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  #41  
Old 17.11.2011, 06:00
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

Blick am Abend says it is opening today (Thursday). We're looking forward to a bit of life on a Sunday.

Dan
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  #42  
Old 17.11.2011, 08:09
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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At the moment it feels more Swiss than my local town centre in the UK
...you don't say, let's just say thank goodness.
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  #43  
Old 17.11.2011, 09:00
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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Baden & Swissness ? Are you aware of the fact that Baden would not be what it is without those two engineers, a Brit and an Italian ? That Starbucks is the enterprise which resulted from impressions and ideas a US-American of German roots had in MILANO ? That Migros is based on ideas Gottlieb Duttweiler got in various places abroad ?

And important people ? Mr Nestle was from Baden-Württemberg, Mr Baur (Baur-en-Lac) from Austria, Mr Maggi from Italy. Messrs Bindella (restaurants) and Marinello (shops) were Italians.

THIS is what "Swissness" is all about. That mix of traditional ways mixed with imports from everywhere !
what about the Big French company ...re-iterates your definition of Swissness IMHO
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Old 17.11.2011, 09:10
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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Baden & Swissness ? Are you aware of the fact that Baden would not be what it is without those two engineers, a Brit and an Italian ? That Starbucks is the enterprise which resulted from impressions and ideas a US-American of German roots had in MILANO ? That Migros is based on ideas Gottlieb Duttweiler got in various places abroad ?

And important people ? Mr Nestle was from Baden-Württemberg, Mr Baur (Baur-en-Lac) from Austria, Mr Maggi from Italy. Messrs Bindella (restaurants) and Marinello (shops) were Italians.

THIS is what "Swissness" is all about. That mix of traditional ways mixed with imports from everywhere !
I understand what you are saying, hubby used to work for ABB so I know about Brown Boveri and Cie, and I understand that Switzerland is a multi-national country.
However, despite the fact that I miss certain shopping chains from the UK, it doesn't mean that I want to see Next, Boots, M&S etc in the towns and cities of Switzerland.

Last edited by hannah'sauntie; 17.11.2011 at 10:35.
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  #45  
Old 17.11.2011, 21:29
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what about the Big French company ...re-iterates your definition of Swissness IMHO
sorry, what "big French company" ?

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I understand what you are saying, hubby used to work for ABB so I know about Brown Boveri and Cie, and I understand that Switzerland is a multi-national country.
However, despite the fact that I miss certain shopping chains from the UK, it doesn't mean that I want to see Next, Boots, M&S etc in the towns and cities of Switzerland.
But you can see C&A (Netherlands), H&M (Sweden), Ikea (Sweden), Conforama (France), Media Markt (Germany), Lidl (Germany), Aldi (Germany), Spar (Netherlands) and others. Amazing that there is no stronger presence of British and/or American chains

Last edited by MusicChick; 21.11.2011 at 23:52. Reason: merging consecutive posts
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  #46  
Old 18.11.2011, 00:28
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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sorry, what "big French company" ?
Alstom ofcourse with more than 5000 employees ratio of 70% non-swiss

I think there will be other openings in gastronomie very soon...During the lunch times, the city is flooded by Alstom and ABB employees..quite good potential...
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  #47  
Old 18.11.2011, 01:04
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Starbucks in Switzerland, yuk! What next?

Did you know that McDonalds is here too?

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Alstom ofcourse with more than 5000 employees ratio of 70% non-swiss

I think there will be other openings in gastronomie very soon...During the lunch times, the city is flooded by Alstom and ABB employees..quite good potential...
I think that can be said for many a'international firms based in Switzerland. That doesn't mean that there is an onslaught of future businesses catering to their needs.

I mean places like Stars and Stripes, Tres Amigos, and Route 66 are all located away from where there are big int'l firms.

But again, how long has ABB already been there for?

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But you can see C&A (Netherlands), H&M (Sweden), Ikea (Sweden), Conforama (France), Media Markt (Germany), Lidl (Germany), Aldi (Germany), Spar (Netherlands) and others. Amazing that there is no stronger presence of British and/or American chains
You didn't see the Currys or Tesco across from the Bahnoff selling 3 bottles for 10 CHF of wine?

Last edited by MusicChick; 21.11.2011 at 23:51. Reason: merging consecutive posts
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  #48  
Old 18.11.2011, 01:13
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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But again, how long has ABB already been there for?
1891 when it started as BBC. Please multiquote
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Old 18.11.2011, 01:15
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

"hat Migros is based on ideas Gottlieb Duttweiler got in various places abroad ?"

Migros is a supermarket.
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  #50  
Old 18.11.2011, 17:40
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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I think that can be said for many a'international firms based in Switzerland. That doesn't mean that there is an onslaught of future businesses catering to their needs.

