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  #21  
Old 24.07.2018, 13:55
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article

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Social life is individual. I had Manchester and Liverpool on the doorstep, so was going to gigs 2 or 3 times a week.
I worked nights at a club with live bands as stage manager, so 5 nights a week on average.

Tom
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  #22  
Old 24.07.2018, 13:57
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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I moved here at 27, the social life here was far better than in the US then.

Tom
Yes, but that was then

I'm not the good ol' times type at all but times have changed extremely the past decades specially in that respect.
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  #23  
Old 24.07.2018, 14:47
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

What I have witnessed is the following: if the spouse is smart and lay up a plan to get a job or change careers, and put an extra effort to learn the language, then she/he will have no problem in adapting to Switzerland. If on the other hand the spouse refuses to look for a job, even if it's in another area, and does not study the language, then she/he will probably have a depressive life.
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  #24  
Old 24.07.2018, 15:13
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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I'm not the good ol' times type at all but times have changed extremely the past decades specially in that respect.
For the worst.

Tom
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Old 24.07.2018, 16:37
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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would you agree or disagree with this article about Switzerland being a difficult place for the expat partners:

https://www.nzz.ch/wirtschaft/die-sc...and-ld.1404296
I don't know. What does it say?
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Old 24.07.2018, 16:55
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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What I have witnessed is the following: if the spouse is smart and lay up a plan to get a job or change careers, and put an extra effort to learn the language, then she/he will have no problem in adapting to Switzerland. If on the other hand the spouse refuses to look for a job, even if it's in another area, and does not study the language, then she/he will probably have a depressive life.
That's an over simplification

- The Swiss might not want your skills
- You probably won't have mother-tongue Swiss German
- Non-Swiss folk with careers might have *different* ideas: face it, change is not something that comes easily here

No matter how hard you look for a job, or learn the language enough to be able to communicate, it can be tricky.
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Old 24.07.2018, 17:12
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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I don't know. What does it say?
I am not a pro in German, but the title got my attention: once again losers expats having problem integrating, wait a sec, this time they talk about their partners having problems integrating. The article contains facts reflecting the scale of how much is being done by the local firms in CH and the kanton Zug to help the educated partners with the German language, with the Swiss way of the CV structure and etc., as the result more than 70% of the expat partners land the desired job! Well done expat partners! Did I get wrong: the title is no t reflecting the substance of the article....
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Old 24.07.2018, 17:25
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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For the worst.

Tom
Yeah, well, the others see this differently.
But it sure is strange to live in between close-minded parents and a close-minded younger generation.
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  #29  
Old 24.07.2018, 18:25
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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That's an over simplification...

No matter how hard you look for a job, or learn the language enough to be able to communicate, it can be tricky.
There's a 4th issue that comes to my mind, and that's certain professional qualifications and experience being non-transferable.
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Old 24.07.2018, 19:16
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article

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We can debate now for days if one needs to integrate in order to lead a fulfilling life and Id argue that for short to mid term expats the answer is simply "no". I cannot really understand the "expats" who live for 15 years in a country without a basic understanding of the local language... but for a few years is that totally normal and ok.
Yes, I agree. If one is here for a year or two, going to all the work of re-working oneself to "become as Swiss as possible" might seem like an unnecessary strain.

The difficulties seem to increase, though, whenever that 2-year, fixed term, definitely-going-home-again-afterwards assignment gets extended by another 18 months, and then another year and so on. Over and over I've seen spouses of expat employees (and their children if they've been attending an international school) suddenly sitting up one day and realising that they're facing living here for another ten years or more, and some important things they wanted to do are that much less accessible because they have not done the work to become part of the local world.

Also, the expat bubble can get tiring when one is forever meeting the new arrivals who themselves are on the periphery of society, and then having to bid farewell to the next round of those who are leaving.

Outside of the bubble, and with the local language, one at least has a chance of making friends with others who live here permanently, and that helps to feel like one belongs and, truly, one can, more and more, in a way that is not possible in the bubble.

The the parts about being able to settle in better if one learns about how things work in Switzerland, learns the local language, etc. make sense to me.

This paragraph surprised me:
Die Erfolgsquote bei der Stellensuche des Spouse Career Center liegt laut der Geschäftsführerin bei 60%, wobei sie stark von den möglichen Arbeitspensen der Kandidaten abhängt. Personen, die Vollzeit arbeiten könnten, fänden durchschnittlich in 70% der Fälle innerhalb von ein paar Monaten einen Job.
Roughly: According to the manager of Spouse Career Center around 60% of job-seekers who use their services to find employment succeed in getting a job, and 70% job-seekers who are willing to work full-time find work within a few months.

A mere few months? Really?
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  #31  
Old 24.07.2018, 22:58
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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There's a 4th issue that comes to my mind, and that's certain professional qualifications and experience being non-transferable.
I think there might be another issue, 5th: Try to write how things are done here and wait for all those suggestions saying how it should be done better. Why? Aside of non-transferable qualifications, even in transferable ones there might be non-transferable attitudes at times. There is a phase that newcomers might skip in their eagerness. Patient observation.

Last edited by MusicChick; 24.07.2018 at 23:30.
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  #32  
Old 25.07.2018, 12:43
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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That's an over simplification

- The Swiss might not want your skills
What prevents a spouse that is not working to get new skills?

Still, if you look at the federal statistics office reports, there are many areas where job vacancies are simply not fulfilled due to lack of available labor. So unless the spouse have some very useless skills, CH is far from being the worst place to look for a job.

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- You probably won't have mother-tongue Swiss German
The spouse of a friend moved to Geneva with a business degree and previous experience on hospitality management but no French. In that industry French is a must and because of that she couldn't find a job. She took an intensive French course for 6 months and applied for many jobs as she could. Long story short, she ended up changing careers to a more dynamic industry and after 3 years she is now a manager.

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- Non-Swiss folk with careers might have *different* ideas: face it, change is not something that comes easily here

No matter how hard you look for a job, or learn the language enough to be able to communicate, it can be tricky.
"Failure isn't fatal, but failure to change might be."


In my own company we are most "career changers" in the sense we didn't do this same job before. So, yeah, it's possible if you have skills that are transferable.
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  #33  
Old 25.07.2018, 15:19
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Re: Do you agree or disagree with this article [Switzerland difficult for expat partn

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In my own company we are most "career changers" in the sense we didn't do this same job before. So, yeah, it's possible if you have skills that are transferable.
As a 'career changer' myself, I've had 3 careers in the UK, with professional qualifications in each, so I'm far from being adverse to change, and positively love a steep learning curve.

Just to give one example, I've worked as a the manager of a 100 room hotel in the UK. On the continent, the minimum requirement for this role is a degree in the subject, which is a 3yr course. I always knew this as my trainer for the role had gained her qualifications in Paris. We moved here on my OH's 18mth work contract which has been repeatedly extended.

The juggling point for many trailing spouses is, at which point in my partner's employ, is it worthwhile commiting to a degree course plus language courses up to C1/C2 standard?
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