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  #101  
Old 18.11.2019, 21:44
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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A villa full of Hello Kitty! Fantastic!
you misunderstood: Tom's spare room if for art. The Hello Kitty room is the guest-room, currently home of his daughter who returned to Switzerland and probably got the hint that she should find her own place soon.


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I think this bit certainly applies:

The oil tank in OH's very old family home is not secluded. It's as you described from your childhood above - a cellar that is easily accessed and where they store wine and have a washing machine.
Yes, exactly as I said.
The house I lived in as a child was under "Heimatschutz" (nope, not homeland security as the dictionary suggested ..... guess in the States nothing is old enough to be put under "Heimatschutz", so they don't need a word for it?).
The newer rules do not apply to those but later on it was not possible to build like this anymore.

Let's face it, the time that house - and probably your OH's also - was built, there were not oil-central heating available. In fact, the one I lived in still had a tiled stove in the living room, fed from the kitchen and with a openable bit above the stove to heat the upstairs.
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  #102  
Old 18.11.2019, 22:30
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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you misunderstood: Tom's spare room if for art. The Hello Kitty room is the guest-room, currently home of his daughter who returned to Switzerland and probably got the hint that she should find her own place soon.



Yes, exactly as I said.
The house I lived in as a child was under "Heimatschutz" (nope, not homeland security as the dictionary suggested ..... guess in the States nothing is old enough to be put under "Heimatschutz", so they don't need a word for it?).
The newer rules do not apply to those but later on it was not possible to build like this anymore.

Let's face it, the time that house - and probably your OH's also - was built, there were not oil-central heating available. In fact, the one I lived in still had a tiled stove in the living room, fed from the kitchen and with a openable bit above the stove to heat the upstairs.
No, houses with historical significance are protected, even in the US, and despite the fact they might only be a few hundred years old.
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  #103  
Old 18.11.2019, 22:52
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

Currently I would build a pillow fort and take a week's worth of snacks and books in with me.
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  #104  
Old 19.11.2019, 13:38
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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...the new room was essentially illegal as it in effect increased the living space beyond the max permitted m2.
I never thought about that. I guess I have to go to my local Rathaus and find out. WTF.
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  #105  
Old 19.11.2019, 14:03
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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I never thought about that. I guess I have to go to my local Rathaus and find out. WTF.
And if they say no? What are they saying no too?

You're not going to get extra people moving in are you?

Who's going to check anyway?

I'm really worried now (not) as our kids sometime sleep in our basement (we have a room with a radiator and a small window) and they like crashing down there with their friends.


We didn't put the radiator in there.
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  #106  
Old 19.11.2019, 16:48
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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And if they say no? What are they saying no too?
I don't think they can or would just say "no", but rather "bring the plans, we need to send an inspector, you need to get a permit, and we'll increase the value of the house which means higher taxes".

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Who's going to check anyway?
True, but I'm like that. I'm a guest in this country, I have to play by the rules.

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I'm really worried now (not) as our kids sometime sleep in our basement (we have a room with a radiator and a small window) and they like crashing down there with their friends.
I have ANOTHER room like that in my basement, which is marked as hobby room in the plans, but the tank is not only marked as tank room, but also outlined in green, as the Heizung room is.
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  #107  
Old 19.11.2019, 17:09
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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I never thought about that. I guess I have to go to my local Rathaus and find out. WTF.
You can calculate this yourself. You need to know the ratio of land use to liveable space for your lot. Take your lot size and then multiply it by this figure.

This doesn't mean you don't need a permit, it just means you won't exceed the allowable m2. This figure normally includes heated rooms with windows. So cellars don't count.

The official m2 of your house should be on your building insurance documents and the document from the registry office.

A lot of tradespeople may tell you not to bother getting a permit. If you decide to make a window, for example, you will likely need permission as the house will look different from the outside.
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  #108  
Old 19.11.2019, 17:21
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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I don't think they can or would just say "no", but rather "bring the plans, we need to send an inspector, you need to get a permit, and we'll increase the value of the house which means higher taxes".
I'd be interested to see how you get on.

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I'm a guest in this country, I have to play by the rules.
I play by the rules too. I was playing devil's advocate.
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  #109  
Old 19.11.2019, 18:52
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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You can calculate this yourself. You need to know the ratio of land use to liveable space for your lot. Take your lot size and then multiply it by this figure.

