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Old 11.09.2007, 18:38
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Our first impressions during a visit

We just returned from our first trip to Switzerland and are reviewing all of our findings. In thanks for all of the help provided by this great community of ex-pats and natives, I would like to share the due diligence outline that I had put together for our initial assessment. This outline is the by-product of many moves and hopefully will be helpful to anyone considering a move to Switzerland or anywhere else.

I have read many posts throughout this web-site in regards to cost of living and the like. For those coming from the US I can give a general idea of the cost vs. the US Dollar. (Take into consideration that the $ is at a 15 year low against almost every major foreign currency. The current exchange rate vs. the Swiss Franc is......$1.00 will get you 1.20CHF). What will that get you in "real" goods? Essentially, everything will cost DOUBLE what it costs in the US. Some examples of common every day expenses.....Gasoline 1.72 CHF per liter of gasoline or 6.50 CHF ($5.20) per gallon, a cup of Starbucks coffee 6.00 CHF ($4.85), Big Mac Value Meal 13.00 CHF ($10.40), Dinner for 2...50.00 to 80.00 CHF ($40 to $70), Haircut for man 40.00 CHF, for woman 60.00CHF. Groceries are along the same lines with cleaning products, detergents, soaps being more than double in price. Produce and Meats are expensive but of a very high quality. Some better prices on produce can be had at local street markets that every town has once or twice a week.

A quick note on eating out. Almost every grocery store has a restaurant. The food is very fresh, good and as reasonably priced as you are going to find. For those of you from the US, compare with Whole Foods or Wild Oats. It's like a Whole Foods on steroids !!! Very Cool !!!

As far as I can tell, Medical care is some of the best in the world but pay close attention to whatever insurance you decide on because annual deductibles can be very high (over 1,000 CHF).

If you have a pet, be prepared for sticker shock on the price of food and pet products in general.

I have read several threads in regards to housing and related costs. This is a very subjective area for analysis. We have always looked at the cost of housing in terms of PRICE PER SQ. FT. (Swiss residences are measured in sq. meters (m2). Conversion of a sq. meter = 10.76 sq. ft.). We found costs to be higher per M2 than described in many of the threads. Our search was from Geneva to Vevey and we found that the cost per M2 was between 23.00 CHF and 29.00 CHF or about $2.50 per sq. ft. I know there are areas that are less and areas that are more but this is a good range for a family seeking living conditions that are similar to middle class in the US. You can spend less and live in a very nice apartment but you will give up square footage. Make sure your furniture will fit as bedding, couches and tables tend to be larger in the US and may not fit in smaller living spaces. A couple of very important items to consider in the area of Housing....There are typically, NO CLOSETS and NO LIGHT FIXTURES (maybe a light bulb hanging from the ceiling, that's it) in the apt. or rental house. Add to your budget for these items. We went to IKEA and found self constructed closets for 400CHF to 1000CHF and ceiling light and lamp prices run the gammit.

If this is your first relocation move, here are a couple of tips...... Look at the move as if you were starting a business. Try and think of everything you do in your life on a daily, weekly, monthly, and annual basis. Focus on all of the small things (where you get your dry cleaning done, where you get your car fixed, etc...) The things that you take for granted in your every day life are the things that are the hardest to replace when you move. Put a budget together. Focus on all RECURRING COSTS vs. FIXED COSTS. The recurring costs will kill a budget in the first year. I can guarantee you that. Write it all down. Put levels of importance on certain things. Remember, you are going to HAVE TO give up some things. Be open to a new way of life.

In general on the economy....... Eventhough prices are higher than we are accustomed to, they are normal for the Swiss and they seem to live a very well balanced life. You don't see the areas of poverty or wealth that you see in the US. There is more of a wide ranging middle class that seems to include much of the general population. Certain things are less expensive in the US but, in turn, the people who work those jobs get paid less and can only afford less. The Swiss seem to make enough money for the majority to participate in the economy on a middle class level. There is something to be said for that type of balance.

As for general observations of the Swiss lifestyle and friendliness..... We look at it as we always have. This has been kinda' like our credo, if-you-will, when we move to a new place.......It is our resposibility to adapt to the culture and lifestyle while striving to be respectful and change our life to fit the culture and environs including trying to learn the language as quickly as possible. Look at EVERYTHING as an Adventure, even the difficult times. Look forward to all of the new and rewarding experiences.

Remember, I am just moving myself so I may not be able to answer a lot of questions.

