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  #81  
Old 14.02.2012, 15:28
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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Not a problem:
The village is Birr, you can find the population link here:
http://www.birr.ch/index.asp?W_ID=2&parent=42
Quote from site:
Der aktuelle Anteil der ausländischen Wohnbevölkerung liegt bei rund 45 %. Die mit der ausserordentlichen Zuwanderung und der vielschichtigen Bevölkerungsstrukur zwangsläufig verbundenen Anforderungen und Probleme konnten weitgehend bewältigt und gelöst werden.
- The rest you can puzzle together by yourself. All links are there.

I am born and raised in Switzerland (Luzern and Zug), pure breed back to the 14th century.
Left Switzerland 1990 and returned early 2010.
Living in South America and the Caribbean.

We of course have contact with the local population, our neighbors are happy with us, calling us the best neighbors they had in the last 50 years.
Though we invited them for dinner and received a denial, so we gave up.
But friends, real friends I count zero.

Quote: - I'm 35, married, single-income, kid is on the way, so that was BS as well
So my description is right. Child on the way doesn't count (yet). BS backwards

Quote: - last time I had dinner with a coupe and two kids: last Saturday. BS.
Nice try, I don't believe it and I don't buy it - Sorry
When the kids getting older, so we can leave them alone, yes then social life starts again. Your couple maybe HAS kids but where coming without kids. Until then, see above...

You will see, the first 6 month with baby will be easy, feed, sleep, shit -circle
During this time your activity will not much be handicapped and you should enjoy it. From 8months to 3-4 years avoid any restaurant besides McDonalds. You're not welcome anymore - just wait, your time will come!

Today is our wedding anniversary (pure incident, not planned) and we will go for Sushi - WITH KIDS - you really should see the eyes of the people sitting in the Restaurant.

Anyway :
Happy father or motherhood and enjoy
time will proof me right...

Now show me your qualification to advise an expat to returning "home"...
Besides of living all your life within your social network...
"Am 31. Dezember 2010 lebten 4179 Menschen in Birr, der Ausländeranteil ist mit 44,4 % rund doppelt so hoch als der kantonale Durchschnitt. Bei der Volkszählung 2000 waren 35,2 % römisch-katholisch, 29,6 % reformiert, 9.0 % christlich-orthodox und 12,0 % muslimisch; 1,1 % gehörten anderen Glaubensrichtungen an. 71,2 % bezeichneten Deutsch als ihre Hauptsprache, 7,2 % Italienisch, 6,7 % Serbokroatisch, 5,2 % Albanisch, 1,6 % Türkisch, 1,3 % Französisch, 1,0 % Spanisch, 0,6 % Portugiesisch."

I'm giving you the 45%. Average in your canton is 22%. You're saying 70% of the kids at school speak serbian / croat. According to the statistics, only 6.7% of
the population speak that language. 72.2% speak German as their main language, followed by 7.2% Italian.

I've lived abroad for several years, btw.

But since you're calling me a liar: du häsch doch schlicht und ergriifend en Dachschade. Wenn's der do nid passt, denn pack doch zäme und gang irgendwo ane, wo'd nid muesch andere an's Bei seiche, will's di z'fescht aschiisst.

regards,

Peter
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  #82  
Old 14.02.2012, 15:58
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

I didn't want to reply, but feel things have gone askew, and will put in my 2 cents.

I, as well, initially thought "don't do it, don't move here" - but really without any facts to base the opinion on. I have never been to Bali, have no idea what it is like, etc. The truth of the matter here is, that we are finally coming out of an extreme cold snap (although this would be normal weather in my former life in Upstate NY) and are a bit cranky!

We moved here last August. Previous to that we were in Germany for 2 years with kids. My husband is German. I have not had problems fitting in here, feel socially accepted, and meeting people. Having 3 kids opens the doors to many other families! No, we haven't had tons of social evenings, but then, that doesn't have to do with being in Switzerland. Now that we are finally settled in our house we will probably have more opportunities, and once the weather is warmer, we will get around to that .

The people in the town and especially the Gemeinde have been very nice and helpful - more so, I would say, than I found in Germany. Perhaps it is because I am not the "typical" American as I do speak German pretty well (forget about Swiss German, though!) so I can communicate ok with the locals. For the OP, this would be my biggest concern, as the language is quite tough (I think at least!) to understand.