This doesn't mean you don't need a permit, it just means you won't exceed the allowable m2. This figure normally includes heated rooms with windows. So cellars don't count.
Phew...I'm in the clear there then. My land is 622 square meters, and the Ausnützunsziffer in my zone is 0.4. In theory I could build a whole new level ! But I'd love to add a window, cellar or not I want a little bit of natural light and air in an indoor gym.
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  #110  
Old 19.11.2019, 19:56
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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Currently I would build a pillow fort and take a week's worth of snacks and books in with me.
I was going to say a small home gym or office, but I like this idea better!
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  #111  
Old 19.11.2019, 21:19
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

Since we are discussing Ausnutzungsziffer...

One of the 'gotchas' in the example in my previous post was that the house was in an Ausserbauzone - not a typical residential zone. The house was built before current zoning regs came into force; when they did, these houses were entered capped at whatever the m2 was on date X, with a possible one time addition of 30%, which in this house had already been done. So despite the property being 4500m2, the house was limited to 85m2. The current owner had turned all the non-living spaces into living spaces, making it appear that the house was around double the allowable size.

Stooooooopid me, I opened Pandora's box by asking my due diligence questions. Or dodged a bullet, depending on one's viewpoint.

---

And an FYI that is sort of on-topic: One should be aware that there are also other measurements that come into play: Total full stories allowed, max building height from the ground, Fristhöhe (max total building above and below ground), max length of building, setbacks to the property lines, etc.

tl;dr: It's complicated.
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  #112  
Old 20.11.2019, 09:36
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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One should be aware that there are also other measurements that come into play: Total full stories allowed, max building height from the ground, Fristhöhe (max total building above and below ground), max length of building, setbacks to the property lines, etc.
Yeah, I read all 30 pages of my Gemeinde's Baureglement, which establishes not only what you mentioned, but also things like what % of the house can be built on the basement, and % that can be built on the attic, how to calculate built volume, and a fairly long list of etc. It was a bit of a hassle to FIND the Ausnützunsziffer. It was not in any insurance document, but actually defined by zone in the Baureglement, so I had to look up my house in my Gemeinde's Zonenplan (which doesn't have street names !!!).

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  #113  
Old 20.11.2019, 09:39
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

a droid room
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  #114  
Old 20.11.2019, 09:44
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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Phew...I'm in the clear there then. My land is 622 square meters, and the Ausnützunsziffer in my zone is 0.4. In theory I could build a whole new level !
That's what we've got. Not sure what the thinking was behind it and haven't done the sums so not sure whether knocking down and starting from scratch would have been much more expensive.
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  #115  
Old 09.05.2020, 17:24
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

Update. Finished the new floor, window and door are installed, ceiling is installed, cables are already in the walls. Now I have to do the Putz, and at last vinyl floor.

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  #116  
Old 09.05.2020, 17:36
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

Do you know what you will do with it?

Good job, btw!
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  #117  
Old 09.05.2020, 18:01
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

Looks great, Caleb, and in these days of social distancing, a home gym addition is an excellent idea!

(On another note, when one of these "guest" threads has a new post added and shows up in the "New Posts" listing, it makes me a lil bit sad - am missing the contributions of some of those "guests".)
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  #118  
Old 09.05.2020, 19:08
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

We have a tanning bed, some vibrator thing, several hundred works of art, a double bed, and my home office.

Tom
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  #119  
Old 09.05.2020, 20:03
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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Update. Finished the new floor, window and door are installed, ceiling is installed, cables are already in the walls. Now I have to do the Putz, and at last vinyl floor.

Looks great. Why did you decide on vinyl ? I am just curious.We went for a different option.
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  #120  
Old 09.05.2020, 21:01
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Re: What would you do with a spare room?

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Do you know what you will do with it?
A gym. You can kind of see in the pic a bike and a Power Plate. More to come when it's finished.

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Looks great. Why did you decide on vinyl ? I am just curious.We went for a different option.
I didn't really, it's my idea right now. What I did do already is I raised and levelled the floor with self-levelling compound (there was a 30mm difference between the deepest point and the highest point on that slab). I thought that vinyl on top is a good choice as: 1) it won't get ruined by moving gear, pushing weights on the floor, maybe a few drops of sweat, etc 2) it's ridiculously cheap and 3) it's very easy to remove afterwards if I ever want to repurpose the room or upgrade the flooring to decent wood.
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