Enough rambling........here is the Outline (in the next post).

Good luck to those of you considering a move or in the process.

Enjoy, Be Diligent,

mick c
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  #2  
Old 11.09.2007, 18:48
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Re: due diligence

I prefer the Nike approach to doing something new.

dave


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We just returned from our first trip to Switzerland and are reviewing all of our findings. In thanks for all of the help provided by this great community of ex-pats and natives, I would like to share the due diligence outline that I had put together for our initial assessment. This outline is the by-product of many moves and hopefully will be helpful to anyone considering a move to Switzerland or anywhere else.

I have read many posts throughout this web-site in regards to cost of living and the like. For those coming from the US I can give a general idea of the cost vs. the US Dollar. (Take into consideration that the $ is at a 15 year low against almost every major foreign currency. The current exchange rate vs. the Swiss Franc is......$1.00 will get you 1.20CHF). What will that get you in "real" goods? Essentially, everything will cost DOUBLE what it costs in the US. Some examples of common every day expenses.....Gasoline 1.72 CHF per liter of gasoline or 6.50 CHF ($5.20) per gallon, a cup of Starbucks coffee 6.00 CHF ($4.85), Big Mac Value Meal 13.00 CHF ($10.40), Dinner for 2...50.00 to 80.00 CHF ($40 to $70), Haircut for man 40.00 CHF, for woman 60.00CHF. Groceries are along the same lines with cleaning products, detergents, soaps being more than double in price. Produce and Meats are expensive but of a very high quality. Some better prices on produce can be had at local street markets that every town has once or twice a week.

A quick note on eating out. Almost every grocery store has a restaurant. The food is very fresh, good and as reasonably priced as you are going to find. For those of you from the US, compare with Whole Foods or Wild Oats. It's like a Whole Foods on steroids !!! Very Cool !!!

As far as I can tell, Medical care is some of the best in the world but pay close attention to whatever insurance you decide on because annual deductibles can be very high (over 1,000 CHF).

If you have a pet, be prepared for sticker shock on the price of food and pet products in general.

I have read several threads in regards to housing and related costs. This is a very subjective area for analysis. We have always looked at the cost of housing in terms of PRICE PER SQ. FT. (Swiss residences are measured in sq. meters (m2). Conversion of a sq. meter = 10.76 sq. ft.). We found costs to be higher per M2 than described in many of the threads. Our search was from Geneva to Vevey and we found that the cost per M2 was between 23.00 CHF and 29.00 CHF or about $2.50 per sq. ft. I know there are areas that are less and areas that are more but this is a good range for a family seeking living conditions that are similar to middle class in the US. You can spend less and live in a very nice apartment but you will give up square footage. Make sure your furniture will fit as bedding, couches and tables tend to be larger in the US and may not fit in smaller living spaces. A couple of very important items to consider in the area of Housing....There are typically, NO CLOSETS and NO LIGHT FIXTURES (maybe a light bulb hanging from the ceiling, that's it) in the apt. or rental house. Add to your budget for these items. We went to IKEA and found self constructed closets for 400CHF to 1000CHF and ceiling light and lamp prices run the gammit.

If this is your first relocation move, here are a couple of tips...... Look at the move as if you were starting a business. Try and think of everything you do in your life on a daily, weekly, monthly, and annual basis. Focus on all of the small things (where you get your dry cleaning done, where you get your car fixed, etc...) The things that you take for granted in your every day life are the things that are the hardest to replace when you move. Put a budget together. Focus on all RECURRING COSTS vs. FIXED COSTS. The recurring costs will kill a budget in the first year. I can guarantee you that. Write it all down. Put levels of importance on certain things. Remember, you are going to HAVE TO give up some things. Be open to a new way of life.

In general on the economy....... Eventhough prices are higher than we are accustomed to, they are normal for the Swiss and they seem to live a very well balanced life. You don't see the areas of poverty or wealth that you see in the US. There is more of a wide ranging middle class that seems to include much of the general population. Certain things are less expensive in the US but, in turn, the people who work those jobs get paid less and can only afford less. The Swiss seem to make enough money for the majority to participate in the economy on a middle class level. There is something to be said for that type of balance.

As for general observations of the Swiss lifestyle and friendliness..... We look at it as we always have. This has been kinda' like our credo, if-you-will, when we move to a new place.......It is our resposibility to adapt to the culture and lifestyle while striving to be respectful and change our life to fit the culture and environs including trying to learn the language as quickly as possible. Look at EVERYTHING as an Adventure, even the difficult times. Look forward to all of the new and rewarding experiences.

