Go Back   English Forum Switzerland > Living in Switzerland > Daily life  
Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 28.02.2017, 12:38
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Puzzle for you all.

Near where I live, there's a road called Chlederenweg. There are also apfelweg, kirschweg - that kind of thing. Farming area, and lots of fruit trees in the area to provide some potential context. This is SO, near the border with France.

I've asked a few Swiss people I know, and we've all drawn a blank as to what a Chlederen might be.

Any ideas?
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 28.02.2017, 12:43
lost_inbroad's Avatar
Unbridled Mod
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: Town or region
Posts: 11,436
Groaned at 628 Times in 403 Posts
Thanked 16,010 Times in 6,268 Posts
lost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond reputelost_inbroad has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

"Chledere" in Swiss German means to climb...but Chlederen might be a specific term coined in that particular region.
Maybe you can drop by the Gemeinde and ask about it...someone may know the specific origin of that word.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank lost_inbroad for this useful post:
  #3  
Old 28.02.2017, 12:56
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,257
Groaned at 93 Times in 84 Posts
Thanked 18,718 Times in 8,302 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

it is the name of the farm land nearby
See on the official Swiss Topo Map

What it means? I do not know, but it is only used in Switzerland in this particular village and nowhere else.
Means some farmer back in the time once named it like this.

It is only listed on the map since 1954
The map as it was 1954

Before that it was not on the map.
The map from 1913/1917

Before that is was known as "Zwischen den Dörfern"
Map from 1893

Maybe it means the pach where the clover grows? Clover in German Klee, Swiss German Chlee.

From the map you can also see what the Ebni was called in earlier times: Auf der Ebene.
__________________
"Okay, I just hope we don't wake up on Mars or something surrounded by millions of little squashy guys."
Reply With Quote
The following 9 users would like to thank aSwissInTheUS for this useful post:
  #4  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:21
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

What a fabulous website! I love old maps.

Glad I checked this at lunchtime, I've just spent 30 minutes looking around the area.

Klee is an interesting suggestion, fits the narrative and a friend of mine suggested the same.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:24
JagWaugh's Avatar
RIP
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Eglisau
Posts: 7,273
Groaned at 47 Times in 46 Posts
Thanked 14,131 Times in 5,506 Posts
JagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

I looked in my Kluge etymological dictionary... Nothing direct with Chled.. but Klee (clover) or Klei (clay) might also be germain.
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank JagWaugh for this useful post:
  #6  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:25
PaddyG's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Pensier, Fribourg
Posts: 9,250
Groaned at 121 Times in 105 Posts
Thanked 16,857 Times in 5,912 Posts
PaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

I chuckled at the fact a thread was started on road names by someone called (apparently) Brian Close .
Reply With Quote
The following 4 users would like to thank PaddyG for this useful post:
  #7  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:26
AbFab's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Zürich
Posts: 7,830
Groaned at 330 Times in 224 Posts
Thanked 10,915 Times in 3,794 Posts
AbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond reputeAbFab has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
I chuckled at the fact a thread was started on road names by someone called (apparently) Brian Close .
I have a niece in the UK who lives in a Drew Close...
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank AbFab for this useful post:
  #8  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:34
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
I chuckled at the fact a thread was started on road names by someone called (apparently) Brian Close .
ha, good spot, never occurred to me.

The name is rather a reference to the late great Brian Close.

If there was a road called Brian Close I'd live on it in a flash.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:37
PaddyG's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Location: Pensier, Fribourg
Posts: 9,250
Groaned at 121 Times in 105 Posts
Thanked 16,857 Times in 5,912 Posts
PaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond reputePaddyG has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
ha, good spot, never occurred to me.

The name is rather a reference to the late great Brian Close.

If there was a road called Brian Close I'd live on it in a flash.
Thought so, that occurred to me just after I posted.

