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  #141  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:22
hoppy
 
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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Switzerland doesn't have juries.
OMG! Now I understand!

Amogles-in that area there were always syringes on the ground. There were shells, there were police and kids picking up the shells. The kids weren't sent out to pick up the shells, they just were excited and wanted to help, the police didn't tell them not to do it.

I'm not being patronising about waving the Swiss passport- ti's true. Swiss name, Swiss blood, Swiss passport- now tell me I am imagining the fact that I am treated differently, between when people think I am an ignorant foreigner and when they realize I am Swiss.

I was ignorant about there being no jury though- that's quite a shock!

Are judges elected- if so by whom?
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  #142  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:32
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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OMG! Now I understand!

Amogles-in that area there were always syringes on the ground. There were shells, there were police and kids picking up the shells. The kids weren't sent out to pick up the shells, they just were excited and wanted to help, the police didn't tell them not to do it.

I'm not being patronising about waving the Swiss passport- ti's true. Swiss name, Swiss blood, Swiss passport- now tell me I am imagining the fact that I am treated differently, between when people think I am an ignorant foreigner and when they realize I am Swiss.

I was ignorant about there being no jury though- that's quite a shock!

Are judges elected- if so by whom?
You're a Swiss citizen and don't know zilch about your own judicial system ?
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  #143  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:45
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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That's nothing to do with stalking being illegal or not. That's whether or not the facts can be proven in a court of law, and ultimatley whether or not alleged victims of certain crimes should be believed prima facie. That's a rather dangerous idea, which has in the recent past been applied to allegation of sexual abuse of children - and which has lead to miscarriages of justice in the US, France, the UK and Germany.
I would say that far more child abuse cases are dismissed or never brought to court for lack of evidence.


As far as circumstantial evidence goes- that can be ruled in different ways. In the US OJ got off in the criminal court because of lack of evidence yet found guilty in the civil court - the same is true of the recent Casey Anthony dismissed through lack of evidence whereas Scot Peterson was found guilty of killing his wife.
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  #144  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:49
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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I would say that far more child abuse cases are dismissed or never brought to court for lack of evidence.

As far as circumstantial evidence goes- that can be ruled in different ways. In the US OJ got off in the criminal court because of lack of evidence yet found guilty in the civil court - the same is true of the recent Casey Anthony dismissed through lack of evidence whereas Scot Peterson was found guilty of killing his wife.
So, either their jury of peers were right or even a trial by jury is not a perfect system.
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  #145  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:53
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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I would say that far more child abuse cases are dismissed or never brought to court for lack of evidence.
That is the real evil brought about by hysteria - the firm belief that "there" is a huge amount of undetected crimes that are never brought to justice because of "the system". Result: paranoia.
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  #146  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:57
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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So, either their jury of peers were right or even a trial by jury is not a perfect system.
Both systems have their pros and contras.

On the whole, the more complex the situation legally, the more difficult it is for a jury with no formal legal training to follow the intricacies. Of course the defence exploit that shemlessly by bringing lots of unnecessary stuff into the case to confuse them. A trained and experienced judge is more likely to see through those tricks and ignore tham. Though on the other hand if the judge him/herself has a secret bias, it's difficult to expect a fair ruling.
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  #147  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:57
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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That is the real evil brought about by hysteria - the firm belief that "there" is a huge amount of undetected crimes that are never brought to justice because of "the system". Result: paranoia.
it's called conspiracy.
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  #148  
Old 26.07.2011, 16:59
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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So, either their jury of peers were right or even a trial by jury is not a perfect system.
No but I still prefer it and there are many ways to appeal. In the US you are taught about the judicial system at school, I bet that the average US kid knows far more about the judicial system than the average Swiss kid; they are far more aware of their rights.

See I am Swiss and pretty ignorant about the Swiss system and I thought I was informed!

So who elects the judges? Got to go I'm late!
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  #149  
Old 26.07.2011, 17:00
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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You're a Swiss citizen and don't know zilch about your own judicial system ?
Hoppy knows a lot about Rolls Royce jet engines however.
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  #150  
Old 26.07.2011, 17:04
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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No but I still prefer it and there are many ways to appeal. In the US you are taught about the judicial system at school, I bet that the average US kid knows far more about the judicial system than the average Swiss kid; they are far more aware of their rights.
The kids I know do learn that stuff at school. Quite a lot of it actually.

And because Switzerland is a participative democracy, people on average understand the workings of the political system on all levels from the Gemeinde up to the Bundesrat quite well. Probably better (on average) than in any other country I know.

I thought you were a teacher? Aren't you?