Remember, I am just moving myself so I may not be able to answer a lot of questions.

Enough rambling........here is the Outline (in the next post).

Good luck to those of you considering a move or in the process.

Enjoy, Be Diligent,

mick c
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  #3  
Old 11.09.2007, 19:24
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

Great stuff, I'm from the UK, but i can see this will be very helpful to a lot of people considering a move.

Swiss price = roughly same as a UK major city down south.
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  #4  
Old 11.09.2007, 20:19
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Re: due diligence

Due Diligence Switzerland
(Build Question List from each topic. Focus on recurring costs vs. fixed costs)



Underlying Economy
  • Rate of Inflation (in %)
  • Price of Housing (2, 3, 4, 5 Yrs. Ago)
    • Own
    • Rent
  • Price of Gasoline
  • Average Salary (Determine opinion from all walks of life)
  • Cost of Lunch
  • Cost of Dinner
  • Cost of McDonald's Value Meal
  • Cost of a Cup of Coffee at Starbuck's
  • Cost of a Movie
  • Cost of a DVD Rental
  • Cost of a Haircut
  • Cost of a Manicure
  • Postal Service
    • Letter
    • Large Letter
    • Package
    • What other services does the Post Office provide
  • Parcel Service
    • FedEx
    • DHL
Health
Medical
  • Quality of Care
    • Availability of Care
      • # of Days for an Appointment
    • Health Maintenance
      • Annual Physicals
        • Blood Work
        • Stress Test
        • Other Tests
    • Cost Per Visit
    • Insurance
      • Levels of Service
      • Premiums
      • Deductibles
    • Hospitals
      • Emergency Rooms
    • Situations
      • Cold/Flu
      • Sprained Joint
      • Broken Limb
      • Minor Surgery
      • Major Surgery
      • Disease
      • Chest Pains
    • Vet Care
      • Cost per Visit
      • Quality of Care
      • Cost of Food
      • Kennels
        • Cost per Day
    • Where to get prescriptions
Dental
    • Quality of Care
    • Availability of Care
      • # of Days for an appointment
    • Dental Check-Ups/Teeth Cleaning
      • 6 months
    • Situations
      • Cavity
      • Broken Tooth
      • Crown
      • Root Canal
Pharmacy/Health Products
    • Prescriptions
    • Everyday Health Aids
      • Vitamins
      • Cold/Flu Medication
      • Cough Syrup
Home
  • Where to purchase...........
    • Home Repair Materials (Home Depot type store)
    • Furniture
    • Household Goods
Electricity
    • Source
      • Nuclear
      • Oil
      • Natural Gas
      • Solar
      • Wind
    • Average Cost per Month
    • Typical Amp Service per House/Apt.
    • # of Outlets per Room
    • # of Outlets per Circuit
    • # of Circuits per House
    • Service Interruption (Common types...Weather, Service Work, Other)
      • Typical Duration
Telecommunications
    • Availability
      • Cable TV
      • Internet
      • Phone
    • Cable TV (Cost of each Service)
      • Avg. Number of TV outlets per home
        • Typical locations
      • Is Digital Cable Available?
    • Internet (High Speed Data)
      • Speed and Cost
      • Provider
        • Cable Co.
        • Phone Co.
    • Phone
      • Avg. Number of Phone Jacks per home
        • Typical locations
      • Long Distance Costs
      • Will US Phones work
Heating/Cooling
    • Type
      • Radiator
      • Radiant
      • Forced Air
    • Energy Source
      • Oil
      • Natural Gas
      • Electricity
    • Avg. Cost per Month
      • Is it included in rent?
    • Type of Windows in Home
      • Insulated/non-Insulated
    • Is the residence insulated
Water
    • Is there a charge?
    • Cleanliness
    • Potability
    • Minerals (Iron, Calcium, etc...)
    • Hard or Soft Water
    • Water Source
Sewer Service
    • Is there a charge?
    • Community sewer or septic system?
Responsibilities of Landlord/Tenant
    • General Maintenance
    • Appliance Repairs
    • Structural Repairs
    • Painting
    • Landscaping
    • Top repair issues on homes in Switzerland
Transportation
    • Cost of Automobile Purchase
      • Actual Cost of Vehicle
      • Sales Tax
      • Registration
      • Annual Fees
      • Road Tariffs
      • Inspections
    • Vehicle Maintenance Costs
      • Oil Cahnge
        • Can you change your own oil?
      • Cost of a Mechanic per Hour
