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  #121  
Old 18.01.2017, 13:26
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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Just one example, we got given a lot of foodie goodies before christmas from a friend, who went to shop for it in Germany (as she lives close to the border), amongst the gifted items were Pork filets, the only items with a price tag ....now a kilo pork filet at Migros from the M-Budget line is 34.90.- from what I calculated the price of the german filets was about 12-13 francs (converted) per kilo....
Coincidentally I saw an article in a Swiss farmer magazine (from 2014) that Migros budget sell German sourced pork fillets @ CHF34.90 that they buy for CHF 1.65 from German slaughter houses

Source (German language)

Good news is the Migros price has not increased in two years
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  #122  
Old 18.01.2017, 19:18
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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Coincidentally I saw an article in a Swiss farmer magazine (from 2014) that Migros budget sell German sourced pork fillets @ CHF34.90 that they buy for CHF 1.65 from German slaughter houses

Source (German language)

Good news is the Migros price has not increased in two years
They should be just about right for Tom to consume now.

News from 2014 .... nothing happening in the world anymore? LOL.
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  #123  
Old 18.01.2017, 19:32
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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In my opinion, it is better quality than most.
For beef and veal, I much prefer Italian quality (and price).

Tom
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  #124  
Old 18.01.2017, 19:58
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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For beef and veal, I much prefer Italian quality (and price).

Tom
Almost non-existent in the North of Switzerland. I've never seen Italian fresh meat around here. Not much French either.

It seems to be mainly Swiss or German (and Brazilian/Hungarian/whatever) if you shop at Migros.
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  #125  
Old 18.01.2017, 20:11
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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Almost non-existent in the North of Switzerland. I've never seen Italian fresh meat around here. Not much French either.

It seems to be mainly Swiss or German (and Brazilian/Hungarian/whatever) if you shop at Migros.
I buy it in Italy, same butcher for 25 years.

Tom
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  #126  
Old 19.01.2017, 01:24
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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It seems to be mainly Swiss or German (and Brazilian/Hungarian/whatever) if you shop at Migros.
From my experience Italian supermarket meat is often not very good though, you have to know what is good in which supermarket, or go to specific supermarkets that you know have good stuff. At the butcher it can be fantastic.
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I buy it in Italy, same butcher for 25 years.
care to share?
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  #127  
Old 19.01.2017, 08:09
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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Coincidentally I saw an article in a Swiss farmer magazine (from 2014) that Migros budget sell German sourced pork fillets @ CHF34.90 that they buy for CHF 1.65 from German slaughter houses

Source (German language)

Good news is the Migros price has not increased in two years
Not sure if it's to early for me to understand a joke. But you do realize that the 1.65 CHF/kg does not refer to the price Migros or Coop would pay to the slaughter house? It's the price the slaughter house pays to the pig farmer. The same article says that the price for many pig farmers is too low to survive. A quick google search will tell you that swiss pig farmers get between 3.60 to 4.10 per kg.
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  #128  
Old 19.01.2017, 08:21
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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From my experience Italian supermarket meat is often not very good though, you have to know what is good in which supermarket, or go to specific supermarkets that you know have good stuff. At the butcher it can be fantastic.

care to share?
Yes, not a fan of the supermarket stuff, though it varies.

Butcher is much better, though that can also vary.

There's one in Ponte Tresa near the big parking lot.

The other one is Zanetti in Trieste.

Both dry age their meat on the premises.

Tom
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  #129  
Old 19.01.2017, 11:13
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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Not sure if it's to early for me to understand a joke. But you do realize that the 1.65 CHF/kg does not refer to the price Migros or Coop would pay to the slaughter house? It's the price the slaughter house pays to the pig farmer. The same article says that the price for many pig farmers is too low to survive. A quick google search will tell you that swiss pig farmers get between 3.60 to 4.10 per kg.