Who elects the judges depends on the court in question. They are normally elected/appointed by political representatives for the relevant level of government.
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  #151  
Old 26.07.2011, 17:08
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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Neither coercion, threats and defamation has anything to do with stalking...it may be hard for you to understand as you're probably from a place where lawlessness prevails, however most people would agree with my point of view. Hence, there is no law against stalking in Switzerland.
Let me guess - you're probably from a place where lack of French (or German) knowledge prevails, hence a terrible misunderstanding of the French word "harcelement" and its German counterpart "Nachstellungen".

Further, you're probably from a place where lack of connection to common sense prevails - it would seem most of the legal establishment in Switzerland doesn't agree with you so far.

Wanna try being funny Mr LiB - try harder. Ad Hominems are soooo below your witty reputation.
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  #152  
Old 26.07.2011, 17:15
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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, I bet that the average US kid knows far more about the judicial system than the average Swiss kid; they are far more aware of their rights.
Aware? JC is aware too.

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  #153  
Old 26.07.2011, 17:23
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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it's called conspiracy.
Conspiracy to cause paranoia, or conspiracy to cover up cases of child abuse?

The belief in a huge conspiracy covering up child abuse has appeared before. Wikipedia reference-linkSatanic ritual abuse
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  #154  
Old 26.07.2011, 17:26
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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Conspiracy to cause paranoia, or conspiracy to cover up cases of child abuse?

The belief in a huge conspiracy covering up child abuse has appeared before. Wikipedia reference-linkSatanic ritual abuse
that article was way too long to read but for this once I'll admit you might possibly be right
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  #155  
Old 26.07.2011, 19:35
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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Yes, I see you've integrated quite well..



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The unwanted, obsessive attention by an individual or a group of people.
So, like big brother in the UK government or their tax office?
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  #156  
Old 26.07.2011, 19:54
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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Let me guess - you're probably from a place where lack of French (or German) knowledge prevails, hence a terrible misunderstanding of the French word "harcelement" and its German counterpart "Nachstellungen".

Further, you're probably from a place where lack of connection to common sense prevails - it would seem most of the legal establishment in Switzerland doesn't agree with you so far.

Wanna try being funny Mr LiB - try harder. Ad Hominems are soooo below your witty reputation.
...well, you`re wrong sweetheart. However, why is it so hard for you to admit that there is no stalking law in Switzerland? And why are you so hardpressed on defending this country from ever negative post I make about it?


ps: Sorry for the Ad Hominem attack...I didn't mean it like that.

Last edited by lost_inbroad; 26.07.2011 at 20:47. Reason: apologizing for being unnecessarily rude
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  #157  
Old 26.07.2011, 19:57
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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And why are you so hardpressed on defending this country from ever negative post I make about it?
Somebody has to be the devil's advocate?
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  #158  
Old 26.07.2011, 20:13
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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I was kidding
We are going to be touring Austria, the nothern tip of italy(passing through driving) and switzerland. On way back we will be driving the Autobahn in germany.
Its good to hear that crime is very very low in the countryside.
Every time get off the Autobahn in Austria I think I hear banjo music off in the distance.
Just kidding. I love the hinterlands of Austria.

The key is to act like you belong and don't give or take offense. This usually keeps one from becoming a victim. Failing that all countries have crime and to claim there is none here but there is lots in (insert country of choice) is to be a victim where ever you go.

Oh and for the more paranoid of you don't forget that if you are driving your car is a very dangerous weapon.

And another thing regarding the OP. It has just occurred to me that racous drunken people, whilst very annoying, aren't actually assaulting you or mugging you or stealing your valuables. It may just seem like it at the time.
Unless you die from lack of sleep, you'll get over it.
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  #159  
Old 26.07.2011, 20:14
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

And now over to Ollie Williams for the blackie comparison report.

It's different!


Thanks Ollie.
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Old 26.07.2011, 20:28
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Re: How is the crime rate in the Switzerland compare to England?

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Straight from Article 28b on the federal website - English is not an official language of the Swiss Confederation. This translation is provided for information purposes only and has no legal force.Art. 28b1

b. Violence, threats or harassment
1 To obtain protection from violence, threats or harassment the applicant may request the court in particular to order the offending party to refrain from:
1.approaching the applicant or from entering a defined area around the applicant’s dwelling;2.frequenting specified locations, notably particular streets, squares or districts;3.from making contact with the applicant, especially by telephone, in writing or electronically, or from harassing the applicant in any other way. 2 If the applicant lives in the same dwelling as the offending party, the applicant may ask the court to order the offending party to leave the dwelling for a specified period. This period may be extended on one occasion for good cause.
END OF QUOTE (there's more, but no point to post it all...)
Based on this it should be possible to get an injunction against e dry "typically Swiss" neighbor that harasses you such as in this post.
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