        • # of Days for an Appointment
        • # of Days in Shop
        • Are loaner cars typical?
    • What is the Typical Warranty
    • Other
      • Train Tickets
        • Is a Monthly Pass Available?
      • Ferry Costs
      • Bus Tickets
      • Toll Roads?
    • Parking
      • How to use parking meters
        • Cost per Hour
    • Travel to Other Countries (issues?)
    • Violations
      • Parking
        • Where to pay
        • # of Days to pay
        • Cost
        • How Strictly is it enforced
      • Speeding Ticket
        • Same as Above
      • Moving Violation
        • Same as Above
    • Driver's License
      • How long is US license good for?
      • Requirements for Swiss License
      • Where to get a Swiss License
    • Accident
      • How are Traffic Accident's Handled
        • Are Police called to scene?
        • Is info exchanged between driver's?
        • When and how is insurance co. notified?
        • How are claims handled
        • Other Customs
Finance/Taxes
  • Negotiation Protocol (Customs/Etiquette)
    • Acceptable Negotiation Tacticsin Regards to.........
      • Housing
        • Lease Terms
          • 1 yr., 18 mo., 2 yr.
          • Additional Quarter's
          • Month to Month
          • Typical Lease Exit
            • # of Months Notification
            • Deadlines
          • Condition of Home at start and end of lease
          • Other considerations in typical Swiss lease
          • Are prices fixed
          • % available for notification
        • Home Repair
          • Typical protocol for hiring a contractor
          • Do they perform? (2 week syndrome)
      • Auto
        • Typical protocol in purchasing/leasing a vehicle
        • % available for negotiation
        • any web sites for comparison shopping
      • Store Purchases
        • Furniture
        • Electronics
        • Appliances
  • Banking
    • Is it easy to open an account?
      • Savings
      • Checking
      • Money Market
    • What is amount of interest paid on accounts?
    • What is the most common form of payment used?
      • Cash
      • Check
      • Debit
      • Credit
    • How hard is it to get a credit/debit card?
    • Transfer of assets.....to and from home country?
  • Taxes
    • Income
    • Federal
    • Regional
    • City
    • Property
    • Transportation
    • Sales Tax
    • Duty on goods shipped from US
  • Insurance
    • Property
    • Personal
    • Auto
    • Are there a lot of lawsuits in Switzerland?
Shopping
Food
    • Best place to buy fresh produce and meats
    • Most cost effective stores
    • Are there coupons issued in local papers
    • List of Grocery Store Chains
  • Clothing
    • Are there outlet centers
    • Location of Malls
    • Regional Discount Stores
    • List of Department Stores
  • Electronic's
    • TV's
    • Computer's
    • Audio/Video
    • Is internet buying of electronics a common thing?
Crime
What type of Crime is most common?
Areas or towns that have a higher rate of Crime?
Types
    • Pick Pocket
    • Burglary
    • Mugging
    • Auto Theft
    • ID Theft
    • Rape
    • Murder
Weather
  • # of Day's of Sun
  • # of Days's of Rain
  • # of Day's of Measurable Snow
    • travel/commute consideration?
  • # of Day's Below Freezing
  • Avg. Daily Temp's for each Season
Entertainment
  • Sports
    • Most Common Sports in Switzerland
    • Where is the closest Park, Ski Area, Stadium, Arena
    • Can you see US sports on TV
  • Concerts
    • Closest Venues
    • Typical Cost of a Ticket
  • Movies
    • Closest Theater's
    • What type of theater
    • Cost of a admission
    • Cost of popcorn, etc...
  • Events
  • Festivals
  • Natural Wonders
  • Cities/Towns/Villages to visit
  • Landmarks
  • Drives/Tours
  • Ask Locals.....What is your favorite......
    • Restaurant
    • Local Hang-Out
    • Coffe Shop
    • Bakery
    • Market
    • Pub
    • Mall
    • Grocery Store
  • What are the typical foods found in Switzerland?
    • Indian
    • German
    • Italian
    • French
    • Chinese
    • Japanese
    • Mexican
    • Other
Tough Questions…………..

What do you like most about Switzerland (at least 3 examples)

What do you like least or needs improvement? (3 examples)

What are the biggest things that bother the Swiss about America and/or Americans? (As many examples as can be thought of) Very Important !

