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Old 08.05.2012, 11:06
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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If you look at the location of the people who say the Swiss aren't friendly, they're nearly always in Zurich.

I was outside my flat yesterday evening, in BASEL, changing the inner tube on one bike and putting new tyres on my other one. Three people, three that as far as I'm aware I'd never seen before, gruezi'd me or guten abended me as they walked past. Another (the fourth!) started talking to me. After my usual "sprechen sie English?" she just wanted to know why I had so many flat tyres! I expained that I was just replacing worn out tyres for new ones.

I'm sure if I did this in Zurich they would have spat at me and the SVP stapled something to my forehead.
in Zurich the use of "guten abend" is a crime punishable by 30 lashes with a wet egg noodle.
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  #42  
Old 08.05.2012, 11:23
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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in Zurich the use of "guten abend" is a crime punishable by 30 lashes with a wet egg noodle.
In Bern we use shoelaces.
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  #43  
Old 08.05.2012, 13:23
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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Have been reading this book about Switzerland and it said that getting to know the Swiss is just as hard as breaking through a coconut's outer shell. It further said "In contrast to cautious coconuts, societies in the English-speaking world are all peaches... where every stranger is a potential friend." Based on my experiences so far over here, I find this somewhat true. Anyone else have this same impression?
Yes, Swiss tend to be hard-to-crack coconuts, but those who crack seem never to dry up. It is not easy to make new Swiss friends in proud Helvetia, but once you succeed you will most likely end up with a friend for life.
By the way, have you noticed how many Swiss marry non-Swiss?
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Old 08.05.2012, 13:39
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

I guess some of the Swiss are tired of welcoming expats, foreigners or whatever, helping them to get along with life in this country, the language and the culture just to be waved away after they've done their "duty".
One takes this once or twice but wil eventually leave the foreigners and turn back to their life long friends.
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Old 08.05.2012, 14:17
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

It is very much true,swiss people are nice and polite,but they set naturally a defence for the foreigners.
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  #46  
Old 08.05.2012, 15:05
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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but I thought part of the citizenship test included identifying all of your Swiss friends???
For real? That's weird... I can get along with saying my gruezi's but looks like I'd have to redefine the meaning of "friends"...
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Old 08.05.2012, 15:06
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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Yes, Swiss tend to be hard-to-crack coconuts, but those who crack seem never to dry up. It is not easy to make new Swiss friends in proud Helvetia, but once you succeed you will most likely end up with a friend for life.
By the way, have you noticed how many Swiss marry non-Swiss?
Not really, no. My husband is Swiss but it seems he is the only one in his circle of friends who married a non-Swiss.
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Old 08.05.2012, 16:30
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

So far, I have found the Germans I work with to be the highest potential chance of making a friend with. Whilst they don't tend to conform to stereotypes (they do have a sense of humour) the locals do tend to be a brick wall.

I've lost count of the number of one sided conversations I've had, the "so good weekend?" "yes"...... tumbleweed variety I'm sure some of you recognise.

However that said, you do get the impression that if you can, just get a crack in the shell to work with and get the beginnings of a friend then its going to be a friend for life as someone wrote before.

Couple of points though, around here people are generally good natured, hello, good afternoon etc are common whilst outside doing your chores etc, but it's all superficial.

