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View Poll Results: What would you personally prefer to happen?
I want the UK to stay in an ever-closer union 49 23.11%
I want the UK to stay in a loosely connected EU 68 32.08%
I want the UK out because the EU is bad for the UK 22 10.38%
I want the UK out because the EU is a bad thing 23 10.85%
I want the UK out because this would be good for the rest of us 17 8.02%
I don't really care 33 15.57%
Voters: 212. You may not vote on this poll

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  #11181  
Old 18.01.2018, 15:31
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Please google "Network Rail". The company responsible for bringing the railways up to spec is already nationalised
Precisely my point. We have nationalised the infrastructure, and we the taxpayer are footing the bill for this.

When the train operators who use the infrastructure make profits, they keep them (many of the franchise owners being foreign owned) and export the profits. Trains have to run, so when they are making losses, the government (or us) have to step in to bail out. Our system is literally the worst of all worlds for the taxpayer (privatised profits / socialised losses) and commuters.
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  #11182  
Old 18.01.2018, 15:37
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Our railways are massively outdated compared to most of our "peer" nations. Bringing railways up to the spec required for driverless operation would cost an astronomical amount. Private companies aren't going to fund this.

Whilst not all industry is best served by nationalisation, the current state of our railways - massive underinvestment, managed decline, bailing out failing franchises with taxpayer money whilst watching profits sail abroad to Germany, the Netherlands and Hong Kong really points to the fact that even in the worst case scenario, nationalisation would be of benefit.
You use the word investment, which implies there is an intended return on investment. Unfortunately it's a black hole of a money pit.
With AI & better communications it's probably not worth upgrading railways & many people won't need to commute in the future.

Interestingly private companies funded the Channel Tunnel, so clearly it is possible to get funding for projects that can never possibly turn a profit
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  #11183  
Old 18.01.2018, 15:37
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Maybe the opportunistic ones are few and far between though (is there such a thing as an opportunistic migrant who has parted with most of his life-savings to give to traffickers, travelled from, say, Africa in a leaky rubber dinghy over rough seas with dozens of others, then trekked across a thousand miles of mainland Europe?).

More likely they are "determined" and "purposeful", in which case border patrols in Calais isn't going to really stop them.
We already know from the last 2 years of exhaustive coverage that there are many thousands of single male economic migrants, from countries not on the danger list, simply looking to take advantage of the crisis and get into a cushy country. I have zero idea of how you could not be aware of this unless you are being wlfully ignorant to engage in some strange kind of virtue signalling.
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  #11184  
Old 18.01.2018, 15:58
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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We already know from the last 2 years of exhaustive coverage that there are many thousands of single male economic migrants, from countries not on the danger list, simply looking to take advantage of the crisis and get into a cushy country. I have zero idea of how you could not be aware of this unless you are being wlfully ignorant to engage in some strange kind of virtue signalling.
Marton was talking about the "refugee" camp at Calais, though. I just thought your response was the usual EF mix-up of migrants and refugees (apols if it wasn't), which has also been pervasive since the beginning of the thread.
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  #11185  
Old 18.01.2018, 16:00
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Precisely my point. We have nationalised the infrastructure, and we the taxpayer are footing the bill for this.

When the train operators who use the infrastructure make profits, they keep them (many of the franchise owners being foreign owned) and export the profits. Trains have to run, so when they are making losses, the government (or us) have to step in to bail out. Our system is literally the worst of all worlds for the taxpayer (privatised profits / socialised losses) and commuters.
Train operators make an average profit of about 3%. Hardly rinsing the system. The only way to invest the money needed to improve the railways is to either increase fares or increase government investment. First case would upset commuters, for the second, the money has to come from somewhere (magic money tree anyone?). And even if the investment were made, it would be years before it was noticed when travelling by train. It's not an easy problem to solve.
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  #11186  
Old 18.01.2018, 16:08
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Marton was talking about the "refugee" camp at Calais, though. I just thought your response was the usual EF mix-up of migrants and refugees (apols if it wasn't), which has also been pervasive since the beginning of the thread.
There isn't a "refugee camp" in Calais.
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  #11187  
Old 18.01.2018, 16:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Train operators make an average profit of about 3%. Hardly rinsing the system. The only way to invest the money needed to improve the railways is to either increase fares or increase government investment. First case would upset commuters, for the second, the money has to come from somewhere (magic money tree anyone?). And even if the investment were made, it would be years before it was noticed when travelling by train. It's not an easy problem to solve.
Not sure how far back your stats go or what source you are using, but the top 10 TOCs made £407m profit last year. I think that kind of money is better in the CotE's pocket, not Deutsche Bahn's, Trenitalia, etc.
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  #11188  
Old 18.01.2018, 16:28
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

