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View Poll Results: I would prefer to live in:
Switzerland 35 50.72%
Germany 14 20.29%
Haven't lived in both so can't say. 20 28.99%
Voters: 69. You may not vote on this poll

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  #41  
Old 11.10.2012, 14:21
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

You should hook up with this guy, you could share war stories...

The supposed Swiss ''quality'' of life

Seriously though, all your carping complaints are helping no one and not yourself either.

Moving somewhere new and foreign, apparently on your own, is bound to be tumultuous.... you have to roll with it and get out there and find the parts you enjoy.

Use ... your... imagination a little bit!

Granted, autumn may not be the best time to arrive (dull and grey and getting dark), but the ski season is just around the corner, and summer is really a nice time here too.

Give it time or, if you really are that impatient, go home.
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  #42  
Old 11.10.2012, 14:32
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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...
... this is a Swiss forum
You really think that?


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I'd pick Italy over Germany any day.

Better wine, better food, better beer, better women, better language, better motorcycles.
...
I would, too,

but this - again - is easy talking.


Depends a lot upon where exactly you make the comparison with, what's the OP's situation (Enough money to live without a job? Does he speak the language, ...).

E.g. Southern Italy is nice, without some dough and/or a good job I would doubt that a bit, however.


Regarding the alcohol and smoke stuff:

True that in Germany you might have a lower portion of smokers in the population, the question is if you have a lower portion of them in the specific ambiente OP is familiar with and refers to.

True also that in a direct comparison already in Northern Switzerland there are much more beer drinking persons in the public than e.g. in Ticino or in Italy, however the portion of normal people who have some wine with their lunch and than go home by car is far higher in the South, in France and probably Spain than in other "public drunken"-countries like GB, Scandinavia, the Netherlands or Germany. I don't know what I prefer, probably the drunken (but non-driving) youth or persons with social problems in the open.


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I don't know about that... some of the local German dialects I came across while living in Germany were much more difficult to understand than the Swiss dialects. Most Germans do not speak "HJochdeutsch". High German comes from up north. Babisch, gell?
No, it comes from the South (the "upper" Germany) or the Middle, not from the North.

And OP has a good point that German in Germany is much easier than Swiss German and High German in Switzerland.


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I prefer Zurich to Berlin, but I prefer Brussels to Zurich.
For me it's just the opposite: Boy, do I dislike Brussels (and I'm pro EU) as a place (I had to lol when it was rumored Arnault fleeing Hollande's Paris). Which shows it depends a lot upon what one is looking for, what's his situation, his interests, ...

OP, you cannot say scenery is good in CH as this is not true for most places where the major part of the Swiss population lives (i.e. Mittelland),

and of course if someone likes skiing Switzerland is better. If you have a good job, Zurich is better than Berlin; if you want a big town, Zurich is a village by comparison.

Last edited by Bucentaure; 11.10.2012 at 14:43.
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  #43  
Old 11.10.2012, 14:32
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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I'd pick Italy over Germany any day.

Better wine, better food, better beer, better women, better language, better motorcycles.
Better broke.
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  #44  
Old 11.10.2012, 14:38
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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Orderlies, fetch the straight-jacket please.

Lived and worked in Brussels for over three years. Best thing about it is the Eurostar that gets you to civilization in under two hours.

I am not into comparisons but Brussels is very ordinary. A dull, flat, dour version of Switzerland without any of the Swiss upside.

There's only two things I hate in this world. People who are intolerant of other people's cultures and the Dutch
Yeah. The Belgians don't like the Dutch either. Luckily there aren't that many Dutch in Belgium.

I loved living in Brussels. It's a lovely, warm, cozy, friendly and incredibly quirky place. It's true that you really have to look to find hidden treasures. It's not the best place for those who love the great outdoors.

I love living here too. You can't compare though. I liked both places for different reasons.
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  #45  
Old 11.10.2012, 14:47
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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Yeah. The Belgians don't like the Dutch either. Luckily there aren't that many Dutch in Belgium.
...
Only half of the population.


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I loved living in Brussels. It's a lovely, warm, cozy, friendly and incredibly quirky place. It's true that you really have to look to find hidden treasures. It's not the best place for those who love the great outdoors.
...
I hate BXL's segregation, private streets, loads of police force to surveiller the property of the rich, extreme opposites (e.g. Uccle - Gare du Nord, Schaerbeek), social problems, the damn language fights (far worse than in any place in CH), ....

Horrible place, imho, that town without name.
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  #46  
Old 11.10.2012, 15:12
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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I honestly have no idea where you're coming from with the language point. as a native English speaker, both German and Swiss German are incredibly complex and difficult to learn, so I don't know why anybody would think that German is any easier to learn and master than Swiss German. .....
IMO if you bother to try Swiss German is easier. Much simpler grammar - der and die are the same and they only bother about a couple of tenses.
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  #47  
Old 11.10.2012, 15:14
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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In between the rain showers.
Belgian chocolate is great, though.
And beer.

