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Old 10.08.2008, 14:03
rustamalizada
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Acer + InterDiscount = No Respect & No Consumer Rights! Help, please!

hi,

Here's a small problem that I've encountered. My landlady brought an ACER PC about a year ago from InterDiscount and after some time the PC began freezing. So, since she had her service guarantee prolonged for another year, we took the PC directly to Zurich (from Geneva), where the ACER's Service office is located. The EURO 2008 was just to begin, we've been promised that we'd get our PC in less than 2 weeks, since there was no work to do for them.
We'll we received our PC only after 5 weeks, somewhere on July 10.

Few things need to be mentioned:
First, the officials at the ACER Service were very disrespectful with us, they didn't reply to our emails, they sent us the communication in God knows how many languages, they changed their minds as often as the winds changes its direction, they didn't respond to our calls (though they responded if we called from another phone number), they lied many times that they have begun solving the problem, but each time they were telling us otherwise, etc. Finally, they sent our PC to another address and put all the blame on DHL (while DHL had not done anything wrong!) for this and the very long-awaited result was that > they didn't do anything, they simply restored the operating system, but didn't resolve the problem. Ahh, the something to add > it was us who were trying to explain them what is the problem, since they either didn't want to do their job or they they simply didn't have any idea about computers (I am sure that all their technicians need to reed "PC for Dummies: The Basics"!!!). On top of all, they were trying to make us pay 160CHF for nothing (as I told you before, they were changing their mind every time they sent their letter in different languages)

The story goes on! So we received the PC after 5 weeks, no change, the same problem persists.
Ok, now we took it directly to the InterDiscount so that it’s them who have to solve the problem. We received our PC yesterday. This time they didn’t change the operating system (originally the PC came with Wind XP, later I put Wind Vista), but they did something with the PC, since I found out that they restored a partition (PQSERVICE) which comes with all ACER products (it’s a partition for the restoration of the PC). Ahh, I also forgot to tell you, the first time we got no report of the problem! But this time they decided to enclose a report in German (though we asked them before to communicate either in French or English, but not in other languages!!!!) which contained one phrase in English > “No problem found
Ok, now, we are completely tired of all this disrespect and “service”, if one may still call it a service!!! We lost all summer waiting for our PC, it’s too much I think! Now, I am trying to help my landlady to find another solution for her problem (she’s old and very lazy person, so basically it was me who urged her to do all these things).
Anyway, my question after this too long info is what are the rights of consumers in Switzerland (particularly in Geneva)???
Secondly, do they have a “consumer’s union” or any kind of an organization that might deal with this problem? Actually, we are already thinking of returning the PC, if it’s possible. We just want our money back!
Sorry for this long letter! I am asking you for any advice or recommendation!
THANKS!
R.
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Old 10.08.2008, 14:12
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

what is the warranty for the laptop? If you had next day on-site warranty, you can complain. If you have return to base then this can take time.

If the warranty ran out then they can rightfully charge you just to look at the PC.

What they probably did was run diagnostics and the machine passed. They are also very likely to restore it to factory defaults for you - your data is your problem in this type of situation.

Email is not the best way to communicate and it seems they let you down on the phone.

She's had a year of use of the laptop so a refund is out of the question.

So did they say if anything was wrong with the laptop?
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Old 10.08.2008, 15:01
rustamalizada
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

Thanks for the reply!

We still have the warranty and we took it both to ACER Service Point in Zurich and InterDiscount here in Geneva on the basis of that warranty.

Yes, you are right. They simply ran diagnostics and restored the PC to its defaults (i.e. to old Wind Xp as it was bought).

But why do you say that the refund is out of question? What deprives us of this right? After finding a similar problem here, I found out that it is still possible to return it and get your money back, though I know it will be VERY VERY difficult!

NO, they didn't enclose any report! In the last report it was written that they checked CD/DVD Drive, HDD, CPU, etc. and in the end "No Problem Found". That's all, nothign else!

