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  #21  
Old 05.09.2012, 14:54
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

Zurich has one of the best car sharing offers in the world by the way (mobility), so even owning a single car might be pointless.
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Old 05.09.2012, 15:00
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

Thank you all for replies.. I will try n get more info from my hubby....
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Old 05.09.2012, 15:08
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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There is a big difference between being enough for one in a tiny flat, and middle class lifestyle for 3 without a having a thrifty frame of mind.

To me Middle Class would mean a 3 bed semi, 2 cars, taxi from the airport, eating out once a week with a baby sitter, and a cleaner 1 morning a week. This is a country where a pair of shoes for a small child cost 70 to 120chf. Go and have a look. Baden is the only place you can get cheap kids clothes, perhaps as it is so close to Germany?

If you are getting a relocation package this will help a lot. Otherwise you are going to need more than a months salary for the deposit and first rent on the apartment for starters. Everything is multiplied up with a family, so unless you are a family of 3 or more, I don't think you are qualified to answer this.
70 to 120 chf for kids shoes? you're shopping in the wrong place.

It may be an apartment rather than a semi but you can surely lead a decent life on this salary. I find it hard to believe that you won't be better off here than London.

and if the kids stuff is too expensive flights back to the UK are not that bad. Visit friends/ family and load up on the clothes while you are at it.
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Old 05.09.2012, 15:20
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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About "eating out once a week with a baby sitter" - I do not think my wife would let me go out once a week with a baby sitter - like the idea though
It's cheaper just getting a 'professional' downtown in the red light district if that's what you're looking for as with all the insurance you have to buy for the babysitter in addition to paying 20-30chf per hour....a hooker is definitely more affordable and you can probably get it charged off to insurance as therapy.

Oh, and don't forget to budget in 400chf to change the lightbulb in your apartment (that still cracks me up...).
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Old 05.09.2012, 15:45
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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It's cheaper just getting a 'professional' downtown in the red light district if that's what you're looking for as with all the insurance you have to buy for the babysitter in addition to paying 20-30chf per hour....a hooker is definitely more affordable and you can probably get it charged off to insurance as therapy.

Oh, and don't forget to budget in 400chf to change the lightbulb in your apartment (that still cracks me up...).
400 for bulb change ??? thats too much
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Old 05.09.2012, 15:47
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Forget about the official exchange rate; think that 9,600CHF net per month in Zürich is equivalent to £4,800 net in UK & how does that compare with your current salary & standard of living.

Wellll its approximately same as what my hubby is getting right now...
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  #27  
Old 05.09.2012, 16:06
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Oh, and don't forget to budget in 400chf to change the lightbulb in your apartment (that still cracks me up...).
Ash - Here is the entertaining thread poptart is talking about: Billed 260CHF to change a light bulb!

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  #28  
Old 05.09.2012, 16:11
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Ash - Here is the entertaining thread poptart is talking about: Billed 260CHF to change a light bulb!

Yes, and if you read the OPs last post it tells you he actually didn't have to pay the money.

Which is damn generous because he behaved like a fool before.
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  #29  
Old 05.09.2012, 16:34
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

Come on why would anybody come on here and ask if they couldn't live on 10,000 a month - 13 months a year? Where are they coming from.. I live an hour out of Zurich by train use a half tax and live on 24,000 a year and I buy my kid shoes and take him out for pizza and I took him on trips plus I have a very small car... depends how one is use to living I guess. But really come on here and ask- oh can I live on 130,000 a year take home... oh....... ! Really!
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Old 05.09.2012, 16:44
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Come on why would anybody come on here and ask if they couldn't live on 10,000 a month - 13 months a year? Where are they coming from.. I live an hour out of Zurich by train use a half tax and live on 24,000 a year and I buy my kid shoes and take him out for pizza and I took him on trips plus I have a very small car... depends how one is use to living I guess. But really come on here and ask- oh can I live on 130,000 a year take home... oh....... ! Really!
Easy for us to say since we already live here. But if you don't live here and you don't know anyone that does, it doesn't seem like such a stupid question. Everyone knows Switzerland is expensive, and I think people often truly believe it takes 250K just to get by.

That said, there are at least 15 threads on EF regarding cost of living in Zürich alone, not to mention the dozens of other threads about cost of living in general. So one should really not have to start a new thread unless their situation is really unique (imho).
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  #31  
Old 05.09.2012, 16:48
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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There is a big difference between being enough for one in a tiny flat, and middle class lifestyle for 3 without a having a thrifty frame of mind.

To me Middle Class would mean a 3 bed semi, 2 cars, taxi from the airport, eating out once a week with a baby sitter, and a cleaner 1 morning a week. This is a country where a pair of shoes for a small child cost 70 to 120chf. Go and have a look. Baden is the only place you can get cheap kids clothes, perhaps as it is so close to Germany?