Second is that I've been told by my colleagues that peoples houses / apartments etc are just off limits, if you want to meet up then suggest a bar, restaurant etc. To us we find it hard to comprehend, but its just not the done thing to invite people around for "a meal" with the possible exception of an apero, but again you've got to know them very well for this. It would appear that they just don't like being in strangers houses.
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  #49  
Old 08.05.2012, 16:30
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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Not really, no. My husband is Swiss but it seems he is the only one in his circle of friends who married a non-Swiss.
It may be that Zurich is different that way. I live in the French-speaking part, and I am surrounded by Swiss friends whose spouses are originally from the USA, the UK, Latvia, Algeria, Vietnam, Brazil, the Philippines, Korea, and various other countries. Thirty years ago, Geneva was pretty much the only truly cosmopolitan Swiss city. I moved to the Lausanne region one year ago, and I was pleasantly surprised by the fact that this town has also become much more international, which seems also to be the case with Neuchatel and with other towns and villages in the region.
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Old 08.05.2012, 16:34
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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Not really, no. My husband is Swiss but it seems he is the only one in his circle of friends who married a non-Swiss.
50% (this message is too short and all that)
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  #51  
Old 08.05.2012, 16:50
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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So far, I have found the Germans I work with to be the highest potential chance of making a friend with. Whilst they don't tend to conform to stereotypes (they do have a sense of humour) the locals do tend to be a brick wall.
I totally agree! Most of the people I made friends with at work are all Germans. When I lived in Germany last year for w while, I was surprised to know that they all find that the Swiss have a "Grenze" or a wall.
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Old 09.05.2012, 00:05
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

Sure I can find hard to crack Swiss folks. But not significantly more so than I have experienced of others at home in their own countries. And allowing for the inherent barriers created by the language and culture gap ... I would say that if anything, I have found the opposite to be true.

My own experience is that the Swiss are just like other folk (Americans, Germans, Brits, Dutch) ... they're uncomfortable speaking a foreign language, often embarrassed at what they feel is a poor level of English (even if it's better than my French.) I find they are generally very relieved (sometimes even impressed) when they hear I speak some french, and grateful when I soldier on in poor French rather than make them speak English. And when I make an effort with them, I find most reciprocate willingly.

They are sometimes grumpy, sometimes shy, sometimes irritated, sometimes cheerful, sometimes willing, sometimes welcoming, sometimes tired. And none of this is related to their being Swiss.

If the purpose of the question is to compare locals with expats, then I think that's a different question. Having made the choice to live in another country, and to enjoy/endure the challenges self selects a subset of the general population. Compare that subset with ANY whole population, and of course there are differences. Not least because the expats, as a group, generally have a greater need to build new relationships than locals who already have plenty, and less appreciation of local language and culture.

I have to admit, I don't really like to see questions/comments (with a specific nationality in them) like this - for the implication (innocent or intentional) behind them.
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  #53  
Old 09.05.2012, 19:19
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

no, not forced! i mean seriously... who on earth thinks that a friendship can be forced? it has to grow! and therefore you need a chance, CHANCES!

i was not desperately bothering swiss people. right from the start i had people here, EF, a GERMAN workmate and from there it took off to more GERMAN mates.

i was connected via work with a swiss that is now my friend and that friendship grew over the time we knew each other, also on private sector. and it was growing by contacting, inviting each other back and forth. as i said he knew i am into movies, he hinted that a certain retrospective was on at "xenix" and if we might have go? i knew he loves berlin and he wanted so badly a certain berlin shirt that i got for him, etc, etc. it was and still is a give n take.

i am just saying that i find the chances i had to develop something with swiss people were there, i tried very very sensible as way before i came here, i was visiting CH many times and knew all the stuff swiss hate and love, what to take care about, say, behave, all the dos n donts. as i said: i moved into this new place, my neighbors were mid-30ies, they moved opposite me, same floor. i was moving into their place.. we bespoke the whole hand-over etc., so we had spoken with each other, we rather had to. i bought them some sprüngli chocolate for letting the delivery guys in and out... i simply tried to be nice, open, running a good connection with each other. but both after the hand-over of my place was done, they turned into cave men. werent seen outside, not heard from the inside. when i met them on the street, tram stop, etc, they felt awkward, turned stiff. didnt knew what to say, even looked away when they thought i dindt see it, so they didnt need to speak to me... both always felt unpleasent. and i dunno why. and this happened with other swiss people, too.