The matter is that I am very sure that they didn't check it appropriately. I've read a lot on the web and the only explanation for the problem is that something is wrong with the hardware. It could be everything, RAM, CPU, Mother Board, Fan, HDD, everything. So they need to check the PC very profoundly, which they don't do.

The problem persists no matter what I put > both with XP and Vista. I used the same installation CDs of Vista and XP on many other PCs and laptops and they run perfectly, without any crashes! It once again tell me that the problem is not with the software, but with the hardware!

R.
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Old 10.08.2008, 18:18
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

You bought the PC from InterDiscount. Why did you bypass the vendor? InterDisc should have helped you.
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Old 10.08.2008, 18:34
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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hi,
do they have a “consumer’s union” or any kind of an organization that might deal with this problem?
The Fédération Romande des Consommateurs has a (paying) hotline

http://www.frc.ch/
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Old 10.08.2008, 19:08
rustamalizada
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

Well, my landlady had a problem with her PC once and she did it through InterDiscount. She told me this way it's taking too much time until you get your PC, because you have to wait until InterDiscount sends it to the ACER Service Point. Moreover, she asked there if she can do so and she's been told that she can "bypass" InterDiscount and take her PC directly to the ACER. This is what she did the first time. The second time we did it through InterDiscount, but we appropriately informed them of the problem and asked them to deliver it ASAP. ACER once again didn't repair the PC.
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Old 10.08.2008, 19:20
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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The matter is that I am very sure that they didn't check it appropriately. I've read a lot on the web and the only explanation for the problem is that something is wrong with the hardware. It could be everything, RAM, CPU, Mother Board, Fan, HDD, everything. So they need to check the PC very profoundly, which they don't do.
I frankly doubt a PC will freeze because of the internal cooling fan.
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Old 10.08.2008, 19:25
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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The problem persists no matter what I put > both with XP and Vista. I used the same installation CDs of Vista and XP on many other PCs and laptops and they run perfectly, without any crashes! It once again tell me that the problem is not with the software, but with the hardware!
First off you're kind of vague about just what the problem is other than saying the laptop "crashes".

Second putting Vista on a laptop which originally was sold with XP installed is risky because Vista requires a much faster machine than XP did.

Third it could still be the software despite the fact that the same install CD was used on various computers without any problem.

Forth.. intalling Vista (or XP for that matter) from the same CD on multiple machines is a no-no (unless you've purchased multiple licenses) and telling the world about it in a public forum isn't in your best interest..

Fifth: (the most important) This isn't a PC support forum so don't expect to get much more than a shoulder to cry on..

Last edited by vwild1; 10.08.2008 at 19:46. Reason: forgot 5th
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Old 10.08.2008, 19:29
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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I frankly doubt a PC will freeze because of the internal cooling fan.
Unless it has stopped or is attached to a heat sink that is not making proper contact with the CPU.
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Old 10.08.2008, 19:35
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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I frankly doubt a PC will freeze because of the internal cooling fan.
Early Sun UltraSparc workstations had this very problem. Eventually the CPU would burn out.
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Old 10.08.2008, 20:20
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

Shorrick Mk2 - Yes, I also think that the problem is with the cooling fan. But we can't open the console, if we do open it and touch anything inside, then the service guarantee will become useless and meaningless + it's not my PC, it belongs to my landlady and therefore I can't do what I wish and I have to "follow" her decision to take it to the Service Point.

vwild1 - where am i vague? What kind of info do u need? The matter is that usually when a PC crashes or bugs, it memorizes the problem and records it in the "event viewer". But this PC crash leaves no traces! Everything freezes and that's all!

Secondly, Though it came with Wind XP, still it is compatible with Vista. There's a sticky label that says it is ok for Vista + System has minimum configuration for the Vista!!!

