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Old 15.01.2023, 23:07
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Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

Hi all,

I recently got on a train in the morning on my way to work and shocked that I couldn't even sit.

Now the area where this train stops used to be old factories and there were not so many buildings there. These days whenever I hop on this train in the morning during peak time I feel like am in London or Paris. It's not possible to even onboard sometimes as it is so crowded. . .

Before covid the number of people was reasonable, you could always sit.

Now I understand there are more and more people and the population is growing however the infrastructure system is really not adapted. It is sad how quickly things are changing now, I've been here for years and it does feel more and more overcrowded.

Overall people are more tense and everyone's on edge. So it seems like am getting the worse of both worlds now: cities not as vibrant and interesting as London but more and more of the stress I would get in a bigger city due to an increasingly stressful commute.

Folks living in cities or suburbs, do you have the same impression? How do you think Switzerland will cope with more and more people? And do you think there will be more and more civil unrest?
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  #2  
Old 16.01.2023, 00:46
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

Whenever I have to go to the office I avoid any train between 7h00 and 8h00. Colleagues face the same, so no one complains if some arrives 9 or 9h30 to the office.
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  #3  
Old 16.01.2023, 02:37
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Hi all,

I recently got on a train in the morning on my way to work and shocked that I couldn't even sit.

Now the area where this train stops used to be old factories and there were not so many buildings there. These days whenever I hop on this train in the morning during peak time I feel like am in London or Paris. It's not possible to even onboard sometimes as it is so crowded. . .

Before covid the number of people was reasonable, you could always sit.

Now I understand there are more and more people and the population is growing however the infrastructure system is really not adapted. It is sad how quickly things are changing now, I've been here for years and it does feel more and more overcrowded.

Overall people are more tense and everyone's on edge. So it seems like am getting the worse of both worlds now: cities not as vibrant and interesting as London but more and more of the stress I would get in a bigger city due to an increasingly stressful commute.

Folks living in cities or suburbs, do you have the same impression? How do you think Switzerland will cope with more and more people? And do you think there will be more and more civil unrest?
I'm not sure why you do say before covid? You could always sit before covid???
Trains are awfully crowded at peak hours for years and by "years" I mean more than 10 years.
Did the population spectaculously grow after 2020? There should be statistics to support your claims....

First class is the solution.....or owning a car.
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Old 16.01.2023, 07:07
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

I have not noticed it "yet" on the train but I have noticed it in the schools. In our neighborhood in Zurich City, they are having to build these temporary structures and/or send kids to schools more faraway because of lack of space in the local schools.

And now there is about 200 new flats being built, all relatively large so "family flats", in our neighborhood and I seriously wonder how the schools will cope? I am sure someone's job is to look at this but it does not feel like its happening

And I guess once these 200 families move in, we will feel it on the public transport also.
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Old 16.01.2023, 08:28
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

So after all the complaining about too many people coming into the country, get yourselves into action everyone to fix it: vote SVP! This is the party for you - dead against immigration, particularly those nasty poor people who take your tax, and they will keep Switzerland for the pure Swiss only. Fixed!
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Old 16.01.2023, 08:39
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Hi all,

I recently got on a train in the morning on my way to work and shocked that I couldn't even sit.

Now the area where this train stops used to be old factories and there were not so many buildings there. These days whenever I hop on this train in the morning during peak time I feel like am in London or Paris. It's not possible to even onboard sometimes as it is so crowded. . .

Before covid the number of people was reasonable, you could always sit.

Now I understand there are more and more people and the population is growing however the infrastructure system is really not adapted. It is sad how quickly things are changing now, I've been here for years and it does feel more and more overcrowded.

Overall people are more tense and everyone's on edge. So it seems like am getting the worse of both worlds now: cities not as vibrant and interesting as London but more and more of the stress I would get in a bigger city due to an increasingly stressful commute.

Folks living in cities or suburbs, do you have the same impression? How do you think Switzerland will cope with more and more people? And do you think there will be more and more civil unrest?
I don't really agree that a lack of infrastructure investment is to blame. I've lived in many places and travelled to many more and I can't think of a country that has so much investment and planning in infrastructure as Switzerland does.

From large projects like the Gotthard Base Tunnel and Limmattalbahn, to small road improvements and bypasses, there is always something going on in Switzerland. The SBB has any number of projects going on at any one time, timetables are revised etc.

Like anywhere rush hour can be stressful. There's many ways to avoid this though, use a car, travel first class, make use of working from home, travel outside of peak hours or if drastic measures are required, return to Paris or London and travel in the morning rush to remind yourself of how good you've got it here!
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Old 16.01.2023, 09:14
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

Confused with your comment "Before covid the number of people was reasonable, you could always sit."

I thought more and more people are working from home since Covid, so shouldn't the number of people be less ... this is certainly apparent when on the rare occasion I go into the the office.