You are right, my aunt and uncle are farmers and have been pig rearers and breeders for over 40 years, this year they stop doing it and non of the kids will take over the farm with live stock as there is not enough in it to feed a family properly compared to the work you put in.
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  #130  
Old 19.01.2017, 16:33
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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You are right, my aunt and uncle are farmers and have been pig rearers and breeders for over 40 years, this year they stop doing it and non of the kids will take over the farm with live stock as there is not enough in it to feed a family properly compared to the work you put in.
My sister breeds rare British pigs. After months of care and feeding. She makes fifteen pounds profit on the whole pig.
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  #131  
Old 19.01.2017, 17:00
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

I do all my shopping at the Carrefour in Divonne. There are 3 factors that lead me to the Carrefour: Open hours, price, and selection.

Open hours: It's about a 30 minute drive from me, and I can do it after I get off of work (usually past 7pm).

Price: I'm on a high-protein paleo/keto diet, so buying things like chicken and beef (about 6kg a week for my wife and I) are much much more reasonable. Additionally, the price of ham/sausage/other cured meats is much more cheap. Toothpastes/toiletries are also much much cheaper. Good beers are also cheaper.

Selection: They have large tubs of nonfat Fage yogurt, which I have yet to find (Coop leman has the little ones). They [obviously] have a better selection of French wines, and I vastly prefer french wines. I also prefer their cheese selection (again it's more heavily French). They also have an a couple of hot sauces there which I can't find anywhere else. I also prefer their house-made merguez and house-made quiche to anything I've found in any CH grocery.

And no I haven't taken into account the VAT. I just cross at whichever crossing (Divonne or Crassier) isn't manned.

Shopping in CH is reserved to buying Chocolate bars and the occasional train beer at Aperto.
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  #132  
Old 20.01.2017, 07:39
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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My sister breeds rare British pigs. After months of care and feeding. She makes fifteen pounds profit on the whole pig.
That's just crazy. To me just another example why meat in fact is too cheap. It's great that your sister does take care of the pigs, but I can see that others might not have the patience and dedication like her and will try to bend rules to make more profit.
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  #133  
Old 20.01.2017, 08:42
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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That's just crazy. To me just another example why meat in fact is too cheap. It's great that your sister does take care of the pigs, but I can see that others might not have the patience and dedication like her and will try to bend rules to make more profit.
It's not that cheap actually, you(we) also pay taxes to subsidise the farmers. This is why there are still farmers in Western Europe - otherwise with that amount of work and commitment no-one would still go down that route especially when they have alternatives.
But anyway, it's off topic.
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  #134  
Old 20.01.2017, 08:50
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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It's not that cheap actually, you(we) also pay taxes to subsidise the farmers. This is why there are still farmers in Western Europe - otherwise with that amount of work and commitment no-one would still go down that route especially when they have alternatives.
But anyway, it's off topic.
You have that the wrong way round - meat is massively too cheap precisely because of the subsidies.

Remove the subsidies and farmers would have to massively increase the price per animal - which is then passed on to the consumer.

(I'm off to google farm subsidies)
EDIT - some stat:
57% - that's the income of Swiss farmers received via subsidies - 2nd highest % in the world (after Norway).
1/20th - the average size of a Swiss farm compared to that of a New Zealand one - where the subsidy is 3%
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  #135  
Old 20.01.2017, 08:57
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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You have that the wrong way round - meat is massively too cheap precisely because of the subsidies.

Remove the subsidies and farmers would have to massively increase the price per animal - which is then passed on to the consumer.