ok via last.fm a swiss girl contacted me. as she thought were having the same musical interest, why not getting in touch? let it be said i had no other intentions than talking about music. i had a GF, she had a BF. fin.
so we met after some mails at frauenbadi, nice eve, it was cool. it was my initiative. we said goodbye, she said would be nice to meet you another time. a couple of weeks later we met, again on my initiative. but this time i met her BF. he was a bassist at a band, quiet successful in heavy metal, especially in asia. thats what i knew. when we entered the mascotte he was there, said hello to her and i was left there, sitting like a pudding observing this circle of friends talking and nobody introduced or talked to me. wtf? gig started. after the gig we said goodbye, she said see you next time. again on my initiative. this time she said meet me in my atelier, as she was painting/is a painter. went there, had some beers with me that i brought along. talked, nice. i left. again she said it was nice talking to you about art, great... mutual interest etc. see you soon?

so 3rd time i called saying i have sneak-prev tix for art zurich. wanna join?
she did, nice eve. all good. next was she asked me if id like to join her as her dad was holding a vernissage of his art at the lenzburg. cool! for sure. we met at HB, she brought her flatmate, flatmates BF, her BF plus a older couple and her mother in law. she said hello when i arrived, the rest said shy hello and that was it. all people knew each other, whole convo went past me... all humble n modest tries to get into it... failed. whole train trip i sat in the middle of them all and everybody was talking to each other. i was left out. hit the spot, walked the aisles n rooms... met her BF. we were alone in this room and started looking at the paintings the same time. i asked him about his band, music... very common stuff, nothing personal. it was a one-way-convo! yes, no, maybe. so i was done with it! i said goodbye n left and never met her again. she even never asked whats up, nothing.

and this is what i mean: yes, people are nice. yes you can have a good connection to/with somebody being swiss. but it is hard to get to know somebody beyond small talk. it takes time, patience, lots of rejections (that you better dont take personal). such incidents like above i have encountered many times. i wont name them again, check my posts and youll find them.

i mean you can ask many of EF that met me in RL that i am anything but desperate, arrogant, selfish, narcisstic etc, etc. i am more curious who "you" are instead of presenting myself too much. i take myself back, especially when meeting a swiss, especially after these encounters, i even tried to behave differently and way too many times i experienced the same shite. you know, when i left germany, Munich (a city that is not known to accept prussians, anybody northern than Nurnberg) people were saying on my farewell party that in 2 weeks im going to know half of Zurich, AS EVER! and i believed it. after 3 months here i was close on giving in, going back until i found the advert sunday 5 a-side footy.

that was the anchor making me feel home again, my weeks highlight. footy, banter...and after uncle max showed up the first also pints n fries at paddys. and i can say that even after we played for like 5-6times i could call any of these lads for helping me with a problem, watching footy, going for a beer... nowadays i am not seeking for acquaintances or friends as i the circle of folks i know led to the fact that i run out of time, that i have way more to do, people to see.

and if you look up the intro-thread or social thread... there are plenty of people looking for friends in Bern, BAsel, Waadt...Ticino. why is this? because swiss are so wellknown for their warm welcome?

again this is my experience, made in Zurich. for sure there are many positive examples out there and i am happy for each of you having made better ones than me.
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  #54  
Old 09.05.2012, 19:50
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

Flow I feel tempted to meet you for a drink but then you would keep coming around like a poodle and that would get on my nerves lol

You come across as a nice guy so in the above example the issue is not with you. There are people like that and they are not all Swissy. I do admit some Swissieos can be strange but then I have to remind myself that I have met similar people from my country too.

People are just strange everywhere man. Don't let it get to you. Continue being yourself and don't change yourself for Swissieos or non Swissieos.
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Old 09.05.2012, 19:51
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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If you look at the location of the people who say the Swiss aren't friendly, they're nearly always in Zurich.

I'm sure if I did this in Zurich they would have spat at me and the SVP stapled something to my forehead.
As far as I know, SVP and Zurich don't get along with each other...