Since arriving here 15 yrs ago, I did observe (pre-covid) that both roads and public transport were busier during peak hour however nothing like what I've experienced in other major cities around the world.

Not sure what things are like since Covid, as on the few occasions I do go into the office, I cycle and with that form of transport I'm always guranteed a seat!
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Old 16.01.2023, 09:26
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

The could put more carriages on the busier trains*. Even small stations here have very incredibly long platforms.

* They do that already to some extent.
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Old 16.01.2023, 10:15
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

Today in the 20 Mins there was an article warning about population decline.. so which is it?!


https://www.20min.ch/fr/story/la-pop...s-615702344815
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Old 16.01.2023, 10:17
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Today in the 20 Mins there was an article warning about population decline.. so which is it?!
Fewer people but they are getting bigger?
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Old 16.01.2023, 10:39
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Confused with your comment "Before covid the number of people was reasonable, you could always sit."

I thought more and more people are working from home since Covid, so shouldn't the number of people be less ... this is certainly apparent when on the rare occasion I go into the the office.
All of the tourists are coming back ... if you are on a train that connects to a major airport, you have to deal with them and it can be super annoying.

But the trains have always been crowded and were much worse than now right before the pandemic. I sometimes could not even find a seat in first class ...
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Old 16.01.2023, 11:40
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Whenever I have to go to the office I avoid any train between 7h00 and 8h00. Colleagues face the same, so no one complains if some arrives 9 or 9h30 to the office.
Well yes, this is possible for some jobs - but not for others! There are still people who don't work in offices, and do have very clear and specific working hours they have to adhere to.

From my house to Lausanne is 55 mins- but at peak frontalier time, more likely to be 1.15 or even 1.30. Those with flexible hours will of course arrange their working hours to avoid peak frontaliers time- others have ... to put up with it. Now if only more agreed to car-share!!!
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Old 16.01.2023, 11:52
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Those with flexible hours will of course arrange their working hours to avoid peak frontaliers time- others have ... to put up with it. Now if only more agreed to car-share!!!
That is desirable but I don't know many people who would do that...it's actually a tad strange to see these ever bigger and stronger cars with only one person inside - the driver. We're a very wasteful species...
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Old 16.01.2023, 12:07
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Now if only more agreed to car-share!!!
You can't car share if you don't travel the same route/time/etc.

Tom
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Old 16.01.2023, 12:17
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

Be glad you don’t live in the UK if you think Swiss trains are bad
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Old 16.01.2023, 12:23
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

Love it: immigrant complains the country’s too full…
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Old 16.01.2023, 12:23
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Well yes, this is possible for some jobs - but not for others! There are still people who don't work in offices, and do have very clear and specific working hours they have to adhere to.

From my house to Lausanne is 55 mins- but at peak frontalier time, more likely to be 1.15 or even 1.30. Those with flexible hours will of course arrange their working hours to avoid peak frontaliers time- others have ... to put up with it. Now if only more agreed to car-share!!!
I get it, your alternative is cooler

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Today in the 20 Mins there was an article warning about population decline.. so which is it?!
It reads a bit like Chicken Little crying that the sky is falling. However, regardless of narratives, the hazard is there.

Quote:
Real estate sitting “on a powder keg”

Another tipping point is being reached, according to Hendrik Budliger: that of real estate. Prices are expected to fall from 2025, he predicts. “Most landlords are older and housing needs are changing. As a result, many properties will come on the market, but the demand for housing suitable for families will decrease”. And the demographer goes even further. “We are sitting on a powder keg,” he asserts bluntly. According to him, the situation is comparable to the real estate crash of the 1990s, the cause of which was, in addition to the sharp rise in interest rates, the negative net migration from Switzerland.

Last edited by Axa; 16.01.2023 at 13:15. Reason: read the article shared by starmir
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Old 16.01.2023, 13:16
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Hi all,

I recently got on a train in the morning on my way to work and shocked that I couldn't even sit.

I am happy for you. Really. If this is the type of "shocks" in your life, smile, enjoy and move on.
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Old 16.01.2023, 14:10
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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Hi all,

I recently got on a train in the morning on my way to work and shocked that I couldn't even sit.

It is quite clear that the entire rail network cannot be dimensioned for optimal comfort during the peak times.
But, feel free to complain to the SBB about your experience: https://www.sbb.ch/en/help-and-conta...-comments.html . Actually, I'd be interested to hear how they react.
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Old 16.01.2023, 14:29
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Re: Growing population and infrastructure not made for this scale

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But, feel free to complain to the SBB about your experience: https://www.sbb.ch/en/help-and-conta...-comments.html . Actually, I'd be interested to hear how they react.
LOL - they don't care at all. Been there, done that and yet they still reduced number of trains leaving per hour while increasing prices.
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