I taught in Derbyshire and North Nottinghamshire after all the coal mines closed down. If anything had turned round there, it was for the worse! Shops boarded up. Whole communities destroyed. One Avenue I had to drive along on my way to work was nicknamed "Firewood Avenue" because every household on it had had to use their fences and gates as firewood to keep warm in Winter.


Dickensian.


Then the "service industry" moved in. One shopping mall after the other. At least the women got a job on the supermarket till... with kick in the ass salaries! So much for a turnaround.
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  #11189  
Old 19.01.2018, 12:39
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

The Sun has done it again. It has published a "Bye-EU tapestry" which implies that the Queen supports Brexit, putting her in front of a castle with the banner "better orf out".

BYE-EU TAPESTRY The Sun’s Brexit-inspired tapestry shows EU membership was one long stitch-up

March 2016 EU referendum: Palace complains over Queen 'Brexit' story

"Buckingham Palace has complained to the press watchdog over the Sun newspaper's article claiming the Queen backed "Brexit" from the European Union."
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  #11190  
Old 19.01.2018, 13:39
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The Sun has done it again. It has published a "Bye-EU tapestry" which implies that the Queen supports Brexit, putting her in front of a castle with the banner "better orf out".

BYE-EU TAPESTRY The Sun’s Brexit-inspired tapestry shows EU membership was one long stitch-up

March 2016 EU referendum: Palace complains over Queen 'Brexit' story

"Buckingham Palace has complained to the press watchdog over the Sun newspaper's article claiming the Queen backed "Brexit" from the European Union."
Actual LOL!
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  #11191  
Old 19.01.2018, 19:05
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The Sun has done it again. It has published a "Bye-EU tapestry" which implies that the Queen supports Brexit, putting her in front of a castle with the banner "better orf out".

BYE-EU TAPESTRY The Sun’s Brexit-inspired tapestry shows EU membership was one long stitch-up

March 2016 EU referendum: Palace complains over Queen 'Brexit' story

"Buckingham Palace has complained to the press watchdog over the Sun newspaper's article claiming the Queen backed "Brexit" from the European Union."


The Sun, that well-known source of serious investigative journalism and promotion of the image of women in society!
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  #11192  
Old 19.01.2018, 21:54
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Boris building bridges

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Last edited by TobiasM; 20.01.2018 at 15:35. Reason: better caption
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  #11193  
Old 20.01.2018, 02:39
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

Tragis news from McVitie's...

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'Seven fewer' McVitie's Digestives in packs because of Brexit
https://news.sky.com/story/seven-few...rexit-11213339
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  #11194  
Old 20.01.2018, 11:09
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

That should save the NHS Billions through lower obesity levels.
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  #11195  
Old 20.01.2018, 11:11
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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That should save the NHS Billions through lower obesity levels.
You could have been slimmanfilms, if only the UK left the EU sooner
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  #11196  
Old 20.01.2018, 16:15
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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You could have been slimmanfilms, if only the UK left the EU sooner
It does not sound right, think of Hitchock
Anyway my BMI is normal, not overweight or obese
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  #11197  
Old 21.01.2018, 21:21
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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It does not sound right, think of Hitchock
Anyway my BMI is normal, not overweight or obese
Are you comparing yourself to Hitchcock?
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  #11198  
Old 21.01.2018, 21:27
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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Are you comparing yourself to Hitchcock?
Hitchcock is the one in the hat
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  #11199  
Old 21.01.2018, 23:07
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

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The Sun has done it again. It has published a "Bye-EU tapestry" which implies that the Queen supports Brexit, putting her in front of a castle with the banner "better orf out".

BYE-EU TAPESTRY The Sun’s Brexit-inspired tapestry shows EU membership was one long stitch-up
Full hi-res version available here.
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  #11200  
Old 22.01.2018, 20:37
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Re: The Brexit referendum thread: potential consequences for GB, EU and the Brits in

This isn't awkward

CBI insiders push for new campaign to reverse Brexit
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