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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #8881  
Old 23.04.2017, 22:48
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Couple of quick points:

-- There were no "promises" made on deliverables because everything is subject to negotiations which haven't even started yet, never mind concluded.

-- There were certainly no promises made by "her party" as it was a free vote. Most prominent Tories campaigned to Remain, but there was no party line at all.

-- "Customs union" wasn't even mentioned in any of the campaigning, that I can recall. Certainly nothing that hit the headlines.

-- The EU have made it very clear that they are not going to allow the UK to remain in the single market, so it's pointless stating that this is an aim. They aim to get the best deal, as in any negotiation. If they allow us to keep some of the single market advantages, that would be nice, but it seems unlikely from what they've said.

-- There will be a limit on EU immigration, for sure, but again this has to be negotiated. Most likely is a normal non-EU model where you recruit from outside the country when the position cannot be filled locally at the going rate.

-- 2020 election date was nothing to do with the Brexit campaign. Labour forced her hand when they recently stated that they would vote against any deal in 2019 (by insisting on conditions they know are unachievable). It would need only 5 or 6 Tories to vote with the opposition, and this is likely as there are already that number who remain publicly opposed to the UK leaving. It's an open invitation for the EU side to drive an even worse bargain for the UK, as this will increase the chances of it being rejected in the Commons. If (and it's still an if) May is returned with a much bigger majority, then the pressure is greatly reduced.

As for promises kept, obviously Article 50 at end of March is the big one. Everything else is still pending the negotiations.
"There were no "promises" made on deliverables" Campaign promises are still promises.

Vote Leave was an organisation that campaigned for a Leave vote in the United Kingdom European Union membership referendum, 2016.
On 13 April 2016, Vote Leave was designated by the Electoral Commission as the official campaign in favour of leaving the European Union for the referendum on EU membership.[2]

Vote Leave was funded by former Conservative treasurer Peter Cruddas.

Some Campaign promises from the Leave campaign.
  • There is a free trade zone stretching from Iceland to the Russian border. We will still be part of it after we vote Leave.
  • Immigration will continue to be out of control putting public services like the NHS under strain
  • The EU costs us $350 million per week, enough to build a new fully staffed NHS hospital every week
  • We should spend our money on priorities like the NHS, not the EU

Source
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  #8882  
Old 23.04.2017, 23:09
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Wilbur Ross, United States Secretary of Commerce, says EU, Japan and China in competition to show willingness for trade deal.
Donald Trump’s top trade official has opened the door to reviving negotiations with the EU but warned the bloc it would be in competition with China and Japan to show willingness to do the first deal with the new US administration.
Source (ft. might be behind a paywall).

So UK is not even on the radar any more.

Maybe in four or five years after TTIP is signed off we can start talking to the US about a trade deal?

Wilbur Ross also said "Clearly at some point we need to do something with Europe,” he said. “It seems a little weird that a car being shipped from Mexico to Europe pays no tariff as they have a bilateral [agreement with the EU] and a car being shipped from the US pays the full tariff.”
"
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  #8883  
Old 26.04.2017, 00:00
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The Home Office is using its website and an email alerts system to try and avoid a rush of applications from European Union nationals for permanent residency ahead of Britain's departure from the European Union.
New guidance published on the Home Office website earlier this month tells EU nationals that "you do not need to do anything as a result of Article 50 being triggered,"
If I were an EU national living in UK I would apply immediately for permanent residency instead of trusting that something good might happen in the future.

Demonstrates the lack of UK preparation for this situation.
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  #8884  
Old 26.04.2017, 00:41
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Britain will have to pay into the EU budget up until 2020 if it wants Europe to grant the UK reasonable terms on a Brexit transition deal, senior sources in Whitehall have told The Telegraph.

Source

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  #8885  
Old 26.04.2017, 00:44
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Campaign promises are still promises.
You're mixing up the referendum campaign with party elections. In the latter, there are manifestos that are indeed formal lists of pledges, undertakings -- "promises" if you will.

The referendum had no manifestos because neither campaign had the authority to implement a manifesto. The government party, the Tories, made it very clear that there was no official government line. It was a free vote.

In fact the figurehead MPs of both campaigns (Remain -- Cameron/Osborn; Leave -- Boris/Gove) were all from the same party!

The list you provided is simply an arbitrary selection of statements made in TV shows and elsewhere over the course of the campaign. As you well know, it would be easy to produce a similarly controversial list from the other side of the argument.

BTW, the vote actually took place nearly a year ago now. Maybe it's time to stop bickering about he said-she said. Brexit means Brexit.
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  #8886  
Old 26.04.2017, 00:51
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Britain will have to pay into the EU budget up until 2020 if it wants Europe to grant the UK reasonable terms on a Brexit transition deal, senior sources in Whitehall have told The Telegraph.
It doesn't need "senior sources" surely? I'm presuming that we have an agreement to pay the £350m a week (£270m net) for as long as we are members of the EU, as we still are. All we've done with A50 is officially announce our decision to leave. AFAIK, we formally leave at the end of the negotiation period. I guess that's when payments will cease, in 2019/20.
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  #8887  
Old 26.04.2017, 01:24
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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You're mixing up the referendum campaign with party elections. In the latter, there are manifestos that are indeed formal lists of pledges, undertakings -- "promises" if you will.

The referendum had no manifestos because neither campaign had the authority to implement a manifesto. The government party, the Tories, made it very clear that there was no official government line. It was a free vote.

