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  #201  
Old 18.06.2013, 15:52
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

No, the Swiss government needs to do is counter-sue the US government for trying to unduly influence a sovereign nation to break their own constitutionally mandated laws.

What America doesn't realise yet, though some in the government like Senator Rand Paul are waking up to the fact, is that they've let loose a monster. Other countries are looking for the same exchange of info that America wants and eventually America is also going to have to comply. It's going to cost them billions to bring in the same sort of system that they're pressing other countries to use now. They've given the rest of the world the idea and now, whether FATCA gets repealed or not, a global exchange of tax info IS coming and America is just going to have to suck it up and live with the consequences of their actions.
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  #202  
Old 19.06.2013, 20:48
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics...l?cid=36198434

So the proposed bill is dead - so what happens now?
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  #203  
Old 19.06.2013, 21:00
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

Good question. The can of worms is opened and everybody will want a piece of the pie

If the US keeps the pressure on the international banking community, the US economy will feel the pressure before it finds a compromise.

BTW, I have it from a fairly good source, that there will soon be a report on SRF TV regarding US persons, their bank accounts in Switzerland and the effects. Not yet sure which show or the date. Maybe next week I can offer more details... will let you know here.
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  #204  
Old 20.06.2013, 08:45
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics...l?cid=36198434

So the proposed bill is dead - so what happens now?
Party!

Tom
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  #205  
Old 20.06.2013, 10:57
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics...l?cid=36198434

So the proposed bill is dead - so what happens now?
They have to vote on it once more before it's truly, officially, completely dead. And there's a (very slim) chance that Widmer-Schlumpf can scare the Nationalrat into following the Ständerat's example by also bowing to the unilateral demands of Washington.
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  #206  
Old 20.06.2013, 11:39
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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So the proposed bill is dead - so what happens now?
According to this lawyer, indictments will likely go ahead against some dozen or so banks and individuals involved as well. A bit too much of the imperial american view of things in my estimation, but a view nontheless.

http://worldradio.ch/wrs/shows/natio...ex.shtml?36185
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  #207  
Old 20.06.2013, 11:43
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/swiss_ne...l?cid=36208750

Tom
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  #208  
Old 20.06.2013, 13:01
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

Council of States has adopted it.

http://www.bluewin.ch/fr/index.php/1...ws/suisse/sda/
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  #209  
Old 20.06.2013, 13:54
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

Yes, more than a week ago (June 12)!

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/business...l?cid=36135000

Tom
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  #210  
Old 20.06.2013, 13:58
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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Council of States has adopted it...
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Yes, more than a week ago...
...which is irrelevant, since the Nationalrat rejected it.

Now they'll both vote on it again. Unless they both adopt it second time around, it's dead in the water.
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  #211  
Old 20.06.2013, 14:32
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

Which is what the Council of States did THIS MORNING. That report is dated today, not last week. At least that's my reading of it. Given that they only have until end of play tomorrow I don't think they're going to waste the little time they have left.
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  #212  
Old 20.06.2013, 14:45
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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Which is what the Council of States did THIS MORNING...
If they already did their 2nd vote, then they merely repeated their earlier performance, which is no surprise. Now it's up to the Nationalrat to vote a second time too. If they change their no to a yes, it's a go. But if they vote no again, it's all over, and the thing has been killed.
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  #213  
Old 20.06.2013, 15:41
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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...which is irrelevant, since the Nationalrat rejected it.

Now they'll both vote on it again. Unless they both adopt it second time around, it's dead in the water.
They both have already voted twice:

"For the second time in as many days, the House of Representatives on Wednesday rejected a government-sponsored bill which would have paved the way for the Swiss banks suspected of helping wealthy Americans evade taxes to take part in a US programme to come clean with their past."

http://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/politics...l?cid=36198434

Tom
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Old 20.06.2013, 16:43
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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They both have already voted twice...
Sorry, I obviously missed that — didn't expect the 2nd votes to take place so quickly.

