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Old 04.08.2011, 15:22
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Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

Ive already mentioned it once but would somebody please explain to me why the Swiss Petrol Stations have left the petrol price unchanged?
There is no oil in Switzerland so the oil and products are imported. The currency has strengthened easily by 30pct meaning that now the once one way traffic of French motorists filling up in CH has been replaced by a queue going the other way to fill up there.
Its a disgrace and somebody should be doing something about it. Who works for the consumers association?
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:31
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Re: The new Swiss Mafia

ello Grumpy. I know it's a "disgrace" and when I don't understand something I always blame the mafia

Gasoline/petroleum spirit is but one fraction of crude oil. The price at the pump is composed of the costs to extract, refine and transport the product, tax it (both as a retail or value added tax as well as transport tax, especially eg Ukraine pipeline tax (mainly natural gas) and Suez canal tax). We're also looking at supply and demand differentials between petroleum spirit and crude oil as well as varying instability premiums imposed on the market in different regions (eg. pirates in the Strait of Hormuz) and politico-economic choke points affecting different Crude Oil sources and types (some with more petroleum spirit some with less).

Bascially it's (a tiny little bit) like saying the price of crude oil has dropped so my CD should be cheaper because CDs are made of plastic. There are loads of factors affecting the price of petrol at the pump.
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:34
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Re: The new Swiss Mafia

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ello Grumpy. I know it's a "disgrace" and when I don't understand something I always blame the mafia

Gasoline/petroleum spirit is but one fraction of crude oil. The price at the pump is composed of the costs to extract, refine and transport the product, tax it (both as a retail or value added tax as well as transport tax, especially eg Ukraine pipeline tax (mainly natural gas) and Suez canal tax). We're also looking at supply and demand differentials between petroleum spirit and crude oil as well as varying instability premiums imposed on the market in different regions (eg. pirates in the Strait of Hormuz) and politico-economic choke points affecting different Crude Oil sources and types (some with more petroleum spirit some with less).

Bascially it's (a tiny little bit) like saying the price of crude oil has dropped so my CD should be cheaper because CDs are made of plastic. There are loads of factors affecting the price of petrol at the pump.
Well I know that. But if the prices havent changed at a gas station 20 metres from the swiss border and the CHF has strengthened by 30 pct, then surely the price in CHUFFS should have decreased by 30 pct. Otherwise they have increased taxes on the product. I prefer to think its the gas companies (mafia) price gouging!
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:36
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Re: why haven't Swiss petrol stations dropped their prices with drops in crude prices

because it is more profitable not to.
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:38
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Re: why haven't Swiss petrol stations dropped their prices with drops in crude prices

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Well I know that. But if the prices havent changed at a gas station 20 metres from the swiss border and the CHF has strengthened by 30 pct, then surely the price in CHUFFS should have decreased by 30 pct. Otherwise they have increased taxes on the product. I prefer to think its the gas companies (mafia) price gouging!
It is too. But as "Phil" says, it's more profitable not to. They may be making up for the fact that taxes and capital costs are higher here.
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:40
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Re: why haven't Swiss petrol stations dropped their prices with drops in crude prices

On one litre of petrol about 70 rappen is tax. That leaves about Fr 1,-- for the fuel, which should have dropped by 30 rappen.

You all laughed when I asked for a boycott, you said it couldn't be done, you said market forces decided prices not the consumer. So we will just have to wait won't we until the oil companies have made enough profit.
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:42
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Re: why haven't Swiss petrol stations dropped their prices with drops in crude prices

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It is too. But as "Phil" says, it's more profitable not to. They may be making up for the fact that taxes and capital costs are higher here.
Yeah well with BP and Shell recently declaring quaterly profits of about
5 or 6 billion usd I dont think theyre suffering from the costs really. But then Im just a grump!
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:42
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Re: why haven't Swiss petrol stations dropped their prices with drops in crude prices

I refer the honourable gentleman to a point hitherto raised by said honourable gentleman in reference to the genitalia-ascribed crania of the natives, as a possible indication towards the root cause of the problem he has identified.
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Old 04.08.2011, 15:43
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Re: why haven't Swiss petrol stations dropped their prices with drops in crude prices

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On one litre of petrol about 70 rappen is tax. That leaves about Fr 1,-- for the fuel, which should have dropped by 30 rappen.