I actually have a street with my exact name in Wolverhampton somewhere. I'll buy a drink for anyone who can find it (you obviously have to know my real name, and I ain't gving any clues ).

Last edited by PaddyG; 28.02.2017 at 13:41. Reason: Wolverhampton, not Brum
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:43
Medea Fleecestealer's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Jul 2011
Location: Switzerland
Posts: 21,479
Groaned at 371 Times in 286 Posts
Thanked 16,291 Times in 9,245 Posts
Medea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond reputeMedea Fleecestealer has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
I have a niece in the UK who lives in a Drew Close...
I used to live in Mason Close when I was up in Cheshire.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:43
Guest
 
Posts: n/a
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
Thought so, that occurred to me just after I posted.

I actually have a street with my exact name in Wolverhampton somewhere. I'll buy a drink for anyone who can find it (you obviously have to know my real name, and I ain't gving any clues ).

Ringroad St. Patrick

Mine's a Guinness.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolverhampton_Ring_Road
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:47
JagWaugh's Avatar
RIP
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Eglisau
Posts: 7,273
Groaned at 47 Times in 46 Posts
Thanked 14,131 Times in 5,506 Posts
JagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond reputeJagWaugh has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
Thought so, that occurred to me just after I posted.

I actually have a street with my exact name in Wolverhampton somewhere. I'll buy a drink for anyone who can find it (you obviously have to know my real name, and I ain't gving any clues ).
Grinders Close?
Fingerless Lane?
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:52
Captain Greybeard's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sarganserland / NW Lower Penin
Posts: 3,526
Groaned at 43 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 7,410 Times in 2,314 Posts
Captain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Back to the topic: According to Schweizerdeutsches Idiotikon, the Swiss German female nouns Chledere / Chlädere / Chlettere / Chlättere are variants of Chlette / Chlätte, Standard German Klette, meaning a plant from the Arctium genus, usually Arctium lappa = edible or greater burdock.
Reply With Quote
The following 9 users would like to thank Captain Greybeard for this useful post:
  #14  
Old 28.02.2017, 13:58
NotAllThere's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Location: Baselland
Posts: 12,523
Groaned at 191 Times in 168 Posts
Thanked 18,051 Times in 7,354 Posts
NotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond reputeNotAllThere has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
Thought so, that occurred to me just after I posted.

I actually have a street with my exact name in Wolverhampton somewhere. I'll buy a drink for anyone who can find it (you obviously have to know my real name, and I ain't gving any clues ).
Bumblehole Meadows
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 28.02.2017, 14:06
Treverus's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: Luxembourg
Posts: 11,749
Groaned at 297 Times in 254 Posts
Thanked 22,118 Times in 8,033 Posts
Treverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond reputeTreverus has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Well, since nobody else picked it up: The map from 1893 had the Kledermatten slightly north of the current place. If I am not wrong are matten simply a moutain meadow, so I could imagine this to belong to a farm or family by the name of Kleder (?)
Reply With Quote
The following 2 users would like to thank Treverus for this useful post:
  #16  
Old 28.02.2017, 14:10
aSwissInTheUS's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Location: Zurich area
Posts: 12,257
Groaned at 93 Times in 84 Posts
Thanked 18,718 Times in 8,302 Posts
aSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond reputeaSwissInTheUS has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post

Before that is was known as "Zwischen den Dörfern"
Map from 1893
Ooops Should look beter. This name was previously attributed to a patch of land a bit further north and was then called: Kledermatten.

Quote:
View Post
I looked in my Kluge etymological dictionary... Nothing direct with Chled.. but Klee (clover) or Klei (clay) might also be germain.
Some more dictionarys: http://woerterbuchnetz.de (Idiotikon and DWB are often the best for Swiss Terms)
but nothing which really makes sense.