And cheese.

And mussels.

Lots of good and varied restaurants in Brussels too, as well as bars.

And great public transport.

Tom
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  #48  
Old 11.10.2012, 15:19
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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I am wondering if anyone here has lived in both countries before? If so, can you please state which country you prefer and why?

Some things I personally consider:

Switzerland

- Expensive
- Lack of variety/options when eating out
- Huge number of smokers
- Difficult to make friends
- Poor customer service
- More difficult to learn German, hard to understand Swiss German

+ Awesome scenery
+ Lots of outdoor activities, eg hiking, skiing, water sports
+ Not many binge drinkers
+ Excellent quality water
+ Very low crime rate
+ Excellent public transport

Germany (based on just visiting)

- More binge drinkers
- Louder than Switzerland
- Not as great scenery
- Public transport not great

+ Much cheaper
+ More variety/options when eating out
+ Possibly easier to make friends?
+ Much fewer smokers
+ Easier to learn German and understand others

Everyone talks about the great quality of life in Switzerland, but to be honest I'm actually a little disappointed after living here. I am starting to wonder if i'd feel more at home living in Germany. The only thing I would miss here is the nature and scenery. If it weren't for all the awesome nature/scenery here, i'd move to Germany in a second.
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To be honest, I actually prefer most Germans to the Swiss. They seem to be more laid back and easy going.

For example, one time in Konstanz I was waiting for the ferry and two guys who work on the ship (where you walk in) were joking around and throwing ice at each other while they waited for the ship to depart. Everyone watched and thought it was rather amusing.

Can you ever imagine two SBB officers joking around like this? The swiss are extremely serious, and especially don't like to joke around in the workplace.

I think Germany is a little more culturally similar to Australia compared to Switzerland.
Ok, you have been here 1 month, right? Is this the first time living outside your native land? Anywhere new is full of comparisons...

I have lived in Germany for almost 8 years in 2 stints, Switzerland now for just over a year. I am finally starting to really feel like CH is my home, made all my mistakes the first year and now know what is expected and feel more comfortable here.

In my experience, Swiss officials are MUCH nicer and more flexible than Germans - and very friendly and helpful. Others may have had the exact opposite experience. "German" Geman is much easier for me to understand, communicate in, etc... Binge drinkers? Haven't really experienced it as being a problem either place, and I have even been to Okotberfest. At least the drunks I have come across do not act violent, just the normal dumb. It felt easier for me to fit in in Germany, but my OH is German (as are the kids) so that makes a difference. I do feel that there is more breathing room and (I can't believe I am sayings this) better shopping in DE.

Germans are more like Austrians? Interesting. Are you talking Bavarians or Northern Germans? 'cause I don't see the similarity for Germans as a whole.

In summary, where would I prefer living? Where the job and family are, right now it is Switzerland! Where is it "easier" for me to live, probably Germany, but ask me again after I have been in CH for 8 years...
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  #49  
Old 11.10.2012, 15:22
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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Only half of the population.
Um, don't tell the Flemish that.


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I hate BXL's segregation, private streets, loads of police force to surveiller the property of the rich, extreme opposites (e.g. Uccle - Gare du Nord, Schaerbeek), social problems, the damn language fights (far worse than in any place in CH), ....

Horrible place, imho, that town without name.
Huh? There. Irrefutable proof that I live in a parallel universe.
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  #50  
Old 11.10.2012, 15:45
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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Irrefutable proof that I live in a parallel universe.
You got the message. There are as many of those parallel universes as living human beings on this planet (you, Belgian Mum, St2lemans love BXL, others hate it).

I don't think this thread is useless (some info regarding some aspects is given), however it's the individual situation to make a place fit with a person's expectation or needs in question.

All we know of OP is his obsession with smokers (I mean, it's a choice, and it's a clear message, better than nothing), not much of the rest (scenery? restaurants? Guess this is important to OP, too, but probably this is already quite bias as we don't know what he likes or dislikes, apart the smoke thing). So no idea if somebody was of help eventually.

