the police or cause an accident to get this law enforced.

k_and_e 29.05.2020 13:25

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Axa (Post 3186199)
Well, the law says nothing about neutral/parking and parking brake. I also consider the parking brake is enough in a flat place.....but the law says engine off :(

Anyway, you need to be doing this in front of the police or cause an accident to get this law enforced.


I think that parking is always with the engine off. With a running engine you are stopping.

Guest 29.05.2020 13:34

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by k_and_e (Post 3186201)
I think that parking is always with the engine off. With a running engine you are stopping.

It is the amount of time you stand still that dictates if you are parking or stopping.

NotAllThere 29.05.2020 14:40

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Here's what happened from the shop-owner's perspective. (Or so I imagine).

I was minding my shop, when a car parked in the metred zone in front. A woman got out and headed to the metre, but she'd left the motor running in her car. I went over her as she fiddled for change, and said to her "Excuse me madam, you've left your engine running, it's not a good idea to do that". She glared at me, then, having realised she didn't have the right coins, went back to her car and switched the engine off. I went back into my shop.

She came in a few seconds later and demanded that I give her the right change for the meter. Given her attitude I didn't feel like be helpful and refused. A few minutes later my mate Dave came in and persuade me to give her the change, so I relented. She then posted a bat-poo crazy "review" on thebusinessreviewsite.ch.

There's some weird people out there.


:rolleyes:

Urs Max 29.05.2020 15:35

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by k_and_e (Post 3186201)
I think that parking is always with the engine off. With a running engine you are stopping.

Quote:

It is the amount of time you stand still that dictates if you are parking or stopping.
This is covered by Art. 21 VRV. And, WRT leaving the motor running, Art. 22 paragraph 1 VRV

The relevant criteria is the reason why, which must be on/offboarding of people and/or on/offloading of goods ("Ein- und Aussteigen, Güterumschlag"). The latter may include preparation and post processing, respectively, according to the ruling below.

Where a running motor isn't necessary it must be off. Duration, while not entirely irrelevant, is secondary and not per se limited (subject to circumstances of course, on/offloading people shouldn't take longer than a few minutes, if even that). Consequentially, people must be close-ish by and the driver available at very short notice, and be able to remove the obstacle (aka car, truck, etc) quickly if it hinders others unduly.

Ten years ago the Federal Court ruled that using a blue zone parking field for longer than the allowed two hours can be legal. Using the blue zone fields was declared commendable as it reduced the negative impact on everybody else as much as possible, especially on the other's safety. When doing so you must follow standard regulations (use the park time disc on blue fields, feed the meter on white fields, etc).

The courts didn't check/rule on whether the duration was justified (it looks to me like the husband took the wife's goods to the car all alone, fetching the boxes from a 4th or 5th floor attic, probably without a lift). The Cantonal court had referred to the district court, which was of the opinion that "Güterumschlag" (on-/offloading of goods) doesn't apply to preparatory actions, and thus denied "Güterumschlag" altogether, with the consequence that it assumed that blue zone time limits apply. However, the Federal Court ruled that "Güterumschlag" does indeed include preparations, and agreed that depositing the boxes somewhere near the entry, inside or outside of the building, would have been impractical (risk of theft, not enough space, and fire safety), and (based on the accused's unchecked claim that it couldn't have been done quicker) that it was lawful in this case to park the car for longer the blue zone allows.

Troublawesome 29.05.2020 22:13

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Is your name Karen OP?

moggy 30.05.2020 11:52

Re: Ugh...rude shop owners. Don't they need business right now?
 
Quote:

Originally Posted by Troublawesome (Post 3186377)
Is your name Karen OP?


Probably Joyce


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