I mean places like Stars and Stripes, Tres Amigos, and Route 66 are all located away from where there are big int'l firms.

But again, how long has ABB already been there for?
Well definetely it is... ABB is there for more than 100 years...but company sizes are increased incredible. Today we are talking about approx. 10.000 people only working in ABB + ALSTOM. There are also AXPO offices and many others are here.

I had been talking to local people 4 years ago, that there were not so many bars and restaurants in Baden in the past at all.
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Old 18.11.2011, 22:56
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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Alstom ofcourse with more than 5000 employees ratio of 70% non-swiss

I think there will be other openings in gastronomie very soon...During the lunch times, the city is flooded by Alstom and ABB employees..quite good potential...
ahhhh, ok. It accdg to http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alstom_%28Schweiz%29 is the former ABB Kraftwerke AG (until 1999) and so even if 100% French owned not really perceived as French in a way. ABB by that sale made lots of money and Alstom has invested in Baden in the meantime.

A good example of how foreign companies moving in very often do improve the overall situation

You mention 70% non-Swiss ? This has become quite normal in industrial enterprises in Switzerland since the 1960ies/70ies and is not new.


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"hat Migros is based on ideas Gottlieb Duttweiler got in various places abroad ?"

Migros is a supermarket.
It was the first chain of supermarkets and it was the first big discounter and it was the company which introduced self-service here. It was the low-price pioneer. All this in a time when Denner, Lebensmittelverein (LVZ), Konsumverein (KVZ), Usego, etc still worked in the way of the "Aunt-Emma-shops" .

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Well definetely it is... ABB is there for more than 100 years...but company sizes are increased incredible. Today we are talking about approx. 10.000 people only working in ABB + ALSTOM. There are also AXPO offices and many others are here.

I had been talking to local people 4 years ago, that there were not so many bars and restaurants in Baden in the past at all.
Baden for ages had the reputation of a kind of Olten. It was perceived as important in a way but rather boring. Only in recent decades, towns like Yverdon, Biel and Baden started to improve. A new generation, born after WWII, started to take over (pity that you have to be 60plus to be taken seriously ) and ventured into breaking new grounds

***********

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  #52  
Old 20.11.2011, 12:06
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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ahhhh, ok. It accdg to http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alstom_%28Schweiz%29 is the former ABB Kraftwerke AG (until 1999) and so even if 100% French owned not really perceived as French in a way. ABB by that sale made lots of money and Alstom has invested in Baden in the meantime.

A good example of how foreign companies moving in very often do improve the overall situation

You mention 70% non-Swiss ? This has become quite normal in industrial enterprises in Switzerland since the 1960ies/70ies and is not new.


************************************************** ***********************



It was the first chain of supermarkets and it was the first big discounter and it was the company which introduced self-service here. It was the low-price pioneer. All this in a time when Denner, Lebensmittelverein (LVZ), Konsumverein (KVZ), Usego, etc still worked in the way of the "Aunt-Emma-shops" .

************************************************** ***********************************



Baden for ages had the reputation of a kind of Olten. It was perceived as important in a way but rather boring. Only in recent decades, towns like Yverdon, Biel and Baden started to improve. A new generation, born after WWII, started to take over (pity that you have to be 60plus to be taken seriously ) and ventured into breaking new grounds

***********
Olten is one kickarse city and don't forget it!!
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  #53  
Old 20.11.2011, 17:03
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

Sure, but cities can move, move up or down. Olten may have far more potential than the Olteners themselves realise

Look at Biel and Neuchâtel/Neuenburg. In the 1950ies and 60ies Neuenburg no longer was what it had been in the 1920ies and 30ies and people of the old generation deplored the rundown situation of NE, but it still was miles above Biel. In the meantime, Biel has moved up and now, fast trains between Zürich and Lausanne have stops in Olten and Biel but none in NE, something unthinkable in the 1960ies

Look at Winterthur. Industrial but shabby and having a rundown downtown, and a minus-zero as place of residence. Now a place where people enjoy to be with a nice downtown

Look at Yverdon. In the 60ies a suburb of nowhere. But now quite a nice place.

Look at Kloten. In the 50ies and 60ies THE town of pilots and stewardesses. Now clearly behind Opfikon-Glattbrugg and Bassersdorf, or example in regard to public transport.