Anyways, I guess I don't really have concrete points, just wanted to say that if the situation is right, it can be a good move. This would be true regardless of where you are going. I don't know if I will ever feel at home here like I did in both Germany and the US, but that might be due simply to the fact that I had a reason to be in both of those other countries based on my and my husband's nationality.

By the way, we have been invited over to other people's houses here in Switzerland with all 3 kids in tow - at least 2 times! And, the apartment house near our house invited us to their 6 Dec (Samichlaus?) celebration - kids and all as well...
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  #83  
Old 14.02.2012, 16:21
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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yadi yadi yadi...
I am sorry that Switzerland is not the right place for your taste. A pity that you had a hard time finding a job and that you think the place you moved to is bad.

No problem, as I said is it a pretty extreme culture in my eyes... but deducting from your very specific situation anything on the OP - let alone being as vocal as you are to tell her not to come to Switzerland - is frankly rubbish. Depending on ones education - and the OP mentioned to have studied in Australia - is Switzerland still one of the best job markets in Europe at the moment.

If you were looking for sympathy for your situation... well, go to the complaints corner then and don't screw up perfectly reasonable threads.
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  #84  
Old 14.02.2012, 16:31
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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But since you're calling me a liar: du häsch doch schlicht und ergriifend en Dachschade. Wenn's der do nid passt, denn pack doch zäme und gang irgendwo ane, wo'd nid muesch andere an's Bei seiche, will's di z'fescht aschiisst.

regards,

Peter
dawiz: As you are implying that I might, just, be mistaken: I believe that maybe you are slightly confused. If you do not like it here, might I make the suggestion that you could perhaps travel to some other land where you no longer feel the need to complain because you find everything so depressing. Regards, Peter
(This is a (very) free translation of the Swiss German text in the post ).
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  #85  
Old 14.02.2012, 17:22
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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I believe that maybe you are slightly confused.


A free translation indeed.
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  #86  
Old 15.02.2012, 00:20
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

A-ha, took a long time until I got it, why some think I spoil this threat and why dawiz reacted so angry! Its the Serbian-Croatia language statement, you think it is a racism comment? This is it?
- you so wrong!

Sorry folks, I left Switzerland 1990, we had then some issues with Tamil-Tigers, but the Yugoslav War had not started yet. I miss this whole Yugo-Issue. So for me, the first time I get in contact with this whole "...ic" issue was 2010. I have 9 tenants in my properties, the only one I would trust with the key for my office is an Albanian family, they treat my real estate better then I do. In opposite, the worst tenant is a 38 year old Swiss, drunk in the middle of the day and half of the time the "Gemeinde" pays his rent. I'll celebrate the day he is gone!

So, if you think, this was a racist statement, "so geht es mir am Arsch vorbei", to say it blunt in your language. Then actually you are the moron and prick here by false acquisitions and wrongly pre-judgement.

- chapter closed
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  #87  
Old 15.02.2012, 08:14
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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A-ha, took a long time until I got it, why some think I spoil this threat and why dawiz reacted so angry! Its the Serbian-Croatia language statement, you think it is a racism comment? This is it?
- you so wrong!
No, you simply don't get it: Nobody got wound up by one or two things you said, but about the one hundred things you post here... you describe in extensive details your VERY specific living situation, although they are all completely off topic. Neither the OP nor anyone else cares about the nationalities in your village or house as it has nothing to do with the OPs move to Switzerland. The same about that dinner and the French guys and 90% of the other stuff you post here.

You are very opinionated about certain things from age over kids. NONE of them have anything to do with the question of the OP. You are posting self centered posts in combination with bad and unbalanced advice. If you say that traffic is as bad in Switzerland as everywhere does this only mean that you have not been in Bali...

And since you post so much useless posts do you in fact spoil the thread. The signal to noise ration is down and the thread is a train wreck. A mod could now waste his time to tidy it up and I bet you would go running to the support forum complaining that somebody deleted your posts and that mods are as discriminating as Switzerland...
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Old 20.02.2012, 12:12
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

It does seem to be impossible. I am trying to stay after my two years of student work at the Opernhaus expires. It is very difficult, even as a new citizen of the EU.

I hope I find a new job here, or I am out to another country.