BUT Zurichians can be very unfriendly at times.
Because they DO live in the cooooolest city ever, they overdo it at times...
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  #56  
Old 09.05.2012, 20:33
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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, a GERMAN workmate and from there it took off to more GERMAN mates.

i was connected via work with a swiss that is now my friend and that friendship grew over the time we knew each other, also on private sector. and it was growing by contacting, inviting each other back and forth. as i said he knew i am into movies, he hinted that a certain retrospective was on at "xenix" and if we might have go? i knew he loves berlin and he wanted so badly a certain berlin shirt that i got for him, etc, etc. it was and still is a give n take.

i am just saying that i find the chances i had to develop something with swiss people were there, i tried very very sensible as way before i came here, i was visiting CH many times and knew all the stuff swiss hate and love, what to take care about, say, behave, all the dos n donts. as i said: i moved into this new place, my neighbors were mid-30ies, they moved opposite me, same floor. i was moving into their place.. we bespoke the whole hand-over etc., so we had spoken with each other, we rather had to. i bought them some sprüngli chocolate for letting the delivery guys in and out... i simply tried to be nice, open, running a good connection with each other. but both after the hand-over of my place was done, they turned into cave men. werent seen outside, not heard from the inside. when i met them on the street, tram stop, etc, they felt awkward, turned stiff. didnt knew what to say, even looked away when they thought i dindt see it, so they didnt need to speak to me... both always felt unpleasent. and i dunno why. and this happened with other swiss people, too.

ok via last.fm a swiss girl contacted me. as she thought were having the same musical interest, why not getting in touch? let it be said i had no other intentions than talking about music. i had a GF, she had a BF. fin.
so we met after some mails at frauenbadi, nice eve, it was cool. it was my initiative. we said goodbye, she said would be nice to meet you another time. a couple of weeks later we met, again on my initiative. but this time i met her BF. he was a bassist at a band, quiet successful in heavy metal, especially in asia. thats what i knew. when we entered the mascotte he was there, said hello to her and i was left there, sitting like a pudding observing this circle of friends talking and nobody introduced or talked to me. wtf? gig started. after the gig we said goodbye, she said see you next time. again on my initiative. this time she said meet me in my atelier, as she was painting/is a painter. went there, had some beers with me that i brought along. talked, nice. i left. again she said it was nice talking to you about art, great... mutual interest etc. see you soon?

so 3rd time i called saying i have sneak-prev tix for art zurich. wanna join?
she did, nice eve. all good. next was she asked me if id like to join her as her dad was holding a vernissage of his art at the lenzburg. cool! for sure. we met at HB, she brought her flatmate, flatmates BF, her BF plus a older couple and her mother in law. she said hello when i arrived, the rest said shy hello and that was it. all people knew each other, whole convo went past me... all humble n modest tries to get into it... failed. whole train trip i sat in the middle of them all and everybody was talking to each other. i was left out. hit the spot, walked the aisles n rooms... met her BF. we were alone in this room and started looking at the paintings the same time. i asked him about his band, music... very common stuff, nothing personal. it was a one-way-convo! yes, no, maybe. so i was done with it! i said goodbye n left and never met her again. she even never asked whats up, nothing.

and this is what i mean: yes, people are nice. yes you can have a good connection to/with somebody being swiss. but it is hard to get to know somebody beyond small talk. it takes time, patience, lots of rejections (that you better dont take personal). such incidents like above i have encountered many times. i wont name them again, check my posts and youll find them.

i mean you can ask many of EF that met me in RL that i am anything but desperate, arrogant, selfish, narcisstic etc, etc. i am more curious who "you" are instead of presenting myself too much. i take myself back, especially when meeting a swiss, especially after these encounters, i even tried to behave differently and way too many times i experienced the same shite. you know, when i left germany, Munich (a city that is not known to accept prussians, anybody northern than Nurnberg) people were saying on my farewell party that in 2 weeks im going to know half of Zurich, AS EVER! and i believed it. after 3 months here i was close on giving in, going back until i found the advert sunday 5 a-side footy.