Quote:
View Post
Back to the topic: According to Schweizerdeutsches Idiotikon, Swiss German Chledere / Chlädere / Chlettere / Chlättere are variants of Chlette / Chlätte, Standard German Klette, meaning a plant from the Arctium genus, usually Arctium lappa = edible or greater burdock.
Could be. But it is not really useful on farm land is it?

Maybe just the patch of land (Matte) which belonged to Mr. Kleder?
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 28.02.2017, 14:29
Captain Greybeard's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Sarganserland / NW Lower Penin
Posts: 3,526
Groaned at 43 Times in 37 Posts
Thanked 7,410 Times in 2,314 Posts
Captain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond reputeCaptain Greybeard has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
Back to the topic: According to Schweizerdeutsches Idiotikon, the Swiss German female nouns Chledere / Chlädere / Chlettere / Chlättere are variants of Chlette / Chlätte, Standard German Klette, meaning a plant from the Arctium genus, usually Arctium lappa = edible or greater burdock.
Quote:
View Post

Could be. But it is not really useful on farm land is it?

Maybe just the patch of land (Matte) which belonged to Mr. Kleder?
Eadible burdock was cultivated in many areas of Switzerland in the 18th and 19th century. I have a Swiss book on farming, published around 1850, where burdock growing is covered in detail, together with Jerusalem artichokes, silkworm breeding and 560 apple varieties in the Canton Zurich alone.

Never heard a name (given or surname) that even remotely sounded like Kleder in Switzerland. The current Swiss phone directories do not yield a single hit for Kleder, Klehder or Kleeder.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank Captain Greybeard for this useful post:
  #18  
Old 28.02.2017, 14:36
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 10,806
Groaned at 227 Times in 191 Posts
Thanked 22,512 Times in 9,559 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post

It is only listed on the map since 1954
The map as it was 1954

Before that it was not on the map.
The map from 1913/1917
I'm a big peruser of Swisstopo and their maps.

I have often noticed that the spellings and sometimes even namings used on maps do not always match with what people actually call those places. This can go from minor spelling deviations to something that is totally unrecognizable. I asked a friend who knows about maps and he says the naming on Swisstopo maps often has official character and what places are officially called does not always tally with what the people who live there actually call them.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 28.02.2017, 14:38
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 10,806
Groaned at 227 Times in 191 Posts
Thanked 22,512 Times in 9,559 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
I chuckled at the fact a thread was started on road names by someone called (apparently) Brian Close .
That was a dead end thread.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 28.02.2017, 14:44
amogles's Avatar
Forum Legend
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Zurich
Posts: 10,806
Groaned at 227 Times in 191 Posts
Thanked 22,512 Times in 9,559 Posts
amogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond reputeamogles has a reputation beyond repute
Re: Road name meaning - Chlederenweg

Quote:
View Post
Well, since nobody else picked it up: The map from 1893 had the Kledermatten slightly north of the current place. If I am not wrong are matten simply a moutain meadow, so I could imagine this to belong to a farm or family by the name of Kleder (?)
I always understood a Matte to be a piece of grassland traditionally used for pasturing animals. Etmologically it is the same word (and same meaning) as the English word meadow. From the same Indo-European root word as the German mähen (to mow, to harvest)

If a particular flower had a tendency of growing there, it would be reasonable to assume that might influnece the naming.

I'm not saying your theory of it being a surname is wrong by the way.
Reply With Quote
This user would like to thank amogles for this useful post:
Reply




Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Family name as middle name? Shoe Freak Family matters/health 15 02.02.2017 00:40
Speed limit when I see a blue sign with name, meaning that I will be in a urban area badou Transportation/driving 25 26.03.2013 00:21
Choosing a Baby Name ( OK if same name as friend´s son ? ) candle Family matters/health 33 22.05.2012 22:26
name change (to married name) on GB passport Rory Permits/visas/government 3 12.09.2011 00:12
Last Name, First Name esto Other/general 32 08.07.2010 23:03


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 04:43.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
LinkBacks Enabled by vBSEO 3.1.0