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Old 05.09.2011, 22:16
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what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

riding shot gun to germany this weekend for my shopping pilgrimage i had the opportunity to actually read the party posters. i realized that there are 2 green parties? went to their sites and tried to figure out what their raison d'etre are, but no such luck?! i also read the wikipedia entry...

so anybody here got a clue - what is the difference between grünliberale and the grüne...
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Old 05.09.2011, 22:22
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

The grüne party wants to save the world.
The grünliberale party wants to save the world with an economically feasible plan.
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Old 05.09.2011, 23:00
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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The grüne party wants to save the world.
The grünliberale party wants to save the world with an economically feasible plan.
Nah. The green party is a green party, with all that implies (like having a constant battle between "fundis" [fundamentalists] and realists).

The green liberal party is basically the FDP with a green condom that makes it a bit cooler for urban yuppie-wannabes. Its main advantage is that is the new thing, as nobody really knows what it stands for.
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Old 05.09.2011, 23:22
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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riding shot gun to germany this weekend for my shopping pilgrimage i had the opportunity to actually read the party posters. i realized that there are 2 green parties? went to their sites and tried to figure out what their raison d'etre are, but no such luck?! i also read the wikipedia entry...

so anybody here got a clue - what is the difference between grünliberale and the grüne...
The Green Party is leftist, in fact to the left of the SP, and favours state control.

The Green Liberal Party is centrist, a bit to the left of the FDP, but clearly right-of-centre.

Many Greens who were angry about the Left-Socialist ways of the Greens therefore started the Green-Liberal Party

Add to this that the Green-Liberals also tackle other topics and not just the "Green matter"
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Old 05.09.2011, 23:37
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

The Greens use environmentalism to hide the fact that they're just a bunch of commies.
The Green Liberals use environmentalism to hide the fact that nobody really knows what they stand for.
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Old 05.09.2011, 23:40
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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The Green Party is leftist, in fact to the left of the SP, and favours state control.
Sort of like a watermelon you mean, green on the outside, red on the inside.
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Old 05.09.2011, 23:57
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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The Greens use environmentalism to hide the fact that they're just a bunch of commies.
The Green Liberals use environmentalism to hide the fact that nobody really knows what they stand for.
I would not go as far as to describe the Greens as Communists, as they are not Communists. Even if they are about as leftist as the Social-Democrats used to be in the 50ies and early 60ies

The Green Liberals have some Green positions, but are in favour of free entreprise, in favour of a close co-operation with the E.U., in favour of the Social Market-Economy, and so have a much clearer profile than for example the CVP, that Catholic arch-Conservative Party with some leftist rethorics
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Old 25.09.2011, 13:30
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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I would not go as far as to describe the Greens as Communists, as they are not Communists.
Many former POCH members (e.g. Daniel Vischer) joined the Green Party when the cantonal POCH sections were dissolved back in the 80s and 90s and POCH was definitely a communist party. For them the Green party is basically a convenient cover because enviromentalism is much more popular than communism.
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Old 25.09.2011, 15:16
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

The biggest difference between Liberal Green and the Green is that the later want to expand the welfare state and a less liberal economy.
I use http://smartvote.ch to get the profile of the different parties and lists running for the federal elections. Here is for example the 2 parties profile for Fribourg canton.
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Old 25.09.2011, 21:20
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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Many former POCH members (e.g. Daniel Vischer) joined the Green Party when the cantonal POCH sections were dissolved back in the 80s and 90s and POCH was definitely a communist party. For them the Green party is basically a convenient cover because enviromentalism is much more popular than communism.
THE Communists in those times were in the PdA (Partei der Arbeit). POCH was leftist socialist. I had a school-friend who when getting adult in 1970 joined POCH. His father was a staunch communist and he for example believed that the Soviet Union in 1967 had been betrayed by the Arabs while I believed that the USSR had betrayed the Arabs. But He was NOT a Communist
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Old 25.09.2011, 22:08
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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Nah. The green party is a green party, with all that implies (like having a constant battle between "fundis" [fundamentalists] and realists).

The green liberal party is basically the FDP with a green condom that makes it a bit cooler for urban yuppie-wannabes. Its main advantage is that is the new thing, as nobody really knows what it stands for.
Unfortunately, I would rather say the green liberal party is more of a SVP with a green condom.. : ((
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Old 25.09.2011, 23:02
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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Unfortunately, I would rather say the green liberal party is more of a SVP with a green condom.. : ((
No, the GLP is not that far right. It is just narrowly left of the FDP. The GLP therefore, since its start, has damaged the results of the FDP.
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Old 26.09.2011, 11:53
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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THE Communists in those times were in the PdA (Partei der Arbeit). POCH was leftist socialist. I had a school-friend who when getting adult in 1970 joined POCH. His father was a staunch communist and he for example believed that the Soviet Union in 1967 had been betrayed by the Arabs while I believed that the USSR had betrayed the Arabs. But He was NOT a Communist
Well he might not have considered himself a communist but POCH clearly considered itself a communist party. Maybe not yet in 1970 but certainly later on.

From the Swiss historical encyclopedia:

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Die POCH verstanden sich zunächst als autonome Aufbauorganisation, später als Partei im Rahmen der Kommunist. Weltbewegung.
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Old 26.09.2011, 11:56
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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Many Greens who were angry about the Left-Socialist ways of the Greens therefore started the Green-Liberal Party
To be fair, it was exactly 3 - Martin Bäumle (todays GLP President), Verena Diener (ZH Ständerat) and Thomas Weibel. They were actually excluded from the Green Party in 2004 for being "too far right". Although they may not sound like it today, if you look at interviews from back then, they seemed to be quite worried about their political future at the time and probably were quite surprised about the success of the Green-Liberals initially... They're laughing at it these days of course! SF has a nice timeline of the GLP (and all other big parties) on their webpage for all those interested (in German only).

It does seem like the greens and the green liberals are drifting further from each other with time. At the last election in 2007, the GLP scored many votes from the left block - SP even withdrew their Ständerat candidate in favour of Verena Diener. Don't think that will happen this time - I think quite a few left voters were surprised how central-right the GLP turned out to be on non-environmental issues.
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Old 26.09.2011, 20:32
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Re: what is the difference between the 2 green parties in Switzerland?

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Well he might not have considered himself a communist but POCH clearly considered itself a communist party. Maybe not yet in 1970 but certainly later on.

From the Swiss historical encyclopedia:
Thanks for the info. This explains why he somewhat later suddenly left POCH. His father had left the PdA even before 1970 .
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