You all laughed when I asked for a boycott, you said it couldn't be done, you said market forces decided prices not the consumer. So we will just have to wait won't we until the oil companies have made enough profit.
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  #10  
Old 08.09.2011, 12:29
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Re: Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/The...978605645.html

When it comes to petrol, you'll struggle to find many other countries with higher prices than Britain. In fact, to be precise if you did look, you'd find two.

Yes, according to stats from Car Insurer Staveley Head, the UK has the third priciest pump rates in the world, with an average price of 135p per litre. Norway's capital, Oslo, tops the rankings with an average price of 164p per litre.

But which countries have the lowest prices? Here are the top ten cheapest places to buy petrol in the world...

[See also: Will we ever have 1-a-litre petrol again?]

10. Algeria: Algiers 20p per litre

Algeria is one of the Africa's biggest oil producers turning out an average of 1.2 million barrels a day. This flood of oil has pushed down petrol prices in the country to 20p per litre, more than six times cheaper than the average pump price here in the UK.

The country's petrol supplies also played a vital role in the recent battle against Colonel Gaddafi in neighbouring Libya. With petrol production in the war-torn country running dry, rebel fighters relied on smuggled fuel from Algeria to power the final push against the corrupt dictator. Hurrah!

9. Oman: Muscat 20p per litre

Oman's petrol prices also stand at just 20p per litre. Like Algeria, the Arabic state is drenched in oil, stepping up production in the last six months to 878,000 barrels every day.

8. Egypt: Cairo 19p per litre

Egypt is something of a transport hub when it comes to petrol. The Suez Canal a vital supply line running across the east of the country carries an estimated one million barrels of oil from the Persian Gulf every day.

That's why at the peak of the country's revolution against former President Hosni Mubarak, oil prices began to climb, amid fears that the unrest would interfere with the Suez supply route.

But while this oil price rise pushes up petrol costs here in the UK, the rate petrol is sold at the pump over in Egypt remains relatively low, at just 19p per litre. But with the country's government still anything but stable, it's anyone guess as to how long costs will stay this cheap.

[See also: UK supermarkets cut petrol prices]

7. Qatar: Doha 15p per litre

Prior to the discovery of oil in Qatar, the small Arab emirates' economy was mainly built on fishing and pearl hunting. Now the country's national petroleum supplier accounts for 70% of the government's revenue. Recent high oil prices have made per capita income in Qatar amongst the highest across the globe while petrol prices are the seventh lowest at just 15p per litre.

6. Kuwait: Kuwait City 14p per litre

Kuwait is tenth largest oil producer in the world and its supply is thought to account for 10% of global reserves. But nevertheless, the government subsidises both public transport and petrol bringing prices down to just 14p per litre.

5. Bahrain: Manama 13p per litre

Compared with its Middle-Eastern neighbours, Bahrain has fairly limited oil supplies. However 60% of the country's economy is still rooted in petroleum refining, which has grown strongly over the last ten years. The country is at fifth in the rankings with an average petrol price of just 13p per litre.

4. Turkmenistan: Ashgabat 12p per litre

The UK government taxes petrol to the high-heaven, while in Turkmenistan they give it away literally. Every driver in the Turkic state is entitled to 120 litres of petrol for free every month. If they exceed this, the pump price is only 12p per litre.

3. Libya: Tripoli 9p per litre

As I mentioned earlier, petrol supplies in Libya have dried up recently owing to the closure of several oil plants in the midst of unrest in the country. But when pumping at its prime level, the country is the ninth largest oil producer with an average petrol price of just 9p per litre.

2. Saudi Arabia: Riyadh 8p per litre

Saudi Arabia is the largest exporter of petroleum in the world. Domestically fuel prices sit at around 8p per litre. Yet only half of the population can take advantage of these low rates; as women in Saudi Arabia are banned from driving due to a religious fatwa (Islamic law) imposed by conservative Muslim clerics.