If you are getting a relocation package this will help a lot. Otherwise you are going to need more than a months salary for the deposit and first rent on the apartment for starters. Everything is multiplied up with a family, so unless you are a family of 3 or more, I don't think you are qualified to answer this.

Well, we are a family of 5, so do I qualify? But, I don't live in expensive Zurich, so maybe not...

And 1x week out to dinner? With babysitter? I don't think hubby and I have done that, since, well, can't remember - maybe 2009? Anyways, to each their own. And you can find good enough shoes at Voegele or Dosenbach for the kids unless you have to have designer. I rarely pay more than 40 CHF for shoes/boots... And clothes can be got for cheap at H&M, C&A, even Manor isn't too bad.

Cleaner 1 morning a week? I need to negotiate my job responsibilities better with my OH...I think I could milk things a little bit more
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  #32  
Old 05.09.2012, 17:25
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Easy for us to say since we already live here. But if you don't live here and you don't know anyone that does, it doesn't seem like such a stupid question. Everyone knows Switzerland is expensive, and I think people often truly believe it takes 250K just to get by.

That said, there are at least 15 threads on EF regarding cost of living in Zürich alone, not to mention the dozens of other threads about cost of living in general. So one should really not have to start a new thread unless their situation is really unique (imho).
A report in the Wall Street Journal came out while I was in the office in New Jersey which stated that you needed to earn at least 300k to live in Zug. I got questions about that. Massive overstatement obviously but there is a LOT of information out there some accurate, some not so much.

I dont think most people are asking can I survive on 120k plus. Its difficult to judge will I be equally well off as what I earn in (insert country of choice). Of course housing is generally a persons major costs so that will dictate so much and housing here is certainly expensive and not necessarily spacious.

Not everyones the same and no one wants to go backwards in standard of living. Of course some things need to change moving here as some things are definitely much more expensive than a lot of other places. e.g. eating out, babysitters etc.
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  #33  
Old 05.09.2012, 17:50
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Give me a break. They are moving to Zurich. No middle class family here is stupid enough to have two cars or take a taxi from the airport to the city. Public transportation system is just to good.

Their basic problem is to find an apartment in Zurich or outside with good S-Bahn connections etc. And those shoes you get cheaper anyway, too, if you just look around a little bit.
Really, you don't get decent toddler shoes cheaper than that, unless you wait for the sales which are not usually timed with your kid's growth spurts. Another tip, don't arrive pregnant or there will be a big problem with insurance. I completely agree with your middle class Zurich example. So a reality adjustment is in fact needed. The OP didn't want to make thrifty decisions, and comes from a middle class UK perspective. Expectations suitably adjusted, I think the salary is good if it is 170k+ gross with benefits.
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Old 05.09.2012, 18:00
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

A salary of 170k plus benefits is indeed good in Zurich because at least 90% don't make that much money here.

What's next? "Can you survive with 300k annually in Zurich?"
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Old 05.09.2012, 18:30
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Really, you don't get decent toddler shoes cheaper than that,
I have a 5 and a half year old. We go to regular shops not even looking for sales and bargains and shoes are not that expensive (for kids). Migros XXSport at Zugerland sell Puma and Adidas shoes more like 30 40chf. Ochsner shoes also have shoes in the 30chf range. All velcro for us at the moment.

I would say adult running shoes are much more of an issue. I see them for over 200chf for the same shoes I see in the USA for 120usd.
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Old 05.09.2012, 18:48
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Come on why would anybody come on here and ask if they couldn't live on 10,000 a month - 13 months a year? Where are they coming from.. I live an hour out of Zurich by train use a half tax and live on 24,000 a year and I buy my kid shoes and take him out for pizza and I took him on trips plus I have a very small car... depends how one is use to living I guess. But really come on here and ask- oh can I live on 130,000 a year take home... oh....... ! Really!
Probably the most sensible post of today !
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  #37  
Old 05.09.2012, 21:08
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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A salary of 170k plus benefits is indeed good in Zurich because at least 90% don't make that much money here.

What's next? "Can you survive with 300k annually in Zurich?"
Well, no, but then again what folks in the US/UK consider as 'middle class' is not the same as Switzerland where most never own their own home (at least in Zurich) content to live in apartment blocks, love hiking in the mountains and don't eat out much at all.

We were in that ballpark of income and, after ~3k/month for the apartment, 2k/month for the school, ~1000/month for groceries, 800/month for health insurances, 200/month for various other insurances, etc. it doesn't leave a whole lot of room for what is 'middle class' by the US/UK measure. When pizza for 4 adults and 1 4yo + 2 beers and a coke rings up to 150chf at a restaurant well outside of the city, it discourages going out very often. When film is 100chf per roll to develop and print, it kills a favorite hobby (which I am delighted to pick up again now that it's under $20/roll with double prints and a cd). You don't have to be broke to be miserable, especially if you aren't keen on hiking the alps or swimming in a lake or most of the other recreational activities that are often mentioned when folks wonder what to do on a dead Sunday.