So... Party time!
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  #215  
Old 21.06.2013, 12:34
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

Depends if you have shares in the banks affected:

http://www.thelocal.ch/20130620/swis...-usa-rejection
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Old 21.06.2013, 13:28
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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No problem. Honestly this tactic reminds me of when the U.S. Congress passed the mammoth healthcare bill. Wasn't Pelosi quoted as saying "We have to pass it to see what's in it" or something like that?

Yes, it was Nancy Pelosi...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hV-05TLiiLU
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Old 21.06.2013, 14:11
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

Hi
I have just renounced my US Citizenship in Berne. All the paper's say, that from now on, I will be treated as any other alien.
So whenever this whole situation has quiet down (I'm still very young, I hope, the US will Change untill I'm in my 60ies and ready to spend my days Golfing in Florida... )
I still have my imediate Family in the US. So if I'm treated like any other Alien, I can get a Visa, filing the I-130 Form for a Green card for alien relatives?
Is this right? I mean, can I just go ahead and do that?
It seems like this whole renounciation thing is not thought trough entirely... They state, that have to contact IRS. OK, When? If theres no deadline, I can just call them a day before my 80iest Birthday and ask them if they'd like some money now, or what?
So I'm wondering if there still are ways to get back, like any other alien, aquiring a green card through Job, Money, Family, Lottery,....

Thanks for helping me out!
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  #218  
Old 21.06.2013, 15:06
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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Hi
I have just renounced my US Citizenship in Berne. All the paper's say, that from now on, I will be treated as any other alien.
So whenever this whole situation has quiet down (I'm still very young, I hope, the US will Change untill I'm in my 60ies and ready to spend my days Golfing in Florida... )
I still have my imediate Family in the US. So if I'm treated like any other Alien, I can get a Visa, filing the I-130 Form for a Green card for alien relatives?
Is this right? I mean, can I just go ahead and do that?
It seems like this whole renounciation thing is not thought trough entirely... They state, that have to contact IRS. OK, When? If theres no deadline, I can just call them a day before my 80iest Birthday and ask them if they'd like some money now, or what?
So I'm wondering if there still are ways to get back, like any other alien, aquiring a green card through Job, Money, Family, Lottery,....

Thanks for helping me out!
Boy, are you naive. You are supposed to file any outstanding back taxes once you've renounced, young or old, and you certainly can't wait until you're 80. You must be tax compliant for the last 6 years for FBAR filing (Foreign Accounts which I assume you have) by this time next year, paying any tax due, so you can file a 8854 form and be sure that your renunciation can't be revoked on tax evasion grounds. It hasn't happened yet, but there's always a first time.

Yes, at the moment you can apply for a green card, though why you'd want to after just renouncing beats me. You have the same chance as anyone else in getting one - but there are some people in the government who want to see renouncers/relinquishers banned for life from ever setting foot on US soil again. Also bear in mind that if you turn around and apply for a green card straightaway it might be seen that you didn't really want to give up US citizenship and the renunciation will be revoked and any outstanding taxes/penalties applied.

Yes, you should be able to apply for a visa to visit just like anyone else, but there have already been reports of some people being turned back at the border:

http://thetaxtimes.blogspot.ch/2012/...forcement.html

Frankly, if you want to live/work in America, you should have stayed American. Why did you renounce in the first place?
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  #219  
Old 21.06.2013, 15:14
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

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It seems like this whole renounciation thing is not thought trough entirely... They state, that have to contact IRS. OK, When?
Looks more like you went through the renunciation process without thinking.

There are dozens of references online. If you don't know what to do before and after making such a decision and going through with it... Nobody to blame but yourself.

Look up IRS Form 8854. Remember, like MF said, you have to be IRS reporting compliant for a number of years before sending the Form 8854 with your CLN. You have your CLN yet?
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  #220  
Old 21.06.2013, 15:37
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Re: Giving up the blue passport because of FATCA - one member's experience

Looking for some extra input on this one. We watched the SRF news last night and they had a report on a vote in Bern. Something about adopting FATCA? OH didn't explain it very well because he didn't see the whole piece.

Basically he said it's the first non-Swiss law that will be effective here, and that the way the vote was done, if the U.S. makes changes to the law in the future, those changes automatically take effect here, regardless of Swiss law. Anyone have a better sense of what really happened and what it means??
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