1. Venezuela: Caracas 2/3p per litre

Yes, to get hold of the cheapest petrol in the world, you'll have to travel all the way to the South American country of Venezuela. Petrol is just 2-3p per litre in the socialist republic that's around 54 times cheaper than prices here in the UK. So if you have a 70 litre fuel tank in your car, you could fill it up in Venezuela for around 1.50. While In Britain it would cost you a whopping 95.
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Old 08.09.2011, 12:37
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Re: Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

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Ive already mentioned it once but would somebody please explain to me why the Swiss Petrol Stations have left the petrol price unchanged?
There is no oil in Switzerland so the oil and products are imported. The currency has strengthened easily by 30pct meaning that now the once one way traffic of French motorists filling up in CH has been replaced by a queue going the other way to fill up there.
Its a disgrace and somebody should be doing something about it. Who works for the consumers association?
you have to pay a premium for the swiss quality!
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Old 08.09.2011, 12:42
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Re: Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

On this basis it might be worth hiring a tanker and bringing across a few litres to flog into the UK. Anyone got a tanker??


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http://uk.finance.yahoo.com/news/The...978605645.html

When it comes to petrol, you'll struggle to find many other countries with higher prices than Britain. In fact, to be precise if you did look, you'd find two.

Yes, according to stats from Car Insurer Staveley Head, the UK has the third priciest pump rates in the world, with an average price of 135p per litre. Norway's capital, Oslo, tops the rankings with an average price of 164p per litre.

But which countries have the lowest prices? Here are the top ten cheapest places to buy petrol in the world...

[See also: Will we ever have 1-a-litre petrol again?]

10. Algeria: Algiers 20p per litre

Algeria is one of the Africa's biggest oil producers turning out an average of 1.2 million barrels a day. This flood of oil has pushed down petrol prices in the country to 20p per litre, more than six times cheaper than the average pump price here in the UK.

The country's petrol supplies also played a vital role in the recent battle against Colonel Gaddafi in neighbouring Libya. With petrol production in the war-torn country running dry, rebel fighters relied on smuggled fuel from Algeria to power the final push against the corrupt dictator. Hurrah!

9. Oman: Muscat 20p per litre

Oman's petrol prices also stand at just 20p per litre. Like Algeria, the Arabic state is drenched in oil, stepping up production in the last six months to 878,000 barrels every day.

8. Egypt: Cairo 19p per litre

Egypt is something of a transport hub when it comes to petrol. The Suez Canal a vital supply line running across the east of the country carries an estimated one million barrels of oil from the Persian Gulf every day.

That's why at the peak of the country's revolution against former President Hosni Mubarak, oil prices began to climb, amid fears that the unrest would interfere with the Suez supply route.

But while this oil price rise pushes up petrol costs here in the UK, the rate petrol is sold at the pump over in Egypt remains relatively low, at just 19p per litre. But with the country's government still anything but stable, it's anyone guess as to how long costs will stay this cheap.

[See also: UK supermarkets cut petrol prices]

7. Qatar: Doha 15p per litre

Prior to the discovery of oil in Qatar, the small Arab emirates' economy was mainly built on fishing and pearl hunting. Now the country's national petroleum supplier accounts for 70% of the government's revenue. Recent high oil prices have made per capita income in Qatar amongst the highest across the globe while petrol prices are the seventh lowest at just 15p per litre.

6. Kuwait: Kuwait City 14p per litre

Kuwait is tenth largest oil producer in the world and its supply is thought to account for 10% of global reserves. But nevertheless, the government subsidises both public transport and petrol bringing prices down to just 14p per litre.

5. Bahrain: Manama 13p per litre

Compared with its Middle-Eastern neighbours, Bahrain has fairly limited oil supplies. However 60% of the country's economy is still rooted in petroleum refining, which has grown strongly over the last ten years. The country is at fifth in the rankings with an average petrol price of just 13p per litre.

4. Turkmenistan: Ashgabat 12p per litre

The UK government taxes petrol to the high-heaven, while in Turkmenistan they give it away literally. Every driver in the Turkic state is entitled to 120 litres of petrol for free every month. If they exceed this, the pump price is only 12p per litre.

3. Libya: Tripoli 9p per litre

As I mentioned earlier, petrol supplies in Libya have dried up recently owing to the closure of several oil plants in the midst of unrest in the country. But when pumping at its prime level, the country is the ninth largest oil producer with an average petrol price of just 9p per litre.

2. Saudi Arabia: Riyadh 8p per litre

Saudi Arabia is the largest exporter of petroleum in the world. Domestically fuel prices sit at around 8p per litre. Yet only half of the population can take advantage of these low rates; as women in Saudi Arabia are banned from driving due to a religious fatwa (Islamic law) imposed by conservative Muslim clerics.