Well I remember he has kids (standing in that queue the smokers had invaded with their contamination, remember?). Kids life in CH is not an easy thing, imho (schooling system, mother's help, e.g.).
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  #51  
Old 11.10.2012, 15:53
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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And great public transport.
Except for when they cause a train wreck with 8 people dead and 12 injured because two morons couldn't agree in which language to communicate.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/P%C3%A9crot_rail_crash
and http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/1251789.stm
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But the audio recording shows that, minutes before, a clearly agitated French-speaking signalman rang his Flemish-speaking colleague at the next station, asking him to stop the passenger train. The second signalman is then heard saying: "I don't understand you, can't you speak Flemish?"
The French-speaker says "Wait", and later appears to hang up
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  #52  
Old 11.10.2012, 15:58
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

I'm voting for Germany. I don't visit www.toytowngermany.com but I think the OP should
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  #53  
Old 11.10.2012, 16:16
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

Whether Germany or Switzerland is better also depends on the personal circumstances.
Most things are much cheaper in Germany, including houses and rent.
But you also earn less.
So, from a financial point of view, you have to do the math and see if the money you might save with health-insurance, rent and food offsets the (substantial) salary reduction you will most likely occur.
And while a decent house with a decent size of land attached can be bought in Germany for a lot less, due to the demographic development, it's also more than likely to still decline in value (sometimes significantly) in the next twenty years, when all the houses of the post-war generation come onto the market (and nobody is buying).

As for the people: I'm not sure if there's that much difference. It's probably overblown in the media. That's also part of the problem: there is not much difference (apart maybe for a perceived willingness to work for a less-than stellar income), or companies wouldn't hire us Germans by the bus-load...hence certain animosities described in that other recent thread....

Scenery and locally brewed beer can be had in Bavaria, while North- and North-Eastern Germany offer a beautiful coastline (recommended in the summer).
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  #54  
Old 11.10.2012, 16:22
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I'm Swiss (from Ticino) and I have been living in Zürich for 3 years now (hence also an "expat" in my own country J). Previously, I lived in Germany for a year. I went to Cologne for 3 months to learn German with a huge aversion for the language and the culture, or at least what I thought German culture was, assuming there is no difference between Swiss German and German culture. I was totally wrong. After living a few weeks in Germany I started to meet locals and made a lot of friends. 3 months became over a year and my German became fluent.

I totally understand where you are coming from and I would recommend you going to Germany to learn German. You can pick up the language in everyday situations, which is not possible in Zurich. In addition, you wont feel foreign if you go to a major city like Cologne, Hamburg, Munich or Berlin. However, if you indent to come back to Switzerland, its going to be even more difficult to do that once you have experienced life in a German city. But at least on the language side you will have a better basis to start understanding Swiss German.
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  #55  
Old 11.10.2012, 16:26
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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I learned the pigeon speak in Hawaii which was fun for 3 years but absolutely useless
For whose not familliar...
Pigeon:
Quote:
Eh brah! You dat haole guy eh? I seen you ovah deah wit dakine dem, chillin' an' checkin' out da shreddin' lefts at sandy's.

Primo, chance, 'em!

Kden, latahs brah!

@'
English Translation:
Quote:
Hello. Are you that Caucasian gentleman I saw with your regular group of friends at Sandy's beach watching the surfers ride big waves?

Have you tried Primo beer? It's good.

See you later.

@' <--- hang loose hand gesture
It takes a good 10 years to understand their dialect, and another 10 to speak it without sounding like you're trying to speak it.

Just some random blah blah from this side. =)

Kden.
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  #56  
Old 12.10.2012, 10:34
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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For whose not familliar...
Pigeon:
English Translation:
It takes a good 10 years to understand their dialect, and another 10 to speak it without sounding like you're trying to speak it.

Just some random blah blah from this side. =)

Kden.
10 years?... nah... 1st year there I picked it up, very friendly peeps to hang with and teach me... and I do like learning languages, spent a few hours with my future job site Kollegen yesterday afternoon and by the end of the day I was understanding most of what was said in their dialect.
I'd say for people that have trouble learning languages... 10 years... but pigeon is a lazy language, that's what makes it fairly easy to pick up...

oh... you forgot shaka'bra with the hand gesture
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Old 12.10.2012, 10:37
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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I'm voting for Germany. I don't visit www.toytowngermany.com but I think the OP should
Oh awesome! I have never seen that forum... wish I would have known about it while I was living in Germany
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  #58  
Old 12.10.2012, 10:50
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

Germans tend to be scruffier, fatter and uglier than Swiss people (at least in the cities), so I find it a very comfortable country to visit as I can blend in better.

Having said that, if I wanted to be surrounded by scruffy, fat and ugly people, I'd just move back to England.

As others have suggested, it's an entirely personal decision.
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Old 12.10.2012, 13:26
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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Germans tend to be scruffier, fatter and uglier than Swiss people (at least in the cities), so I find it a very comfortable country to visit as I can blend in better.

Having said that, if I wanted to be surrounded by scruffy, fat and ugly people, I'd just move back to England.

As others have suggested, it's an entirely personal decision.
Yep, smoking cigarettes will usually keep you slim. This is explains why so many swiss are slim.
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Old 12.10.2012, 13:30
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Re: Switzerland or Germany a better place to live?

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Yep, smoking cigarettes will usually keep you slim. This is explains why so many swiss are slim.
Smoking AND a healthy life style.
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