Thirdly, the problem with software is exluded. If it is with software, then why did it crashed with the Win XP which was restored by the Service Point itself? + As I told u before, I have my own CD's of XP and Vista and both of them crashe ONLY on this machine!

Fourthly, with respect to licences. I even forgot about it

Fifth, I know it's NOT a PC support forum. All I need is to get any advice on how to proceed, how to solve my problem, because the traditional way of taking it ot the Service Point is not suitable for us anymore!



gooner - yes, I also know that it might be a problem with the CPU. I remember how the grease on heat sink became completely useless and dry on one of my PC's few years ago. Still, I don't have any right to touch this PC, therefore I want the Service Point to do the job! It's what we paid for!


Thanks to all!
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Old 10.08.2008, 22:13
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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I frankly doubt a PC will freeze because of the internal cooling fan.
You'd be very surprised, CPU's have thermal protections that will prevent them from burning.

My GF's old laptop was freezing quite a lot, in order to understand if it was a Windows or Hardware issue, I booted it from a Linux live CD and ran some CPU intensive task. After a while it froze, I then rebooted it and re-ran the same task, it froze again, but in less time.

In the end we found out that the laptop had been used for quite a while and dust had accumulated on the fans. As it was still under waranty we sent it back to Toshiba, they cleaned the fans, and since then, no more freezes.
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Old 10.08.2008, 22:48
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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Shorrick Mk2 - Yes, I also think that the problem is with the cooling fan. But we can't open the console, if we do open it and touch anything inside, then the service guarantee will become useless and meaningless + it's not my PC, it belongs to my landlady and therefore I can't do what I wish and I have to "follow" her decision to take it to the Service Point.
There is freeware available on the Web to monitor the CPU temperature. That will help you confirm or eliminate overheating as the problem. Also prop the notebook on a stand to prevent heat buildup under it.
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Old 10.08.2008, 23:09
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

Hey,

Your not alone. I am writing you from my ACER laptop that I cant tell you how many times Ive had to send it back... I had it for only a few months when somthing went wrong with the power supply. I sent it back and was told I would get it back in two weeks. A month later I called them. They said they never received it.. good thing I had the UPS tracking number which said the exact time and date they received it... Basically they lost my laptop and didnt have any record of it... I kept calling to get them to follow through.. They finialy sent me one back that had the same problem.. it would not turn on after a few weeks and had to send it back again. I finilay got my professor to call them and he told them off about how its poor buisness pratices and such and would see to it that the University never bought anything from them again. They responded by sending me a computer with a spanish operating system and keyboard (I was in Canada at the time). I had to call and tell them they screwed up again.. after a few calls they said "oh I think we sent you the wrong computer" No ****.. So again I had to send it back. I finialy got the right computer back and worked fine after three months. I was writing my thesis at the time, so you can imagine the added stress and being ****ed off about it. I had the screen die within a year of receiving the new computer and had to return it again. This time I got it back in two weeks with all problems solve and no problems since ( a year or two later). I think end of the day I will never buy a ACER anything again and would advise others to do the same.. REALLY POOR costumer service. yea and they were totaly rude to me too... I hear Toshiba is good... NEVER BUY AN ACER!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Old 10.08.2008, 23:34
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

Rustamalizada: sorry to hear such a horror story My experience with Interdiscount customer serivce has always been very good, regarding returns/refunds. But I think 1 year on a PC is probably too long (PC's age in dog years ).

As for tech support, you're probably better off finding a local techie friend to help you out (I know you paid allready 160chf to Acer, but seems all you got in return was more frustration).

When and how often does it freeze? Try maybe installing Linux and see if the problem presists? (You can download Linux free from here: http://www.ubuntu.com/getubuntu/download )
...you can also run it "live" from the CD, meaning you don't have to install it to use it...