1. Venezuela: Caracas 2/3p per litre

Yes, to get hold of the cheapest petrol in the world, you'll have to travel all the way to the South American country of Venezuela. Petrol is just 2-3p per litre in the socialist republic that's around 54 times cheaper than prices here in the UK. So if you have a 70 litre fuel tank in your car, you could fill it up in Venezuela for around 1.50. While In Britain it would cost you a whopping 95.
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Old 08.09.2011, 14:36
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Re: The new Swiss Mafia

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Well I know that. But if the prices havent changed at a gas station 20 metres from the swiss border and the CHF has strengthened by 30 pct, then surely the price in CHUFFS should have decreased by 30 pct. Otherwise they have increased taxes on the product. I prefer to think its the gas companies (mafia) price gouging!
There are no gas stations 20m from the Swiss border, because until the latest rise of the Franc, petrol was usually the one thing that was cheaper in Switzerland. There are plenty of gas stations (with very few customers) just inside the Swiss border coming from Germany though. Some have stopped displaying the price in Euro now...
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Old 13.09.2011, 11:38
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Re: Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

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Ive already mentioned it once but would somebody please explain to me why the Swiss Petrol Stations have left the petrol price unchanged?
There is no oil in Switzerland so the oil and products are imported. The currency has strengthened easily by 30pct meaning that now the once one way traffic of French motorists filling up in CH has been replaced by a queue going the other way to fill up there.
Its a disgrace and somebody should be doing something about it. Who works for the consumers association?
You are right I am afraid to say. I am a tanker broker, basically I charter tanker vessels for the transportation of oil for traders therefore I m involved or at least i pay attention to crude and products prices.Before the 2008 summer crisis, the crude rached its historical maximum price, 150 usd a barrel and gasoline for example in Italy, was a bit lower than now.present crude price is fluctuating from 109 to 114 usd per Barrel....it is the usual story..we are to small to fight against giants.
Incidentally I lived from September 2009 throught April 2011 in Geneva, but due to bad market situation I and about 9 of my colleagues were forced to leave the company we worked for. I am presently working in Italy but Im desperatly looking to find again a job in Switzerland, I miss it terrible. So should you have some infos if a ship owner or a oil trader is looking for a person like me....I will take you out for a gorgeous dinner.I am considered one of the top expert for the Russian market
Thanks Pablo
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Old 13.09.2011, 11:48
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Re: Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

Yeah, in the last week or so, gas is acutally cheaper in France than in CH, don't think that flop has happened in some 10-15 years. So now everyone is doing the reverse.

I understood a lot of refiners use long-term contracts to guarntee supply, so today's barrel price won't be seen by consumers for some time.

Otherwise, perhaps get Kassensturz involved, they are the ones that can stand up to the big guys in the name of the little consumers. www.kassensturz.sf.tv or its sister ktipp.ch
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Old 13.09.2011, 11:54
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Re: Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

I don t think to bring as example the oil producing countries is appropriate to complain against our high gasoline price, as the saving in a year compared to the countries without oil ,is huge.Take a country like France or Italy or Spain importing 50-60 mil tons per year or equivalent to 350 /420 milion barrel per year multiplied by ,say 110 usd per barrel, you have a total of about 40-50 bilion usd per year.Obviously if you have the gasoline price at the gas station os 1.8 chf or 1.7 euros, half of it and even buit more are taxes which the governement cashes in without big efforts.
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Old 13.09.2011, 12:01
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Re: Why are the Gas companies such thieving bastards?

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I don t think to bring as example the oil producing countries is appropriate to complain against our high gasoline price, as the saving in a year compared to the countries without oil ,is huge.Take a country like France or Italy or Spain importing 50-60 mil tons per year or equivalent to 350 /420 milion barrel per year multiplied by ,say 110 usd per barrel, you have a total of about 40-50 bilion usd per year.Obviously if you have the gasoline price at the gas station os 1.8 chf or 1.7 euros, half of it and even buit more are taxes which the governement cashes in without big efforts.
Pablo, and welcome to EF by the way, try using the introductions to say hello to everyone, the comment was purely that a 30 pct strengthening in the exchange rate should have reduced prices.Taxes are based on the base price which should have gone down and therefore taxes would be less. Its too easy to blame the taxman.
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