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  #21  
Old 19.02.2017, 09:56
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

What is really surprising to me is that, in the land that invented ambulance-chaser lawyers and rampant lawsuits over *anything*, there is still no action on that front. Oh, well, they have a country to save from the Donald, so this is probably low on the list

EDIT > on a serious note, I found this page on the Admin.CH site and sent them an email, asking "what if". As soon as I get an answer, I will post the reply.

Last edited by defcon3; 19.02.2017 at 10:08.
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  #22  
Old 19.02.2017, 10:22
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

From the horses mouth: https://www.cbp.gov/travel/cbp-search-authority

Quote:
A U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officer's border search authority is derived from federal statutes and regulations, including 19 C.F.R. 162.6, which states that, "All persons, baggage and merchandise arriving in the Customs territory of the United States from places outside thereof are liable to inspection by a CBP officer." Unless exempt by diplomatic status, all persons entering the United States, including U.S. citizens, are subject to examination and search by CBP officers.
They cannot compel you to give your passwords, but they don't have to let you in either.
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  #23  
Old 19.02.2017, 12:37
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

New executive order expected on Tuesday with implementation in 1-2 weeks' time.

"The new version of the decree prohibiting access to the United States to nationals of several countries will not concern holders of the "green card" of permanent residents. It will also spare the passengers already on board airplanes destined for the country.

Justice suspended the first decree signed on 27 January by Donald Trump. The text temporarily banned the entry of US nationals from seven Muslim countries in the Middle East and Africa (Iran, Iraq, Syria, Yemen, Libya, Sudan and Somalia) in the name of security imperatives.

Its implementation, at the origin of chaotic scenes in airports, had aroused protests in the United States and abroad. "The president plans to broadcast a closer, streamlined version of the first (decree)," US Secretary of Homeland Security John Kelly said Saturday at the Munich security conference.

In particular, it stated that green cardholders (permanent resident cards) traveling abroad when this new version comes into force "will be admitted". Similarly, he promised "a small period of enforcement" to ensure that travelers on board the United States "are allowed to enter the country."

Same target countries

The new version of the decree should target the same seven Muslim majority countries as the previous one, reports the Wall Street Journal, quoting a note from the State Department on the draft text.

The new decree is likely to be promulgated as of Tuesday, the newspaper quoted a government official as saying. It should be implemented one to two weeks after its signature by the President."

https://www.bluewin.ch/fr/infos/inte...s-par-le-.html
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  #24  
Old 19.02.2017, 16:45
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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At some point, the Supreme Court will reaffirm that constitutional protections (eg those against unreasonable search and seizure) apply to non citizens. Until then, it's going to be a bumpy ride.
It seems the US constitution covers US territory only, it doesn't apply until people have been allowed in; soil used to perform border control is considered outside of those bounds.
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  #25  
Old 19.02.2017, 16:55
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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... I also don't have any social media accounts, at least not in my real name. I'm of a sufficient age that it's not unbelievable that I don't tweet...
I'm wondering what the protocol will be for officers that insist one has social media accounts when one doesn't. What argument do travelers have then, or are they just stuck or even turned away? This is all getting too silly.
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  #26  
Old 19.02.2017, 17:14
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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It seems the US constitution covers US territory only, it doesn't apply until people have been allowed in; soil used to perform border control is considered outside of those bounds.
That's the interpretation last time it went to the Supreme Court, yes - but you'll not find that definition anywhere the document itself. Rather, that's a legal opinion serviced from a logical analysis, which leaves me hope that a strict constitutionalist - as republicans are wont to nominate - may overturn it.

But I'm not holding my breath.
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  #27  
Old 19.02.2017, 18:12
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

This guide should help a bit...https://www.theregister.co.uk/2017/0...n_entering_us/
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  #28  
Old 19.02.2017, 18:55
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

"Invasive Digital Search" — nice thread title...

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  #29  
Old 20.02.2017, 09:54
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

I've just been to the US and on entry got one of their less friendly CBP officials. When I say "less friendly", there was nothing wrong with what he asked, but he was hardly welcoming.
Absolutely no interest in my phone, laptops, even the declared food on my customs form. Just how long I was staying, where and whether business or leisure. And I came in from Mexico, where they had big anti-Trump demos the previous day!
Total of about 2 minutes for me and my better half.
For me, it was pretty much "business as usual".
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  #30  
Old 20.02.2017, 14:26
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

