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Old 21.09.2017, 14:42
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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You, on the other hand, are offended based on your own prejudice towards Asyls - offended at the thought that your child might be mistaken as one.

Indeed.

My wife has two political refugees in her family, a great grand-father who came here in 1863 or so after a failed uprising from what is now Poland, and her ex (and his siblings and parents) who was a Vietnamese boat person.

I fail to see the problem.

Tom
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  #262  
Old 21.09.2017, 14:42
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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Wrong. Swiss were but not Switzerland.
You rely on semantics a lot instead of tackling any of the actual points of the argument.

https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/switzer...-trade/3472130

You'll probably want to get in touch with Professor Hans Fässler at the University of Zurich, and make sure he knows he's wrong too.
  #263  
Old 21.09.2017, 14:49
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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where did I write that I was offended? I wasnt offended. That was an example of prejudice, a typical innocent example of the regular prejudice that one encounters.
Prejudice means to judge without asking, to judge by taking something for granted and most of all without rational cause. That's exactly the contrary of what happened simply because the child asked, it didn't assume.

But how reasonable is the childs question?

Well, that's tricky. For simplicity's sake let's focus on people from Africa. While there are others as well, the Africans are the most obvious black people, and there aren't that many around from other nations. Plus there aren't enough whites among them to make a significant difference.

103k residents are from Africa. There are 15.3k accepted African refugees (B permit), 25k asylum seekers (request still in process), 16k provisionally accepted (request denied but not to be deported because they'd be in serious danger) from Africa for a total of 56.3k who fall under the asylum umbrella.

Long story short there's about a 55% chance for any African to fall under the asylum umbrella.

So actually the prejudice appears to be on your side. The child on the other hand is as rational as can be.

Last edited by Urs Max; 21.09.2017 at 15:03.
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  #264  
Old 21.09.2017, 15:01
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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You rely on semantics a lot instead of tackling any of the actual points of the argument.
Actually there's nothing to tackle at all.
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Old 21.09.2017, 16:06
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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Actually there's nothing to tackle at all.
Urs, you say I'm wrong, I provide evidence I am not.... and you side step the issue by simple pretending it (and everything else) doesn't exist.

And you say I have "poor style"!
  #266  
Old 21.09.2017, 16:49
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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Urs, you say I'm wrong, I provide evidence I am not.... and you side step the issue by simple pretending it (and everything else) doesn't exist.

And you say I have "poor style"!
What you call evidence is opinion. Perhaps well-founded opinion but opinion nonetheless.

And No, I don't mean you're wrong. I mean your wording requires improvement as there's a difference between "the Swiss"(population) and "Switzerland". There's nothing to tackle for today's population, at least I don't care what some emigrants did in southern America or what some Patrizier based their business abroad on.
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  #267  
Old 21.09.2017, 17:06
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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What you call evidence is opinion. Perhaps well-founded opinion but opinion nonetheless.

And No, I don't mean you're wrong. I mean your wording requires improvement as there's a difference between "the Swiss"(population) and "Switzerland". There's nothing to tackle for today's population, at least I don't care what some emigrants did in southern America or what some Patrizier based their business abroad on.
That's a good point. However I would say that due to which Swiss were involved (the banks), and how fundamental they were to Switzerland as a country, all of Switzerland has benefited since. Two hundred years ago, if I were Swiss and opposed the slave trade I would have pointed the finger at the individual culprits and felt it was not Switzerland. But today, I think it's fair to say Switzerland, rather then attempting to distance ourselves.

But I take your point, and I agree it is all opinion.

As for Britain, well that's not opinion but fact, especially as the government even profited from taxing the trade
  #268  
Old 21.09.2017, 17:10
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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That's a good point. However I would say that due to which Swiss were involved (the banks), and how fundamental they were to Switzerland as a country, all of Switzerland has benefited since. Two hundred years ago, if I were Swiss and opposed the slave trade I would have pointed the finger at the individual culprits and felt it was not Switzerland. But today, I think it's fair to say Switzerland, rather then attempting to distance ourselves.

What percentage of Switzerland's wealth do you think is traceable to some Swiss bank having financed some slave ship 200 years ago?
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  #269  
Old 21.09.2017, 17:24
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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What percentage of Switzerland's wealth do you think is traceable to some Swiss bank having financed some slave ship 200 years ago?
Impossible to even guess. No one can deny the power of the Swiss banks and their effect on the Swiss economy though.

Also, Swiss banks didn't just finance some slave ships, it was much deeper than that. A quote from the link above:

"Swiss banks, for example, owned as much as a third of the Compagnie des Indes, a French company that held a monopoly over the West African slave trade, while trading houses financed and did business with slave traders."

We aren't talking about small numbers. But who ever does when Swiss banks are involved

edit: Actually, we should know more than we do. There have been calls for the Swiss government to research more deeply into this matter, but I can't find any further action by the government.

See this link for a more informative view of Switzerland's slave trading involvement from a member of the Green party back in 2003, in a request to the Swiss government to investigate further:

http://www.louverture.ch/BUCH/materi...T/holleng.html

Last edited by DanLF; 21.09.2017 at 17:35.
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  #270  
Old 21.09.2017, 21:17
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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That's a good point. However I would say that due to which Swiss were involved (the banks), and how fundamental they were to Switzerland as a country, all of Switzerland has benefited since. Two hundred years ago, if I were Swiss and opposed the slave trade I would have pointed the finger at the individual culprits and felt it was not Switzerland. But today, I think it's fair to say Switzerland, rather then attempting to distance ourselves.