Back to Olten. I half a year ago, enroute by train, arrived in Olten and realized that I by mistake was a full hour early, and so in nice weather, went into Olten "downtown". Many nice buildings, a few restaurants which looked like being good in the evening, but nowhere to sit down for a coffee, and so I gradually returned to the train station, realising that Olten is a very large train station beside a boring small town

Look at Basel, Bern and Zürich. Some 150 years ago, Basel was THE largest city and leading in every way. Bern was on the same level as Zürich. But while Bern, in spite of having become federal Capital or due to this, stagnated, and Basel only slowly went ahead, Zürich , not least thanks to Alfred von Escher, moved up to rank nr.1 . And while still being exceedingly boring in the 1960ies, not least thanks to the Raphael Huber scandal, in regard to gastronomy and entertainment moved up as well.
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  #54  
Old 20.11.2011, 17:14
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

Soon every town in Europe and US will be exactly the same - same cafés (Costa and Starbucks) same fast foods, same boutiques and larger shops, 2 of each, same restaurants even - some better than others. Already happening in the UK- where town centres are all becoming clones- and Switzerland not far behind. What a shame. Everywhere I go I try to eat and have coffee in small independent places, same for shopping - but the battle is lost already.

Starbucks coffee is either tasteless or too bitter, and who needs a swimming pool of coffee- give me a normal cup of something that tastes like coffee.
Only reason I use Starbucks near our flat in the UK is to get free WiFi - but have now found another local café- with great coffee, cakes, snacks and lunches, run by people who own the place and really care about making their business work. Defo NOT more expensive either.

I really would love England to be England, Italy to be italy, Switzerland to be Swiss, etc - NO CLONED CITIES PLEASE.
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Old 20.11.2011, 17:47
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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Starbucks coffee is either tasteless or too bitter, and who needs a swimming pool of coffee- give me a normal cup of something that tastes like coffee.
Only reason I use Starbucks near our flat in the UK is to get free WiFi - but have now found another local café- with great coffee, cakes, snacks and lunches, run by people who own the place and really care about making their business work. Defo NOT more expensive either.
I went to Starbucks in Baden on Saturday just to see what it was like. It was very busy, all the tables were taken. It was really noisy as well.

If I am going to pay those kinds of prices, I still prefer Himmel. Their pastries are very good.
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Old 20.11.2011, 17:50
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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Soon every town in Europe and US will be exactly the same - same cafés (Costa and Starbucks) same fast foods, same boutiques and larger shops, 2 of each, same restaurants even - some better than others. Already happening in the UK- where town centres are all becoming clones- and Switzerland not far behind. What a shame. Everywhere I go I try to eat and have coffee in small independent places, same for shopping - but the battle is lost already.

Starbucks coffee is either tasteless or too bitter, and who needs a swimming pool of coffee- give me a normal cup of something that tastes like coffee.
Only reason I use Starbucks near our flat in the UK is to get free WiFi - but have now found another local café- with great coffee, cakes, snacks and lunches, run by people who own the place and really care about making their business work. Defo NOT more expensive either.

I really would love England to be England, Italy to be italy, Switzerland to be Swiss, etc - NO CLONED CITIES PLEASE.
Completely agree! I would have pressed the 'Thanks' button twice if I could.
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Old 21.11.2011, 07:39
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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I went to Starbucks in Baden on Saturday just to see what it was like. It was very busy, all the tables were taken. It was really noisy as well.

If I am going to pay those kinds of prices, I still prefer Himmel. Their pastries are very good.
I had the same impression - the space is tiny, and they've crammed so many seats/tables in there that even after the novelty factor wears off, it still won't be able to provide a quiet ambiance conducive to reading or working that some people would expect from a Starbucks.

I don't mind paying exorbitant prices if I'm also using wifi and space for a few hours, but definitely not for this experience!

There are lots of more comfortable cafes in town - Frau Meise is my personal favorite. The people who run it are very sweet, they support local artists, and cater to food intolerances (lactose free milk and sometimes gluten-free pastries and bread), which is an added bonus.
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  #58  
Old 21.11.2011, 08:50
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

I think there must be a reason that Starbucks still can not enter in Italian market.. I guess "nobody would pay for a cafe more than 2 Euros with much less taste?`
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Old 21.11.2011, 09:22
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

While I'm not a fan of their coffee, I do like their Pita Rustica sandwich.

It's a foccacia like bread stuffed with chicken and some sort of a soft & fresh herbed cheese. They warm it up for you. It's really quite enjoyable. Don't know if it will be available in Baden, but I used to eat it regularly in Luzern.

I also like their big couches.
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Old 21.11.2011, 23:33
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Re: New Starbucks in Baden

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I think there must be a reason that Starbucks still can not enter in Italian market.. I guess "nobody would pay for a cafe more than 2 Euros with much less taste?`
They first of all are clearly too expensive. And second, as Starbucks is modelled after what Mr Schultz saw in Milano, they may hesitate to enter a market of which they themselves are just an Americanized copy ! However, to say that ... "cannot enter" is wrong, as they at a certain moment WILL enter there. The price-level of a Starbucks-Italia will for sure be much lower than the one of Starbucks-CH
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