Dunno why they bother asking the NSA has all this information anyway.
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  #31  
Old 20.02.2017, 19:29
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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Dunno why they bother asking the NSA has all this information anyway.
Because the NSA doesn't share.
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  #32  
Old 20.02.2017, 20:07
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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I've just been to the US and on entry got one of their less friendly CBP officials. When I say "less friendly", there was nothing wrong with what he asked, but he was hardly welcoming.
Absolutely no interest in my phone, laptops, even the declared food on my customs form. Just how long I was staying, where and whether business or leisure. And I came in from Mexico, where they had big anti-Trump demos the previous day!
Total of about 2 minutes for me and my better half.
For me, it was pretty much "business as usual".
I will take less friendly & business as usual any day over invasive [insert expletive of choice here] officer with a superiority complex.
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  #33  
Old 21.02.2017, 13:36
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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I'm wondering what the protocol will be for officers that insist one has social media accounts when one doesn't.
Well here's the protocol for when one does and they don't 'like' what's in it.

http://bitcoinwarrior.net/2017/02/us...cruff-profile/
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  #34  
Old 25.02.2017, 22:29
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

The Foreign Affairs Helpline came back with the kindest FU reply received to date, gently inviting me to contact the potential abuser of my rights for clarification. Copied below the reply:

================
Monsieur,

Nous accusons réception de votre courriel à la helpline du DFAE et nous permettons de vous répondre en français.

Chaque pays possède ses propres prescriptions en matière d’entrée sur le territoire. Ce sont donc les ambassades et les consulats étrangers en Suisse qui sont compétents pour donner des renseignements sur les visas. Veuillez donc vous adresser à l'Ambassade des Etats-Unis à Berne qui donne des renseignements à ce sujet sur son site internet http://bern.usembassy.gov et par téléphone (0900-878472).

Le Departement of Homeland Security des Etats-Unis donne des informations sur l'enregistrement électronique ESTA qui doit se faire au moins 72 heures avant le départ:
§ Visa Waiver Program / ESTA (Electronic System for Travel Authorization) *

ESTA Informations
ESTA Anmeldung
ESTA FAQ
§ Global Entry

§ Informations Global Entry Programm (page informations de l’Office Fédéral de la Police)

§ US Customs and Border Protection (CBP)

Department of Homeland Security (DHS)

Nous souhaitons vous rendre attentif au fait que le DFAE publie ses Conseils aux voyageurs, qui se concentrent sur des informations relatives à la sécurité, sur internet: www.dfae.admin.ch/voyages. Veuillez également consulter les informations complémentaires, de portée générale sur le même site; elles font partie intégrante des conseils aux voyageurs par pays.

Par ailleurs, veuillez noter que vous et vos proches avez la possibilité d’enregistrer vos voyages à l’étranger (courts séjours) sur notre plateforme online itineris. En cas de crise grave à l'étranger, ces informations permettront au département fédéral des affaires étrangères de mieux vous localiser, afin de vous contacter. Si la situation en matière de sécurité se dégrade considérablement et de manière inattendue, vous recevrez un message.

Meilleures salutations,
================

The email ends with the standard links to all apps, sites, etc.

It might be smart to really take a dumb phone on my next trip, just need to figure out what would work with my SALT sim card.
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  #35  
Old 25.02.2017, 22:49
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

Basic issue is when you have to fill in any official forms that ask about social media accounts.

If you are not truthful then not only do you risk not being allowed in but you risk being banned for life.

If you do not have your laptop/table/smartphone with you then presumably they can demand your user id and password and can then access using their own equipment.
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  #36  
Old 25.02.2017, 23:47
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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Basic issue is when you have to fill in any official forms that ask about social media accounts.

If you are not truthful then not only do you risk not being allowed in but you risk being banned for life.

If you do not have your laptop/table/smartphone with you then presumably they can demand your user id and password and can then access using their own equipment.

You can't lie on that form.
Did you lot forget about XKEYSCORE?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XKeyscore

They know everything about you. The form is just another check.

Like when they ask a suspect the same questions multiple times, each time a little bit different, and watch for inconsistencies.

At some point, that probably also influences your "no-fly-list" risk-score.
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Old 26.02.2017, 19:47
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

Use this phone: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/amp/39095127

It's the 'latest' thing, and can even make phone calls. And play 'snake'.
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  #38  
Old 27.02.2017, 09:13
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

To follow up, the question on social media is not "required" but voluntary. I don't remember whether it was on my ESTA or API, but I just left it blank. I am "anti-social" and both my Facebook and Twitter account are pretty empty, as I don't see the interest in sharing my private life, but that's me. CBP didn't ask anything, maybe took one look at me and decided I was past the age for those using social media.
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  #39  
Old 28.02.2017, 17:51
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

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To follow up, the question on social media is not "required" but voluntary. I don't remember whether it was on my ESTA or API, but I just left it blank.
It is on the ESTA, it is indeed optional, and I also declined to provide that information. I have made two trips to the US in the last few weeks and can report the same situation: it was not an issue.

But in a few years I am sure it will become mandatory as part of the ESTA.
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Old 28.02.2017, 18:34
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Re: Travelling to the US on Swiss Passport [Invasive Digital Search]

Just imagine somebody would come up with a high-brisance explosive fabric. We would all have to board those airplanes nekid.
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