that was the anchor making me feel home again, my weeks highlight. footy, banter...and after uncle max showed up the first also pints n fries at paddys. and i can say that even after we played for like 5-6times i could call any of these lads for helping me with a problem, watching footy, going for a beer... nowadays i am not seeking for acquaintances or friends as i the circle of folks i know led to the fact that i run out of time, that i have way more to do, people to see.

and if you look up the intro-thread or social thread... there are plenty of people looking for friends in Bern, BAsel, Waadt...Ticino. why is this? because swiss are so wellknown for their warm welcome?

again this is my experience, made in Zurich. for sure there are many positive examples out there and i am happy for each of you having made better ones than me.
I hate say this, as I don't mean it to be rude, but you are German aren't you? Possibly the greatest German of ALL TIME. I see you like Morissey, so you can't be bad. But from any Swiss that I have talked to, and there have been a few(let's 90% of them), they think that Germans think of Switzerland as their southern canton.

I mean how many Germans have I talked to since being here have told me they hate the Swiss dialects, they have no culture here, how everything is better in Germany, in the end they always seem to only just like the Swiss money. And I have worked with Germans, I would say most the people I have worked with since being here are from Germany. Although before I say anything else there seems to be a cultural divide between those who come from the west and the east. Eastern Germans seem to be the most difficult to work with.

And again you might be the center of charm and wittiness, but a lot of Germans I have been here with have been very arrogant and dis respectful to the Swiss in general. Maybe they have pre conceived notions about you. I have no idea.

Like every country I have been to there are good apples and bad apples. I don't see how the Swiss are any different. I speak real bad German, and it's true when a conversation is going in full-on German or Swiss German I break up the pace when I edge a few words in of English or of German, but I put myself into the conversation. I never would expect some one to point at me, and say "it's your turn to talk now".

If you want to, I'll have a beer with you. You seem like an interesting fellow. But I think why anyone might have less of what they think are a good time with people they don't know, is more about how they present themselves, and less of what the entirety of a country might see as nationality -wise.
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Old 09.05.2012, 20:52
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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I hate say this, as I don't mean it to be rude, but you are German aren't you? Possibly the greatest German of ALL TIME. I see you like Morissey, so you can't be bad. But from any Swiss that I have talked to, and there have been a few(let's 90% of them), they think that Germans think of Switzerland as their southern canton.

I mean how many Germans have I talked to since being here have told me they hate the Swiss dialects, they have no culture here, how everything is better in Germany, in the end they always seem to only just like the Swiss money. And I have worked with Germans, I would say most the people I have worked with since being here are from Germany. Although before I say anything else there seems to be a cultural divide between those who come from the west and the east. Eastern Germans seem to be the most difficult to work with.

And again you might be the center of charm and wittiness, but a lot of Germans I have been here with have been very arrogant and dis respectful to the Swiss in general. Maybe they have pre conceived notions about you. I have no idea.

Like every country I have been to there are good apples and bad apples. I don't see how the Swiss are any different. I speak real bad German, and it's true when a conversation is going in full-on German or Swiss German I break up the pace when I edge a few words in of English or of German, but I put myself into the conversation. I never would expect some one to point at me, and say "it's your turn to talk now".

If you want to, I'll have a beer with you. You seem like an interesting fellow. But I think why anyone might have less of what they think are a good time with people they don't know, is more about how they present themselves, and less of what the entirety of a country might see as nationality -wise.
There is a general tendency to start apreciating more what you had in your home country, unlessyou don't come from a war or famine zone. It's not just the Germans..
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Old 09.05.2012, 20:54
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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There is a general tenency to start apreciating more what you had in your home country, unlessyou don't come from a war or famine zone. It's not just the Germans..
Yeah, but that wasn't my point
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Old 09.05.2012, 21:27
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

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Yeah, but that wasn't my point
And what was your point if I may ask? flow23 is German therefore he must do something wrong that's why he doesn't have Swiss friends..Please re-read your post. Or whatever, I really don^t care.
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Old 09.05.2012, 21:34
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Re: Are the Swiss really hard to crack like coconuts?

why? I dont think so, swiss ppl is very kind
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