(I'm off to google farm subsidies)
EDIT: 57% - that's the income of Swiss farmers received via subsidies - 2nd highest % in the world (after Norway).
1/20th - the average size of a Swiss farm compared to that of a New Zealand one - where the subsidy is 3%
No, I didn't. The subsidies come from the "government money", which comes from the taxes that we pay. It's passed on to the tax payers, that's why I said it's not "that cheap".
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  #136  
Old 20.01.2017, 09:24
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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No, I didn't. The subsidies come from the "government money", which comes from the taxes that we pay. It's passed on to the tax payers, that's why I said it's not "that cheap".
What I meant with too cheap, was the price one has to pay in the supermarket. I know that meat is heavily subsidized, as farmers couldn't survive otherwise. If the prices in the supermarkets would be higher, the farmers would get payed better as well and would not depend so much on tax money. Yet people still complain that meat is too expensive.
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  #137  
Old 20.01.2017, 11:26
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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What I meant with too cheap, was the price one has to pay in the supermarket. I know that meat is heavily subsidized, as farmers couldn't survive otherwise. If the prices in the supermarkets would be higher, the farmers would get payed better as well and would not depend so much on tax money. Yet people still complain that meat is too expensive.
Why should there be mom 'n pop farmers? This is why there this industrialized farming in the world. We don't keep obsolete professions like blacksmiths and weavers operating when there are machines that can do their jobs on much larger scales...

So, back to the OP: Yeah, shopping in France is great!
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  #138  
Old 20.01.2017, 12:08
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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Why should there be mom 'n pop farmers?

Switzerland wouldn't look like it is if they flattened all the mountains and put in feedlots.

Similarly, England's green and pleasant land is mainly down to the farming practices.

Plus, people actually like to eat food that tastes good.

Apples, for example, in Switzerland, from almost every supermarket, taste like the ones picked straight from the tree. They are truely fantastic.
We had apple crumble last night with local apples and it was delicious.

Contrast that with the huge, floury, tasteless, waxed apples in a typical U.S. supermarket and you can see why small-scale is so important.

Of course if you can't tell the difference...
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  #139  
Old 20.01.2017, 12:22
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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Switzerland wouldn't look like it is if they flattened all the mountains and put in feedlots.

Similarly, England's green and pleasant land is mainly down to the farming practices.

Plus, people actually like to eat food that tastes good.

Apples, for example, in Switzerland, from almost every supermarket, taste like the ones picked straight from the tree. They are truely fantastic.
We had apple crumble last night with local apples and it was delicious.

Contrast that with the huge, floury, tasteless, waxed apples in a typical U.S. supermarket and you can see why small-scale is so important.

Of course if you can't tell the difference...
If they're truly fantastic, why did I have a mealy disgusting apple last weekend in Lausanne? Anecdotal BS argument contradicted with another anecdotal BS argument!

Grocery stores in the USA typically have dozens of varieties of apples, all with varying tastes/character (remember variety at stores?? oh man!). Try a honeycrisp from any grocer in the US and it'll be great.

Quality in Switzerland is a strawman argument used everywhere around here, whether its related to teeny farms, or anything else. Part of me thinks it's just by virtue of there being so little variety/outside influence that people have no real points of reference, see that it's expensive compared to the rest of the world, and assume quality. And it's constantly contradicted by things like 1) the poor workmanship demonstrated by most tradespeople, 2) the lack of actually good and innovative restaurant offerings 3) the crappy and inefficient way the various bureaucracies works, etc etc etc.

The Swiss guys on my manufacturing floor constantly joke about how they're the beneficiaries of the greatest PR campaign of all time: Swiss made means quality.
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  #140  
Old 20.01.2017, 13:26
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Re: Savings - grocery shopping over the border.

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From my experience Italian supermarket meat is often not very good though, you have to know what is good in which supermarket, or go to specific supermarkets that you know have good stuff. At the butcher it can be fantastic.
The more affordable beef found in italian supermarkets are either from Germany or France. The true Italian beef are more expensive and better. At Eataly in Milan they have a reasonable price on very good Piemontese and Chianina beef cuts.

Still, even the best Italian beef is not on par with Argentinian or Brazilian beef. It's a shame that Switzerland and the EU in general boycott the beef from these places: not only the quality is massive superior, but also the prices are ridiculously low.
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