So, it's not a dumb question to ask, just an impossible one to answer since the much vaunted 'quality of life' metric is different for everyone.

To put it another way, yes, you can survive on that salary though with a far different set of expectations than you might have in the UK as you'll have less money for luxuries and you can probably just forget about owning your own home for a good long while.
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Old 05.09.2012, 21:45
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Well, no, but then again what folks in the US/UK consider as 'middle class' is not the same as Switzerland where most never own their own home (at least in Zurich) content to live in apartment blocks, love hiking in the mountains and don't eat out much at all.

We were in that ballpark of income and, after ~3k/month for the apartment, 2k/month for the school, ~1000/month for groceries, 800/month for health insurances, 200/month for various other insurances, etc. it doesn't leave a whole lot of room for what is 'middle class' by the US/UK measure. When pizza for 4 adults and 1 4yo + 2 beers and a coke rings up to 150chf at a restaurant well outside of the city, it discourages going out very often. When film is 100chf per roll to develop and print, it kills a favorite hobby (which I am delighted to pick up again now that it's under $20/roll with double prints and a cd). You don't have to be broke to be miserable, especially if you aren't keen on hiking the alps or swimming in a lake or most of the other recreational activities that are often mentioned when folks wonder what to do on a dead Sunday.

So, it's not a dumb question to ask, just an impossible one to answer since the much vaunted 'quality of life' metric is different for everyone.

To put it another way, yes, you can survive on that salary though with a far different set of expectations than you might have in the UK as you'll have less money for luxuries and you can probably just forget about owning your own home for a good long while.
Very well put and maybe this belongs to another thread but I find the most discouraging factors are the lack of products, service and everything around the retail and gastronomy sectors. When the Pizza you paid for isn't even good or the waiter (and that happens to me fairly frequently) keeps messing up the order or forgetting an item. I mean, how hard is it to remember a slice of lemon. Bad service is not olny a major factor...it's the general lack of functionability of this country. Nothing seems to work without some sort of malfunction. Went for xrays last week and the computer didn't work, so they couldn't give me a cd....went to the dry cleaner to drop of 2 suits and the machine is broken, so it takes over a week to get my suits cleaned...and it's almost like that with everything. In addition, we're expected to pay through the roof for these inefficiencies...and then they're talking about the excellent quality of life and the country's competitiveness...pah, give me a break!! When I can't even get cough syrup outside of regular business hours and many pharamacies close over lunch time, then I am certain, that this isn't quite the developed nation many people and Mercer make it out to be. To answer the question, is 100+ K enough to live on...certainly, but are you willing to put up with the daily BS, that's a whole different question.
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  #39  
Old 05.09.2012, 21:55
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Re: Need help!! Yet another cost of living query for zurich Switzerland(research done

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Well, no, but then again what folks in the US/UK consider as 'middle class' is not the same as Switzerland where most never own their own home (at least in Zurich) content to live in apartment blocks, love hiking in the mountains and don't eat out much at all.

We were in that ballpark of income and, after ~3k/month for the apartment, 2k/month for the school, ~1000/month for groceries, 800/month for health insurances, 200/month for various other insurances, etc. it doesn't leave a whole lot of room for what is 'middle class' by the US/UK measure. When pizza for 4 adults and 1 4yo + 2 beers and a coke rings up to 150chf at a restaurant well outside of the city, it discourages going out very often. When film is 100chf per roll to develop and print, it kills a favorite hobby (which I am delighted to pick up again now that it's under $20/roll with double prints and a cd). You don't have to be broke to be miserable, especially if you aren't keen on hiking the alps or swimming in a lake or most of the other recreational activities that are often mentioned when folks wonder what to do on a dead Sunday.

So, it's not a dumb question to ask, just an impossible one to answer since the much vaunted 'quality of life' metric is different for everyone.

To put it another way, yes, you can survive on that salary though with a far different set of expectations than you might have in the UK as you'll have less money for luxuries and you can probably just forget about owning your own home for a good long while.
appreciate the post and sentiment but 2 things;

- whether you'll have any spare cash depends on what you were earning in the UK and doing. Obviously some things are bonkers prices and that will change buying behaviour, like we absolutely dine out less here, not because we have to, just because at the high costs we would rather use our money elsewhere. But 170k chf is equal to a xxx gbp salary. the question is whats that number, my guess 100k.

- buying your own place now is super cheap (interest rates) if you can get over the 20% down requirement and find a place you like. There are concerns about possible decreases in house prices but if you're looking to buy and live in a place long term you can get 10 years of "cheap" living.
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