Also, here's a Windos application (freeware) that allows you to view your HD temp: http://www.hdtune.com/

PS- I never heard any good things about Acer. HP cost a little more, but is worth it (Fujitsu-Siemens isn't bad either, ..don't know about Toshiba)
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Old 10.08.2008, 23:37
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Re: Acer + InterDiscount = No Respect & No Consumer Rights! Help, please!

To speak the truth my brother told me that there may be some dust on the fan and I just need to clean it. Well, I am ready to do it, but once again, the PC is not mine and I simply don't want to get into any troubles with my landlady simply because I know that afterwards she will say "it was you who broke it!". Anyway, I just want to help her so that ACER & InterDiscount do not fool her every time!!!

With respect to CPU > no, the problem is not with CPU temperature for three reasons:
1 - I was "torturing" that machine by converting videos from one format to another, running lots of programs and the CPU was "crying" of pain, but it never gave up and was working 100% ok!
2 - The crash may happen even when I start the OS. Sometimes I can't even go to the boot menu before the OS starts!! Yesterday, when we just received it, after running less than 10 minutes the PC crashed. Then we rebooted and the PC ran very smoothly for 4-5 hours without any crashes! Then again and again. So, it's definitely not the CPU problem.

The most annoying part of my story is that every time it was our "responsibility" to explain them how to fix the problem! I'm sure that there's nothing serious, simply they are lazy and they don't want to check profoundly the PC by running and testing it few hours, not 5 minutes.

Thank you to everybody who replied to my thread.
Particularly, I would be happy to get any advice on how we should proceed from the point of law, what rights we have and how much can we ask from them.

Thanks again!

R.


P.S. From now on, I will never buy an ACER product and recommend you to do the same!
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Old 10.08.2008, 23:44
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Re: Acer + InterDiscount = No Respect & No Consumer Rights! Help, please!

Dear Esto thanks a lot for your advice!

Yes, today 1 year already means a century for PC's

I would love installing Ubuntu, but my landlady doesn't want it. She mainly uses her PC for games, most of which are Windows compatible, and web-surfing

Yes, HP is good! I have a Fujitsu-Siemens laptop which I bought on December 10, 2006 and it works perfectly. So far I haven't had any problems and I am very happy with it! My brother had a Toshiba, which was nicknames a "military tank" for its durability

R.
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Old 10.08.2008, 23:48
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Re: Acer + InterDiscount = No Respect & No Consumer Rights! Help, please!

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The crash may happen even when I start the OS. Sometimes I can't even go to the boot menu before the OS starts!! Yesterday, when we just received it, after running less than 10 minutes the PC crashed. Then we rebooted and the PC ran very smoothly for 4-5 hours without any crashes! Then again and again.
Sounds like a piece of defective hardware (ie: a bad HD or RAM). Sometimes it's hard to find.

Seatools is good at finding HD problems:
http://www.seagate.com/ww/v/index.js...00f5ee0a0aRCRD

For RAM, look here:
http://oca.microsoft.com/en/windiag.asp

...good luck! (and stay away from those Acers! )
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Old 11.08.2008, 00:02
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Re: ACER + InterDiscount = NO RESPECT & NO CONSUMER RIGHTS!!! Help, please!

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Secondly, Though it came with Wind XP, still it is compatible with Vista. There's a sticky label that says it is ok for Vista + System has minimum configuration for the Vista!!!
One man's "minimum" is another man's lawsuit..

http://blogs.pcworld.com/staffblog/archives/006543.html

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/busine...tml?source=rss

http://arstechnica.com/news.ars/post...its-scope.html

http://www.engadget.com/2008/02/28/m...sell-incompat/

http://media.www.the-telescope.com/m...-2875431.shtml

http://www.switched.com/2008/02/27/c...vista-marketi/
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Old 11.08.2008, 00:12
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Re: Acer + InterDiscount = No Respect & No Consumer Rights! Help, please!

vwild1 thanks for the links. I didn't know that there was such an issue.

Still, the PC crashes both on the originally installed XP and the one that I have. Therefore, not the problem of the software.
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