Things we need to work on to make assimilation process as smooth as possible?

Personality traits or customs that we should look for or pay attention to. (Handshake, kissing, sir names, etc…)

Things that should be avoided.

Other

Where might we find other American Ex-Pats?

Newspapers

Is Home Delivery Available?


A review of items to take into consideration.

Ease of access to highway (commute)

General access to a community

Food/Shopping

Entertainment

Dining

Medical/Dental

Auto Repair

Airport
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  #5  
Old 11.09.2007, 23:45
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

You know what your post made me remember? Scientists say that our brain can only weigh up simple problems (their example was which oven glove to buy). As soon as many variables are involved, decisions are taken on an emotional level.

I once tried to decide whether to move based on a list similar to yours (although much shorter!). It did not work. I could only decide on the feeling about whether the move would be good or not which was determined by one or two factors really.

That said, your post will help expats who need to think about costs of living here, that more than anything .

Quote:
It is our resposibility to adapt to the culture and lifestyle while striving to be respectful and change our life to fit the culture and environs including trying to learn the language as quickly as possible. Look at EVERYTHING as an Adventure, even the difficult times. Look forward to all of the new and rewarding experiences.
Couldn't agree more. That is why I am going to learn Berndeutsch even though people laugh at me
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  #6  
Old 12.09.2007, 00:36
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

It's really excellent to have a list of factors to think through broadly. It's probably not necessary to create an excel spreadsheet to make all the calculation on paper before one decides. It's important to let your instinct tell you how you feel about a place. Sure, things are certainly more expensive in Switzerland and the dollar weakness isn't going to help. However, one must not forget the intangibles and this is where one's intuition about a place and the people in it is important when one makes the "calculation."

To me, the thought of having a generally clean environment, safe and full of natural beauty is very important. One irreplaceable element about living in Europe vs. US is that there's just so much more history and culture here. You can spend a lifetime exploring them. Also, if you like skiing, it's right at your doorstep! Those are some of the "intangible" bits about Europe for me that has made the move worth while.

Perhaps someday I'll tire of it and want to move back to the US. For now, I'm enjoying exploring all the historical bits of Europe that I spent many years studying at University!
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Old 12.09.2007, 08:14
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Re: due diligence

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Due Diligence Switzerland
(Build Question List from each topic. Focus on recurring costs vs. fixed costs)


Medical/Dental

Auto Repair

Airport
did you actually spend the time to roll this out yourself or is it a hack from a bunch of sources ?
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  #8  
Old 12.09.2007, 08:37
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

Decide on emotion. Justify with fact.

Its nice to analyse a domestic move in such detail, but I think it may mask the real factors under a sea of vegetable-costs.

dave

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It's really excellent to have a list of factors to think through broadly. It's probably not necessary to create an excel spreadsheet to make all the calculation on paper before one decides. It's important to let your instinct tell you how you feel about a place.
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Old 12.09.2007, 10:02
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Re: due diligence

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Due Diligence Switzerland
(Build Question List from each topic. Focus on recurring costs vs. fixed costs)



Underlying Economy
  • Rate of Inflation (in %)
  • <snip><snip><snip><and snip again>
I think if we all employed this system, no-one would be here.

I guess you're an accountant...
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  #10  
Old 12.09.2007, 10:16
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Re: due diligence

If I were to move again, I think my decision would be made on answering the questions:

a) is it a war zone ?
b) could I afford to stay there ?
c) whats the weather like ?

Further analysis would just be curiosity, and have little impact on the initial decision.

dave


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I think if we all employed this system, no-one would be here.

I guess you're an accountant...
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Old 12.09.2007, 10:33
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

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It is our resposibility to adapt to the culture and lifestyle while striving to be respectful and change our life to fit the culture and environs including trying to learn the language as quickly as possible.
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Cost of McDonald's Value Meal
Cost of a Cup of Coffee at Starbuck's
Will US Phones work
Can you see US sports on TV
Where might we find other American Ex-Pats?


Good analysis (albeit a little... exhaustive... calcium and iron in water...really, who cares, other than JamesK...).

Couldn't resist picking up the above tho
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Old 12.09.2007, 11:19
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Re: due diligence

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I think if we all employed this system, no-one would be here.

I guess you're an accountant...
.... I'll bet he's an actuary!!
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Old 12.09.2007, 11:25
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

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[/font][/b]

Good analysis (albeit a little... exhaustive... calcium and iron in water...really, who cares, other than JamesK...).

