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Old 13.06.2018, 15:09
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Help with storm damage question - urgent

Hello Guys,

I need help as I don’t know what to do.

This Saturday a storm came unexpectedly ( was not on the weather app ) then broke all my 4 sonnenstoren.

I was deeply asleep as I took a medication and did not hear it coming.

When I went to bed, it was a sunny day and we have in our balcony the sensor that retracts the sonnenstoren automatically when there is even a little bit of wind. It did not work.

I canceled my house insurance on the 4th and my new house insurance is dated 11.06.2018 so they will not pay for an incident that happened on the 9th.
Neither will the old insurance.

I had a health issue hence the issue with the gap between insurances.

The new insurance told me that because there is a sensor and it did not work, the fault is from the building and that the building insurance will cover the damages because it was a strong and suden storm.

But the landlord says no, that my insurance should pay.

I do not have law insurance, that is why I ask your help.

Please help me to know what to do.

Thanks

Gia
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  #2  
Old 13.06.2018, 15:24
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

Do you rent a house or an appartement?
Do you really mean house insurance or content and/or liability insurance?
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Old 13.06.2018, 15:28
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

I rent an apartment on the last floor.
Old apartment.

My insurances are combined house + liability.
But the gap is just the same.
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Old 13.06.2018, 15:29
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

Sorry, you are correct, content + liability.
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Old 13.06.2018, 16:04
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

o.k. the following applies to apartment renters:

In case there were no sensors it had been your fault and in this case the liability insurance might have paid (if you have had one). W/o a liability insurance you would have to cover the cost from your own pocket.

For you to be liable there must be wrongdoing from your side.

First check what the house rules, rental contract, and other accompanying documents (user manual of appliances etc) say regarding the Sonnenstoren. If it is a standard template than it normally says that they have to be wound up in case of severe weather. Doesn't mater if you were asleep, away, or knocked out.

If the rules, contract, and other accompanying documents (user manual of appliances etc) mention that they will wind up by themselves in case of severe weather you have a case and it would be the landlords problem

If nothing is mentioned it is left for interpretation. How a judge will decide? Do not know. As said in case of manual blinds it is just common sense do wind them up. In case of automatic ones with sensors one could argue that one must expect that a sensor could fail and thus should wind up the blinds in case they can not be supervised for whatever reason.
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Old 13.06.2018, 16:28
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

Thank you for your reply!!!

On the contract it says that the sonnenstoren is the renter responsibility to keep.

No mention of the sensor.

In fact, it is the same paragraph as the neighbors without a sensor.

So I assume it is a standard contract for all.

Landlord refuses to give me the sonnenstoren documents and manuals.

What shall I do?
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Old 13.06.2018, 16:36
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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What shall I do?
Pay.

Tom
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Old 13.06.2018, 16:37
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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On the contract it says that the sonnenstoren is the renter responsibility to keep.
Exact and verbatim quote please. No paraphrasing or translation. Also see the fine print on the back of the rental contract and if the rental contract references a "Hausordnung".

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Landlord refuses to give me the sonnenstoren documents and manuals.
In this case you can not know what the manual says or recommends regarding severe wather and thus also have no obligation to act according the manual. Only common sense applies.
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Old 13.06.2018, 16:48
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

In case you have to pay up (whole or partly), do not forget to think about their age and the economical write-off.
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Old 13.06.2018, 18:50
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

The sonnenstoren are there for 7 years or so.
But if I need to pay I should pay the entire value?
They said it’s around 9 thousand.
I am going home now and will check the contract.
Will update soon!
Thank you.
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Old 13.06.2018, 19:16
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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The sonnenstoren are there for 7 years or so.
But if I need to pay I should pay the entire value?
You would have to pay price * (expected lifetime - age) / (expected lifetime)

For example the fabric has an expected lifetime of 15 years. Whihc means if it was your fault you have to pay a bit more than half of the replacement cost.

Did not find the mechanical part in the lifetime table. Horizontal blinds are listed with 25 years.

https://www.mieterverband.ch/mv/miet...ertabelle.html
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Old 13.06.2018, 21:18
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

Thank you. I am almost home and will copy and paste the parts of the contract you mentioned here.

I just find very odd that every single sonnenstoren broke. 4 out of 4! The fabric is intact in all of them. I rolled them back already inside its place. The arms broke from the main structure. Some are in the floor and some are hanging. So in my opinion only the arms need to be replaced. Two of the sonnenstoren are in one balcony and two in the other. For me it shows that clearly the sensor which connects all of them, did not work. We are not in the carebean with humongous storms so I simply do not get it.

One thing to add is that the verwaltung sent a company already with the order to replace them entirely. When I confronted the guy from the company he told me the reason was that they did not manufacture the same parts - schenker storen. I decided now to call them on my own to get a truthful quote.
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Old 13.06.2018, 21:53
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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I just find very odd that every single sonnenstoren broke. 4 out of 4! The fabric is intact in all of them.
When a yacht is at sea in a storm and the sails are not reefed, quite often the mast will break and the sail fabric will be fine.

