This is totally true--there is a major disconnect in Zurich. Most of my friends work in areas which have nothing to do with finance; I wouldn't say any of them have trouble making ends meet, but there is definitely a lot of frustration over the salaries paid particularly by the big two banks.

I agree that 30 000 per month is pretty low but it must be able to live on it

Hope you're earning more than 70,000 CHF.

That's what you get for working with macs. What's wrong with calling it a motherboard!

Who's "we", paleface?

It's curious to me when those on big salaries are stingy with their hefty disposable income when it comes to getting a round in, especially when those on lesser income are usually quite forthcoming. Funny, that.

Ah but there's them that do and them that don't and they all know who they are.

When I first came here I was earning 3200 net and living on the Gold Coast and single and it felt fine.

You could tick all the boxes, that would confuse them

<ducks>

Does this thread mean we are going to get lots of threads with cleverly written stories complaining but adding humour to the more hated sides of moving?

Tighter than a badgers arsehole some people. Usually drive Volvo's and go Dutch on every bill, even if it means splitting 10 rappen.

Lets say their circles of friends has got to be pretty small.

I do okay and wouldn't dream of not handing out double vodka's and jager's when the need arises...

Or just tick the ones that add up together.

60,000 to 70,000 plus 40,000 to 50,000 = 100,000 to 120,000. Ta da.

Because someone with a lower income who can't afford somewhere more expensive might also have applied for the place?
So far, all the EFers I've met have been very generous. However, I feel bad having drinks bought for me because I can't afford to get in whole rounds... But I mostly drink water anyway, health reasons.

there, there. scrambled will buy you plenty of drinks.

Well as a pure measure it's a bad idea, I have to cover property costs in the UK too and various other crap, even though I can like a lot of expats tick the last box.

So it takes no consideration of "disposable income"

I'll buy you a drink (I think I must have done with the amounts of shots I've bought in the past) and I couldn't care less what comes back it's not about the drink coming back it's about enjoying someones company.

It's about the place the time and the beer. You surely remember MikeyB's birthday a few years ago in Zug for example.

Treat people well and when you land in the shite they'll return that beer when you most need it and more besides. Well if you have any faith in human nature

According to the last option, with their sheep?

When I first came here I used my depleted credit card and waited für my first pay check. Luckily advance came like from heaven

Now, I'm living in a castle with walls tiled by 100francs notes and surrounded by moat full of CHF5 coins

Now, excuse me: I must touch paint bootspoiler on my Veyron!

Last I heard, the average family income in Switzerland is around 65'000 Fr. before tax. Go figure.

I don't work in finance (I'm an IT guy, working for a public institution), so I'm not making anywhere near 120k, either, but together with my wife (who is a Gymansium teacher and paid rather handsomely), I really can't complain. However, having studied here and lived on 17-20 grand for my first 5 years away from home, I know it's tough but it's doable. Of course, that was 10 years ago and prices have gone up considerably since then. I'd say for a family, around 50 thousand would be the absolute minimum to have a semi-decent life here.

We should all keep in mind that many (if not most) of us here not only make a bit more than the average Swiss, we make a crapload more. Next time we interact with unfriendly clerks at the railway station, with stressed-out Migros cashiers etc., let's keep that in mind. Also, perhaps this is a good starting point to think about our boasting habits (cars (can I live with a BMW or does it have to be a Lincoln Navigator?), boats, 10 grand vacation to the caribbean, asking "can I possibly survive on a 110'000 Fr. starting salary here or am I being cheated" etc. Doesn't mean we shouldn't enjoy our standard of living, but perhaps we can keep it private)

Peter

Absolutely - a bit of sensitive discretion wouldn't go amiss sometimes.
Yet again, there is a huge regional element re how far money will stretch -
Zurich, Geneva, Montreux for instance are VERY expensive- others are cheaper, and some are much cheaper. Here in the Jura you could live like a King on that and own a very nice house indeed.

I am not too happy about the fact that it is damn hard to actually find 2nd or 3rd jobs. Wish those were possible. To make them impossible puts some people in poverty.

This is it, thanks runningdeer. You nailed it.

While locals might have lower income, they might have better living status and save more, since they have the entire infrastructure (and it is not only families on hand, circle of friends who chip in and trade favors, but also institutions who do give preferential treatments in terms of places in schools, daycare and nannies) available. I am not saying it is always like that, mostly isn't, but sometimes it is. If we had a family to help with child care or other things (most local friends I have don't pay rent since they live at parents former house or a place their parents bought for them or put the down payment on for them) we would roughly save 5000fr a month, which makes good 60 000fr a year.

Trailing spouses have their working opportunities way more limited, even if they are happy to have found something little, I don't know many who pull off 100% employment for decent cash. Even the jobs that one does pull off as a foreigner, is often underpaid, at some fields. I have met expats who were outsourced and came here thinking they will be macking just to realize they are shortchanged since this place is evily overpriced. I have met institutions, schools, afterschool programs, even private nannies who ripped off newcoming expats and laughed their way to the bank.

So, I don't really buy the whole local vs expat whining thing. Of course there are bastids who will rub in their big cash, but in my experience they were both local and expat.

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What do you mean? They want you to integrate badly. DB is integrating badly already!