Couldn't resist picking up the above tho
how can I export Arizona to Switzerland ? also which shops sell brown sugar ?
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  #14  
Old 12.09.2007, 11:36
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

Although I feel the OP posts in good faith, it's one of the most bizarre threads I've read on EF.

Going out for the night must be a barrel of laughs...

Apparel:
Shoes - Leather, canvas, sports?
Trousers - Suit pants, jeans, other?
Shirt - Cotton, mercerized, silk, linen?

Hair:
Parted - Left or Right parting?
Gel, Mousse, none?

Condom:
Kitemark guarantee?
Latex?
Flavour - Strawberry, Banana, Chocolate, None?
Size - US or Euro?
Lubed or Dry?
Pack of one or three?

Etc Etc...
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Old 12.09.2007, 11:50
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

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how can I export Arizona to Switzerland ? also which shops sell brown sugar ?
Is the database safe?
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Old 12.09.2007, 11:54
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

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Condom:
Kitemark guarantee?
Latex?
Flavour - Strawberry, Banana, Chocolate, None?
Size - US or Euro?
Lubed or Dry?
Pack of one or three?

Etc Etc...
ribbed , French Tickler ?
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  #17  
Old 12.09.2007, 12:01
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

Women:
Availability
Sense of Style
Gullability
Tolerance to Geeks
Chance of getting laid for free
ROI when attempting to get laid
This could run and run...

dave



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Although I feel the OP posts in good faith, it's one of the most bizarre threads I've read on EF.

Going out for the night must be a barrel of laughs...

Apparel:
Shoes - Leather, canvas, sports?
Trousers - Suit pants, jeans, other?
Shirt - Cotton, mercerized, silk, linen?

Hair:
Parted - Left or Right parting?
Gel, Mousse, none?

Condom:
Kitemark guarantee?
Latex?
Flavour - Strawberry, Banana, Chocolate, None?
Size - US or Euro?
Lubed or Dry?
Pack of one or three?

Etc Etc...
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  #18  
Old 12.09.2007, 12:04
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

hasn't this been done before ?

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Old 12.09.2007, 16:30
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

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Tolerance to Geeks
hahahaha!

well, whats your score then?
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Old 12.09.2007, 16:43
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Re: Our first impressions during a visit

Wow !!!! Expected some backlash for the outline but ............jeeeesh C'mon guys I was just trying to help. OK, OK I get it, just another ANAL American. I hope not.

A little more background............. Over the last 20 years we have lived, worked or spent time in 26 States and 10 Countries. We have "Just Done It", "lived by the seat of our pants" and made almost every mistake you could make. Once we realized that we are moving our life and not going on vacation, "the list" was born. We have come to appreciate things we never thought we would and dislike things we thought we would love.

I like to think of the list as a "Culmination of Experience" or some sort of "Badge of Honor". Almost every item on that list has come from an experience of some sort.

I see many of the posts on this site and say "we've done that" ! We have moved somewhere to find out that after 6 month's we have "settled" for things on so many issues (where we lived, commute times, you name it) that we were not happy and could not truly enjoy the things that the area had to offer. "The list" was based on an that evolution of those events.

The main by-product of not being prepared is a general feeling of unhappiness. That can then be translated into distrust or resentment of the local population, customs and culture. Once that happens, it's no longer fun. I see that in many of the "complaint threads" on this site.

As I said earlier, I just wanted to possibly help some ex-pat's that may not be asking some of the question's they should be. Our experience has taught us that it's the "little things" that add up to make or break the move.

We just found out yesterday that there is a TV tax in addition to monthly cable service. 450 CHF per year. That's another 38 CHF per month (20 liters of fuel, or a dinner for two) no problem now that we know about it.

Now to answer some of your question's................

The "type of water" comment......this was added to the list when we found ourselves responsible for replacing a hot water heater on a regular basis because of the minerals in the water.

As for "moving Arizona to Switzerland"......You are WAYYYYYYY off course.

My previous occupations..........Residential and Commercial Construction, Operations, Telecommunications, Artist, Entrepenuer. I'd like to think that both sides of my brain work.

Bottomline......We do this work up front because we want to enjoy everything that Switzerland and the surrounding countries have to offer without worrying about details that we could have taken into consideration before we made the move.

As for "the list". Use it or abuse it. It's all good. I can take it.

We are DEFINITELY, DEFINITELY looking forward to spending the next few years of our life in Switzerland.

mick c
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