In fact the figurehead MPs of both campaigns (Remain -- Cameron/Osborn; Leave -- Boris/Gove) were all from the same party!

The list you provided is simply an arbitrary selection of statements made in TV shows and elsewhere over the course of the campaign. As you well know, it would be easy to produce a similarly controversial list from the other side of the argument.

BTW, the vote actually took place nearly a year ago now. Maybe it's time to stop bickering about he said-she said. Brexit means Brexit.
"The list you provided is simply an arbitrary selection of statements made in TV shows and elsewhere over the course of the campaign."

No! You did not read what I wrote.
As I stated the list I provided came from "Vote Leave". They were designated by the Electoral Commission as the official campaign in favour of leaving the European Union.

"Vote Leave" provided a list of reasons on their web site to vote for Leave; this is the list I posted, nothing to do with TV shows and not arbitary.

"Brexit means Brexit" Good you finished your post with this meaningless quote; currently nobody knows what Brexit means.

You are the one who is confused; "Vote Leave" were the official campaign and provided their official list
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  #8888  
Old 26.04.2017, 02:41
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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If I were an EU national living in UK I would apply immediately for permanent residency instead of trusting that something good might happen in the future.
+1

And I'd say the same for any U.K. citizens in Europe, people for citizenship, Irish passports etc.
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  #8889  
Old 26.04.2017, 15:37
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

If i were a UK national living in the UK, I would apply for permanent residency somewhere other then the UK.
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  #8890  
Old 26.04.2017, 15:43
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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If i were a UK national living in the UK, I would apply for permanent residency somewhere other then the UK.
Duh, if you're a UK national living in the UK, it's pretty hard to do without some sort of ancestry claim. Usually you have to live in the country you want to get permanent residency in and to have done so for several years.
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  #8891  
Old 26.04.2017, 15:55
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Well my adult daughter have dragged their feet for many years, as they could come and go as they pleased and the impetus was just not there - but since last June- they have suddenly felt the need to ensure they, their spouses and children- have their dual citizenship too- ready to make that jump if Brexit goes t*ts up. They are all set.

The only joy to come out of this debacle.
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  #8892  
Old 26.04.2017, 16:25
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Duh, if you're a UK national living in the UK, it's pretty hard to do without some sort of ancestry claim. Usually you have to live in the country you want to get permanent residency in and to have done so for several years.
I know, it was a play on words. See the post before it.
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  #8893  
Old 26.04.2017, 21:23
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Westminster means losing proposition for Ukip bosses

Switch from European Parliament (MEP) to Commons (MP) means annual drop of £55,000 in salary and benefits-
Full list of UKIP MEPs; Margot Parker, Patrick O'Flynn,Stuart Agnew,Tim Aker, Gerard Batten, Jonathan Arnott, Paul Nuttall,Louise Bours, David Coburn, Nigel Farage,Ray Finch, William Dartmouth,Julia Reid, Nathan Gill, Jill Seymour,James Carver,Roger Helmer, Jane Collins,Mike Hookem
Source

I am sure all the UKIP MEPs will ignore their financial risks and stand as UK MPs.
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  #8894  
Old 27.04.2017, 08:55
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I am sure all the UKIP MEPs will ignore their financial risks and stand as UK MPs.
All alight, the UKIP Euro gravy train has hit the buffers!

Don't you just hate all those foreign scroungers, living of taxpayers' money, in Brussels.
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Old 27.04.2017, 12:10
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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All alight, the UKIP Euro gravy train has hit the buffers!

Don't you just hate all those foreign scroungers, living of taxpayers' money, in Brussels.
I thought each set of MEPs lived of their own taxpayers
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  #8896  
Old 27.04.2017, 12:18
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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I thought each set of MEPs lived of their own taxpayers
http://www.europarl.europa.eu/meps/en/about-meps.html


Would seem they all get the same salary, from the EU pot. They get taxed in their own country though.


The monthly pre-tax salary of MEPs under the single statute is €8,484.05 as of 1.7.2016. The salary comes from Parliament's budget and is subject to an EU tax and insurance contributions, after which the salary is €6,611.42. Member States may also subject the salary to national taxes. The basic salary is set at 38.5% of the basic salary of a judge at the European Court of Justice.
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  #8897  
Old 27.04.2017, 12:27
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Another poll

Quote:
A majority of British voters believe Brexit was the wrong decision, according to a new poll taken 10 days after Theresa May called a snap election.

The YouGov/Times survey found 43 per cent of voters believe Britain was right to vote to leave the EU.
Source
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  #8898  
Old 27.04.2017, 15:25
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

EU trade commissioner says bloc will do post-Brexit free trade deal with UK 'for sure'
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  #8899  
Old 27.04.2017, 15:28
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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All alight, the UKIP Euro gravy train has hit the buffers!

Don't you just hate all those foreign scroungers, living of taxpayers' money, in Brussels.
Wasn't it Farage who openly said he'll emigrate if Brexit turns out to be a bad decision, to be decided in 5 years or so.

ETA:
Memory serves indeed though nothing mentioned about when.
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  #8900  
Old 27.04.2017, 16:22
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Wasn't it Farage who openly said he'll emigrate if Brexit turns out to be a bad decision, to be decided in 5 years or so.

ETA:
Memory serves indeed though nothing mentioned about when.
I believe he has already emigrated and is living in the recesses of Trump's anus.
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