We will see.
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Old 20.02.2012, 22:05
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

Crickey...where to start. sure living in Switzerland can be great. The weather compared to where I am from, the uk is wonderful.
The scenery is amazing, the place is clean but the grass is always greener on the other side.
Given the choice I would have jumped for Bali but it wasn't practical. I have to work as most of us do but given the choice of your weather scenery, people to cook clean and garden....don't expect too much if you come here. Certainly don't burn bridges. come and have a look for a while. From what I have seen the Swiss can be fairly insular and introverted. If you have no French or German it can get very lonely after a while and if you have children the school system is very poor. certainly 20 years behind the uk. theres more but I don't want so sound completely negative, it has many good points too, if it didn't i would still be in the uk. Dont rush in...good luck
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Old 24.02.2012, 00:44
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

Not impossible but be prepared for issues and concentrate on the great advantages to living in central Europe, it's so easy to explore the surrounding countries.
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  #91  
Old 24.02.2012, 18:01
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Wow there's a lot of replies since I've last checked. And who the hell is this "Caribeangeorge" guy? What's his problem?

Anyway...I have an announcement to make!
The hubby and I have decided...YES we are moving to Switzerland!

BUT...we just don't know exactly when yet. We need to plan and sort everything out first. My husband might have to go there first on his own to organize everything there also before the three of us go together.
I am hoping we can move by end of this year or sometime next year. Or even after 2 years at the latest. We still need to finish some things here...

I know a lot of you still think I am crazy for wanting to leave this "paradise" island but you know, I am not being forced to move to Switzerland, I really WANT to! :-)
And the weather, yes the cold SUCKS but hey, get into some warm winter clothes, cozy up and snuggles inside with a hot Caotina...and it makes you appreciate the hot sunny weather more when you go on holidays! Because right now, Bali is so frikkin hot we're all melting. My poor baby boy is so cranky in this extreme heat at the moment.

And another thing, all these things that some of you are complaining about, that is normal everyday things that you should be complaining about. You don't have to worry about undercover immigration dudes going into your bar/restaurant to bust some "bule's" (pronounced "bull-ays" meaning "white people"...) for any little reason to get some extra cash which goes straight in their pockets. In other words, corruption. Bribing....stealing, cheating. Our staff in the restaurant is pretty much busted for cheating the alcohol orders for the bar and he's playing this innocent game, and the "how dare you accuse me?" game and so he quit and is no asking for his salary. But he cannot even explain why there is missing money or bottles.
And another example, the contractor for our restaurant building asked for the rest of his payment so my husband asked him to send him an email listing all the expenses that he already made. The contractor got angry, didn't want to send the email and told everybody that my husband will not pay him the rest of the money. He pretty much twisted the story around. Then he was threatening us that he will go to the police and report my husband so he will get kicked out of the country or he will go to court blablabla... He never did both...because if he went to court then the amount of money left of the payment wouldn't even be enough to pay the lawyer. We've had a few people using this threat "I will go to the police and report you!" because in the end, my husband is just another "bule" and they dont take him seriously and dont give a shit.
Look, i dont even know who is reading this but I dont want to nag on and on about "which country has more problems". It's not a competition but the problems here and in Swiss I think are very different. There are rules there. Everything has a system, it works wether you like it or hate it.

Thanks anyways for all who commented! I enjoyed reading both sides regardless

Our staff in the restaurant is pretty much busted for cheating the alcohol orders for the bar and he's playing this innocent game, and the "how dare you accuse me?" game and so he quit and is NOW asking for his salary. But he cannot even explain why there is missing money or bottles.

Did a typo...I meant now, not "no"

And I will def mention something once I have landed in the land of Swiss! hehe..

Last edited by Longbyt; 24.02.2012 at 18:10. Reason: same poster, consecutive posts
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  #92  
Old 24.02.2012, 18:51
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

Thanks for the update on your decision, mamamila. Good luck!
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Old 28.02.2012, 20:03
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

international schools in switzerland are also very expensive. You may need to pay 2500 CHf a month for a student as young as of 2nd standard.
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Old 28.02.2012, 20:19
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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Wow there's a lot of replies since I've last checked. And who the hell is this "Caribeangeorge" guy? What's his problem?

Anyway...I have an announcement to make!
The hubby and I have decided...YES we are moving to Switzerland!
Well, in the spectrum of expats, he's just someone who is trying to relate how we tend to see things before we move somewhere only to be confronted by a reality previously unconsidered, i.e. if you value an ocean nearby and a wide variety of food and/or going out to eat a lot, CH may not be as ideal as you might be thinking. I'm leaving CH soon, after only a year, and while I'll spare you my litany of reasons, I do think you should consider the quote from your first message very carefully:

Quote:
So anyway, I've told my family about this idea of going to Switzerland and my husband Lars has also talked to his parents about it (his mother just moved to Bali 2 years ago but his dad is still living in Luzern) and they all just seem so pessimist about the idea.
Family. Living in both places. All pessimistic.