But I take your point, and I agree it is all opinion.

As for Britain, well that's not opinion but fact, especially as the government even profited from taxing the trade
As "recently" as 150 years ago people were still starving to death by the thousands. Literally. As little as 70 years before that Switzerland had still Untertanengebiete, jointly owned and exploited areas the population of which were little better than slaves.

And yet you think the general population profited from those arrangements.

You're simultaneously ridiculous and absurd.
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  #271  
Old 21.09.2017, 21:51
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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"Swiss banks, for example, owned as much as a third of the Compagnie des Indes, a French company that held a monopoly over the West African slave trade, while trading houses financed and did business with slave traders."

l
I'm unable to find much on the shareholding of the Compagnie des Indes, but as the name suggests they ran trade with India, not the West Indies.

https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Compagnie_des_Indes
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Old 21.09.2017, 22:01
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

DanLF is clearly "we know who".

Tom
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  #273  
Old 21.09.2017, 22:03
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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DanLF is clearly "we know who".

Tom
He's not Faltrad. Faltrad was much more vindictive.
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  #274  
Old 21.09.2017, 22:15
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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DanLF is clearly "we know who".

Tom
Who?
  #275  
Old 21.09.2017, 22:28
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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Impossible to even guess. No one can deny the power of the Swiss banks and their effect on the Swiss economy though.

Also, Swiss banks didn't just finance some slave ships, it was much deeper than that. A quote from the link above:

"Swiss banks, for example, owned as much as a third of the Compagnie des Indes, a French company that held a monopoly over the West African slave trade, while trading houses financed and did business with slave traders."

We aren't talking about small numbers. But who ever does when Swiss banks are involved

edit: Actually, we should know more than we do. There have been calls for the Swiss government to research more deeply into this matter, but I can't find any further action by the government.

See this link for a more informative view of Switzerland's slave trading involvement from a member of the Green party back in 2003, in a request to the Swiss government to investigate further:

http://www.louverture.ch/BUCH/materi...T/holleng.html
Let me get this straight. A conversation about the supposed racist name for a freaking dessert - a back-and-forth which arguably was ridiculous to begin with - has now led to a discussion about the role Switzerland and Swiss banks may or may not have played in the slave trade?

Yes. Sure. That's reasonable. And not at all blown out of proportion.

Well EF certainly never disappoints.
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  #276  
Old 21.09.2017, 22:43
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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Who?
As a mod, you should know.

You people are certainly getting sloppy these days.

Tom
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  #277  
Old 21.09.2017, 23:17
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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Let me get this straight. A conversation about the supposed racist name for a freaking dessert - a back-and-forth which arguably was ridiculous to begin with - has now led to a discussion about the role Switzerland and Swiss banks may or may not have played in the slave trade?

Yes. Sure. That's reasonable. And not at all blown out of proportion.

Well EF certainly never disappoints.
Satire?

or

Aryan training film?

Discuss

https://youtu.be/0H2W1lK7P-I

NSFW (potentially)
  #278  
Old 22.09.2017, 00:01
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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As a mod, you should know.

You people are certainly getting sloppy these days.

Tom
I'm a user here since 2012, although I've lived in Switzerland since 2001. I rarely post, and one of the reasons is because I don't like the bullying and trolling that goes on here.

After the announcement about the mods clearing up the toxic atmosphere here, I thought I'd become more active again. I was persuaded by another user to stand up for my view and opinions. Racism is one of the things I feel strongly about, and I will share my opinions on it, no matter how many groans I might get.

Read the thread, and read my posts in it:
https://www.englishforum.ch/announce...ial-posts.html

Your constant assertions that I am some sort of fake user I now consider harassment. How would you like it if I started making accusations about who you might be? One thing I know you are, and should be obvious to everyone here, is a bully.

Please stop.
  #279  
Old 22.09.2017, 00:31
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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You people are certainly getting sloppy these days.
What do you mean, "you people"?!

Racist!!!
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  #280  
Old 22.09.2017, 01:22
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Re: Is the Mohrenkopf a racist piece of candy?

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Well, that's tricky. For simplicity's sake let's focus on people from Africa. While there are others as well, the Africans are the most obvious black people, and there aren't that many around from other nations. Plus there aren't enough whites among them to make a significant difference.

103k residents are from Africa. There are 15.3k accepted African refugees (B permit), 25k asylum seekers (request still in process), 16k provisionally accepted (request denied but not to be deported because they'd be in serious danger) from Africa for a total of 56.3k who fall under the asylum umbrella.

Long story short there's about a 55% chance for any African to fall under the asylum umbrella.
I'm really struggling to understand what you're getting at here. I would wake the African in the next room to show him this, but I know I wouldn't be able to post his response.

Having said that, I do agree that the little girl's question didn't obviously come from a prejudiced stand point. How she behaves towards the new girl after that is the definer. The girl asked an honest, blunt question and got an honest answer.

My OH is similar when he meets other Africans. He always tries to place their accent or features to a very specific place, To my shock and amazement, it's always well received because people appreciate being recognised as more than 'that black person from that continent'.
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