There's a lot of force exerted on sun blind arms - hence the need for a way of getting them rolled in if you are not at home.

We had a roller sun blind with a wind detection feature. It was badly designed - the default state after a reset caused by a power-cut was 'blind-out'.

This had the potential for damage:
  • You could roll them in before a holiday.
  • A power-reset could roll them out.
  • Rain could soak them
  • Wind could cause them to roll in again.
  • They wouldn't roll out again as they were programmed not to.
  • The fabric would, over a long holiday, go mouldy.

Hope you get it sorted without too much personal expense.
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Old 13.06.2018, 22:13
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

omg, so the better ones are the manual sonnenstoren.
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Old 13.06.2018, 22:30
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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Exact and verbatim quote please. No paraphrasing or translation. Also see the fine print on the back of the rental contract and if the rental contract references a "Hausordnung".



In this case you can not know what the manual says or recommends regarding severe wather and thus also have no obligation to act according the manual. Only common sense applies.

This is exactly what it is in the contract:

" Der Unterhalt der zum Mietobjekt gehorenden Bepflanzungen auf Gartensitzplatzen, Balkonen und Terrassen ist Sache des Mieters. Er hat insbesondere auch Obermassigen Pflanzenwuchs zu verhindern.
Die kleinen Unterhaltsarbeiten sind fachmannisch auszufi.ihren oder ausfuhren zu lassen.


Versicherungen
Der Mieter verpflichtet sich zum Abschluss einer Privathaftpflicht-Versicherung mit Deckung von Mieterschaden. Empfohlen wird zudem der Abschluss einer Hausratversicherung.
Loften des Mietobjekts
Der Mieter ist verpflichtet, das Mietobjekt 2- bis 4-mal taglich wahrend 5 bis 10 Minuten mit Durchzug zu IOften (StosslOften). DauerlOften durch geoffnete Kippfenster verbraucht im Winter viel Heizenergie. Wande und Boden in Fensternahe erkalten und das Risiko fur Kondensationsfeuchte steigt an diesen Stellen. Fenster dOrfen deshalb wahrend der kOhleren Jahreszeiten nicht in Kippstellung stehen gelassen werden.
Heizung
Wahrend der Heizperiode darf die Heizung in keinem Raum ganz abgestellt werden.
Keller- und Estrichfenster sollen bei Temperaturen unter dem Gefrierpunkt geschlossen werden.
In Wohnungen mit Bodenheizung ist darauf zu achten, dass nur dafOr geeignete Teppiche verwendet werden. Die Vermieterin kann sonst keine Gewahr fur eine angemessene Beheizung Obernehmen.
Schwere Gegenstande
Unter schwere Mobelstocke sind zweckmassige Unterlagen zum Schutz der Boden anzubringen. Gehort zur Wohnung ein Balkon oder eine Attika-Terrasse, so ist beim Aufstellen schwerer Gegenstande die jeweils zulassige Belastbarkeit der darunterliegenden Deckenkonstruktion zu berOcksichtigen.
Sonnenstoren
Sonnenstoren dOrfen bei Wind und Regenwetter nicht ausgestellt werden oder ausgefahren bleiben. Ebenso ist das ununterbrochene Ausstellen wahrend langerer Zeit zu vermeiden. For allfallige Schaden haftet der Mieter. ''
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Old 13.06.2018, 22:31
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

I read and re-read everything, there is nothing more to it.
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Old 13.06.2018, 22:53
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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The sonnenstoren are there for 7 years or so.
Demand the landlord/agency to proof how old they are.
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Old 13.06.2018, 22:58
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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Sonnenstoren dürfen bei Wind und Regenwetter nicht ausgestellt werden oder ausgefahren bleiben. Ebenso ist das ununterbrochene Ausstellen während längerer Zeit zu vermeiden. Für allfällige Schäden haftet der Mieter.
Reads: Sun blinds must not be lowered during rainy or windy weather. Also, they should not be left lowered over prolonged time. Tenant is liable for resulting damages [if those rules are not observed].

Sorry, it looks indeed like it is your fault. The automatic pull up is a gadget for your own convenience. But in the end it is your responsibility that they are actually pulled up.

PS: in case you can not type umlauts use these substitutions: ü = ue, ö = oe, ä = ae.

Last edited by aSwissInTheUS; 13.06.2018 at 23:10.
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Old 13.06.2018, 23:09
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

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Sorry, it looks indeed like it is your fault.
I.E. pay, as per my previous post.

Tom
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Old 14.06.2018, 07:11
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Re: Help with storm damage question - urgent

They may even claim an act of god.
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