I have a sister who has a neighbor who lived in Zurich for 2 years and had a rather negative experience. Of course, she didn't tell me about this until after we moved because she didn't want to be a 'downer' which is a pity. But, family who have the experience and who aren't afraid to be a downer...listen to them.

Good luck whatever you wind up doing.
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Old 28.02.2012, 23:37
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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international schools in switzerland are also very expensive. You may need to pay 2500 CHf a month for a student as young as of 2nd standard.
I think the OP is planning on sending her baby to local schools here, which is very sensible, especially because thats what I plan on doing (and I'm not even Swiss, someone in the family needs to be able to speak the local language!)
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Old 29.02.2012, 02:22
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

I find this sort of discussion rather depressing. I'm a Brit who's been in Switzerland nearly 2 years, and greatly enjoy living here. Sorry if this sounds petulant, but I just don't understand why some expats persist in staying here when they are so evidently miserable.

Is Switzerland perfect? Hell no. Is it better than the UK at present? Hell yes. If I thought otherwise, we'd have moved back 18 months ago. Simple as. What I can't see myself doing is staying here indefinitely, and maintaining a long running internet whine.

I'm a great believer in the "life is what you make it" school of thought. If you're unhappy here, then do something about it. That means one of two things -- move to one of those euphoric paradises that compare so well with the hellish urban swamps of Switzerland; or if you have to stay here, then work out for yourself that if Switzerland isn't going to change to match your requirements, then perhaps you might just need to trim a few edges off your own demands and expectations. Much better than this very public sulk which seems to say: I am too inflexible to cope.
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Old 29.02.2012, 02:26
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

Don't mistake complaining with being unhappy.
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Old 29.02.2012, 02:55
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

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Don't mistake complaining with being unhappy.
And I hope I'm not -- in fact some people seem to be happy only when they are complaining. Doesn't change my opinion though.

It's natural to complain. We all do it to some degree. But just reading this forum over the last few weeks -- sheesh. It's the same old stuff form the same old people. A point comes when you have to put up or shut up.
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Old 29.02.2012, 16:13
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Re: Moving to Switzerland: Impossible??

In the real life, most of us manage on long working hours, having to do the groceries shopping afterwards (although Leshop.ch + local farmers deliver to your door), cleaning our own house, cook our own food and look after the children without any maid or help of any kind. You'll cope!

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Ok so I have been thinking and talking a lot with my husband about moving to Switzerland (we are currently living in Bali, Indonesia..). We have a 10 month old baby boy, Jeremy and we all have Swiss passports so that won't be an issue to go there. I don't speak any Swiss-German unfortunately (my father is from Thun and my mother is Indonesian so my brother, sister and I were all born and raised in Bali and my dad never had the patience to teach us any Swiss-german!)

So anyway, I've told my family about this idea of going to Switzerland and my husband Lars has also talked to his parents about it (his mother just moved to Bali 2 years ago but his dad is still living in Luzern) and they all just seem so pessimist about the idea.

They tell us that it's not easy living there, it's all very expensive, you have to do everything on your own (surprise! here in indonesia you have maids, full-time babysitters, drivers, gardeners, pool cleaners..etc. Any form of help you can think of, its available here in Bali! All very affordable!) but I'm thinking hey, if there are people living in Switzerland already that can do it, why can't we? I went to school in Perth Australia for 4 years and did my own laundry and cleaning up, I lived in Thun in 2007 for half a year and cleaned and washed dishes and I survived! So I think that point is a minor issue.

And the money issue..."its very expensive living in Switzerland!" Ok, YES this is true but my argument is the salary are also fairly high so it balances it out, no? Correct me if I'm wrong please because maybe I am just dreaming and in lala land and not thinking of the reality!

Conclusion: Is it really THAT hard/impossible to move and live in Switzerland coming from Bali, Indonesia?
If we do finally decide to move, it probably won't be for another 1 or 2 years anyway but I just like to plan ahead. We would probably try find a place in Luzern because that's where my husband is from.

Anyway, would love to hear any response and your opinions! Thanks
mila
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